Anyone heard from David Weaver?

[Bruce Haugen]

Tsk, tsk, here's to unstucking you, Winton:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9qjHMwL-dj4

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Daniel,

Nobody has said all opinions are equal....only that every member has a right to state an opinion in agreement or disagreement and be treated respectfully.

I hope as a society we haven't become so bigoted as to think someone doesn't have a right to have and state an opinion that goes against our own. I hope we haven't become so narrow-minded, so self-righteous to believe it's okay to publicly attack those with whom we disagree or suggest their opinion be removed because it differs. If we don't respect the right of others to have a differing opinion, how can we expect to have our own differing opinion respected in a discussion?


But none of this has anything to do with David's decision to leave SMC. He left by his own wishes......he didn't burn any bridges.....and he can return by his own wish.......

[Frank Martin]

I too hope David returns here. As for this forum, there are things I don't personally agree as well, but over time one learns to sift through information and form their own opinion. I also have to add that while sometimes it feels there are some restrictive moderation decisions this is still the best forum I know for woodworking information in part because of the moderation itself to keep thngs focused.

[Harold Burrell]

Nobody has said all opinions are equal....

That's right. Everyone knows that my opinions are more equal than other's.

[Daniel Rode]

I agree that everyone should be able to state an opinion. Moreover, I think discussions that include a variety of opinions are the most interesting and fruitful. I believe that courteous but assertive debate is what brings ideas with the greatest value to the forefront.

I'm confident I never mentioned public attacks or removing divergent opinions. In fact, that is the complete opposite of what I would prefer.

No one should be "attacked" for expressing an opinion but by the same token, those ideas should be fair game for debate. If one wants to opine without rebuttal, a blog might be a better venue than a forum. Baring rigorous debate, weak and incorrect ideas have as much weight as the strong and vetted.

Daniel,

Nobody has said all opinions are equal....only that every member has a right to state an opinion in agreement or disagreement and be treated respectfully.

I hope as a society we haven't become so bigoted as to think someone doesn't have a right to have and state an opinion that goes against our own. I hope we haven't become so narrow-minded, so self-righteous to believe it's okay to publicly attack those with whom we disagree or suggest their opinion be removed because it differs. If we don't respect the right of others to have a differing opinion, how can we expect to have our own differing opinion respected in a discussion?


But none of this has anything to do with David's decision to leave SMC. He left by his own wishes......he didn't burn any bridges.....and he can return by his own wish.......

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I agree that everyone should be able to state an opinion. Moreover, I think discussions that include a variety of opinions are the most interesting and fruitful. I believe that courteous but assertive debate is what brings ideas with the greatest value to the forefront.

I'm confident I never mentioned public attacks or removing divergent opinions. In fact, that is the complete opposite of what I would prefer.

No one should be "attacked" for expressing an opinion but by the same token, those ideas should be fair game for debate. If one wants to opine without rebuttal, a blog might be a better venue than a forum. Baring rigorous debate, weak and incorrect ideas have as much weight as the strong and vetted.

Dan,

I couldn't agree more.

I mentioned "attacking those with differing opinions or removing them" only because as a society in public that seems to be the popular thing to do these days and earlier in this thread there was a subtle hint that those who dared disagree with the popular "experts" should have their comments removed.

Personally I have averted a lot of mistakes in life by listening to differing opinions and realizing the errors in my thoughts.

[Judson Green]

Wait a minute.... You have a gardner?

This is not my sandbox. If I want to participate here, I have to work within the rules. I may not agree, but I cooperate.

However, on a personal level, I don't place too high a value on friendliness and inclusiveness. They're nice, but not at the top of my list. It's like a hug from a teacher. Nice, but it won't help me learn algebra. Maybe I'm old fashioned (or just getting old) but I prefer to trade in information and I enjoy spirited (but polite) debate. Being told I am wrong is not mean. I should put on my big boy pants and either respond with facts or accept that I might actually be...

...wrong.

In today's society, we seem utterly focused on developing personalities akin to hothouse flowers. All opinions must be respected and all points of view are equally valid. Everyone gets a ribbon, a pat on the back and are told they won. We deign to tell anyone they are wrong. Correction is taken as demeaning rather than instructive. I'm no psychologist but I'd guess that leads to a sad combination of arrogance and ignorance. Intellectual entitlement, perhaps.

My doctor spent many years studying and practicing medicine. My gardner knows a lot about plants and lawn equipment. Asking my doctor for advice on feeding a hibiscus may or may not yield good results. Asking my gardner about that lump under my arm might lead to catastrophic results.

All opinions are not equal.

[Daniel Rode]

I wish! I have to prune my own shrubs and mow my own grass. I was actually parroting an anecdote I heard years ago.

Wait a minute.... You have a gardner?

[Harold Burrell]

I wish! I have to prune my own shrubs and mow my own grass. I was actually parroting an anecdote I heard years ago.

Wait a minute...You have a parrot?

[Sean Hughto]

I wish! I have to eat my own crackers. ))

[Moses Yoder]

You are absolutely and unequivocally wrong about all opinions not being equal. An opinion is based on how we feel about something. Any good psychologist would tell you without a doubt all feelings are equally valid.

This is not my sandbox. If I want to participate here, I have to work within the rules. I may not agree, but I cooperate.

However, on a personal level, I don't place too high a value on friendliness and inclusiveness. They're nice, but not at the top of my list. It's like a hug from a teacher. Nice, but it won't help me learn algebra. Maybe I'm old fashioned (or just getting old) but I prefer to trade in information and I enjoy spirited (but polite) debate. Being told I am wrong is not mean. I should put on my big boy pants and either respond with facts or accept that I might actually be...

...wrong.

In today's society, we seem utterly focused on developing personalities akin to hothouse flowers. All opinions must be respected and all points of view are equally valid. Everyone gets a ribbon, a pat on the back and are told they won. We deign to tell anyone they are wrong. Correction is taken as demeaning rather than instructive. I'm no psychologist but I'd guess that leads to a sad combination of arrogance and ignorance. Intellectual entitlement, perhaps.

My doctor spent many years studying and practicing medicine. My gardner knows a lot about plants and lawn equipment. Asking my doctor for advice on feeding a hibiscus may or may not yield good results. Asking my gardner about that lump under my arm might lead to catastrophic results.

All opinions are not equal.

[Art Mann]

I have just struggled through every last post on this thread this morning and I am glad to see the conversation has lightened up a bit. I'm not a hand tool woodworker so I don't know much about the situation or the person who left the forum. It has been an interesting and thought provoking read though.

[Mike Henderson]

You are absolutely and unequivocally wrong about all opinions not being equal. An opinion is based on how we feel about something. Any good psychologist would tell you without a doubt all feelings are equally valid.

An opinion, in my opinion, is not always based on how we feel about something. It may be based on our understanding of the facts and circumstances of the event, circumstances, etc. Another person may be able to offer factual information about the underlying basis of our opinion, and based on those facts, we may change our mind (opinion) about the "something".

"Feelings" are generally not a good basis for an opinion about something, especially something that can be tested scientifically.

Mike

[Frederick Skelly]

You are absolutely and unequivocally wrong about all opinions not being equal. An opinion is based on how we feel about something. Any good psychologist would tell you without a doubt all feelings are equally valid.

I think I understand what you're saying, but I differ with you on this point: just because one has a right to hold/express an opinion, doesnt make his/her opinion equally VALID. Depends on topic, context, training, experience, etc. (The doctor/gardner example, above illustrates what Im saying.)

[Keith Outten]

There was a time when the most brilliant minds on this planet proclaimed that the earth was flat.
So much for experts and their opinions.

I've found that its best to listen to as many opinions as possible before deciding on a course of action, therefore every person here is afforded the same status. Most of the time the most valuable voice here at The Creek is the one who asks a question, without them there would rarely be any conversation only arguments among the experts.