Good for Sole Fettling ?

[Winton Applegate]

Well first I saw the hardness files then these.
I don't own a set but have always been curious and this brought up the subject again for me.
Are these good for plane fettling or not aggressive enough or what ?

And these TTC guys have every thing . . . left handed calipers anyone ? I have never seen those, ever, and I been really scoping out calipers from many sources lately.

[Christopher Charles]

My soul could use a good fettle. Oh, you said sole...

[Bob Woodburn]

I can't quite tell if you are kidding, but here's a serious answer.

I bought a couple sets of these from some other machinist supply outfit 10 or 15 years ago. Mine were made in India. They don't hold an edge (sharpened at about 95 degrees) for more than about 3 to 5 minutes of scraping plane soles and you have to be quite fastidious at putting that edge on perfectly to get that. You will literally spend more time sharpening than scraping.

The standared recommendation of the backyard Sunday afternoon scrapers is to grind the end of a hand file to the correct shape. I finally bought a couple small bars of carbide and using a diamond wheel and hones got a good enough edge for me.

Probably the standard real hand scraper is the Anderson. Other serious amateurs and professional machine tool rebuilders (who are scraping cast iron flat surfaces for a living) tend to use power reciprocating scrapers such as Biax. There are occasional reports in the WWW of converting reciprocating sawzalls and such but I imagine these are partly folly.

Hand scraping plane soles is arduous, dirty and pretty involved (relying on meticulous inking and spotty and reading marks correctly). I've done about a dozen Bailey soles. It's a good mental and physical workout but I think based on the amount of post-scraping pain I was destroying my elbows, shoulders and neck, and had too many headaches from it.

There is a rich literature in print and on the WWW that you would definitely want to make use of before seriously taking up this aspect of the hobby.

As an aside, I noticed some years ago one of the more active and knowledgeable hand scrapers in the metal forums scraped a couple of #4 or #5 Baileys and put them on Ebay at a remarkably modest price (given the skill and effort involved). I can't remember if they didn't sell or they sold for a price no different from an unscraped equivalent plane. As I recall they were scraped at an accuracy of something like 20 or 40 points per square inch.

[george wilson]

I have a Biax,but be prepared to spent about $2500.00 for the power scraper PLUS a bunch more for the required carbide blades. Then,you need a diamond lapping machine to sharpen the scrapers,which need a very fine lap to put on a sharp enough edge.

Those hand scrapers are for professionals(so are the Biax's). You'd be advised to just flatten the soles with sheet abrasives stuck to a surface plate made of granite,like many others have been doing for a long time.

You'd find t very difficult to accurately scrape around edges and around the throat of your plane. Probably you'd end up ruining a plane or several before you get good enough. And,as said,it is hard,dirty work. Your hands will possibly end up looking like refugees from the Blue Man Group. That Hi Spot blue quickly can get everywhere,including on your clothes,so it can contaminate everything in your washing machine. This MIGHT precipitate a dirty look from your wife!! It's oil based,and not easily gotten rid of. Hangs on like grim death! I use the stuff. Take my word for it or be at your own risk. Winton,better stop trying to lead guys down the path to divorce!! I never recommend anything that I do not have a long experience with.

As for the left handed calipers,I am left handed,and use right handed calipers just fine. That those left handed calipers are good for is measuring SHORT work that is right up against the lathe chuck,without removing said work,risking putting it back and being out of running perfectly true. I do have a left hand caliper reserved just for that use. Otherwise,I see no need for them. And,personally,I HATE digital calipers. They only measure to a half thousandth. You can interpolate an analog caliper to 1/4 thou easily. With the digital screen,you are stuck with what it says to 1/2 thou. AND,they need batteries. If you don't frequently use them,every time you pick one up,it may need a new battery. STARRETTS are well known battery eaters,even though they are not cheap. I don't know if they ever solved that problem. Lastly,I don't trust Chinese electronics to hold up on relatively small devices like calipers. I never could keep my Jet wet wheel grinder going. Too many problems with cracked thin-as-a-beer can connecters. It is still in new condition and stopped running after a few hours' use. Then,after I fixed it,it quit again after a few more uses. David gave me his Tormek,and that is what I use if I need a wet grinder.

[Winton Applegate]

. . . tell if you are kidding, but here's a serious answer.

No I was entirely serious. I have seen these referred to in machining books but have never had the opportunity to see or use one first hand.

Thanks Bob !

[Winton Applegate]

Speaking of adapting sawsalls
I just bought one of these

to use specifically as a rusty chrome polisher. I can't really use a rotary tool or belt polisher. Small wire wheels die fast and scratch the chrome.
I made this “attachment/tool bit” for it and will be making another that will be narrower made from either or a similar length of bicycle tire or rubber hose. It is to get into narrower spaces and will be similar in size to my fore finger.

Interestingly enough, not that I would make a power cast iron bed scraper, I note that the stroke length of the Biax is 0 to .8 inch. The stroke length of my little one handed saws all is .5 inch so right in the middle there as far as stroke length.

The steel wool for my chrome polisher is better than the Scotch Brite pads for not scratching the chrome.
I have just finished the pad and have not put in any serious time with it. At first I didn’t have the rubber pad on there so the performance wasn’t great. This pad is fairly soft so I don’t expect much but recently I hit on the idea of the bicycle tire tread and that may prove more durable.

At first I bought a Multi Master but the pads for those are proving to not be very useful for the old rusty chrome polishing. I won’t bore you with the details.

Ha, ha
In the process of hunting down an on line photo of the type of chrome rust I am attempting to band aide (not the light stuff but the "this ought to be thrown away but I think we can fix it up a little and make some money kind of pretty bad rust" I found out I should be using aluminum foil in stead of steel wool so live and learn
anyway
what was this thread originally about ?
. . .
oh yah scraping and power scraping . . .

[Winton Applegate]

George,
Thanks for the insights.
Sounds like not the way to go for plane soles.

Those hand scrapers are for professionals(so are the Biax's)

But George I AM a Professional

[george wilson]

A professional WHAT?

[Winton Applegate]

A professional WHAT?

Clark's a professional food additive designer.
The crunch enhancer cereal varnish he designed was up for food additive of the year.

[Noah Wagener]

a fellow named Scott Wynn wrote a book on handplanes and he suggests combining the scraping and sandpaper lapping plate methods. The lapping is the spotting so you do not have to mess with the blue.

Is that from Christmas Vacation?

[Noah Wagener]

Winton, Don't you use Lie Nielsen planes? Aren't they flat enough?

Are your parents anglophiles? What a name.