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Thread: LV or LN low angle jack

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    29
    ahhh I'm sure I'm just splitting hairs at this time. They both seem to be really good planes but I like the aesthetic of the LN better but the veritas seems more functional. Seeing how theres a lateral and depth adjuster, PM-V11, and ability to switch between different planes if I decide to get more, which I probably will.

    Bench height won't matter too much at this time since Im using the planes to build a work bench. Going to buy a couple black and decker workmates to plane the wood for my work bench.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Suffolk County, Long Island NY
    Posts
    1,150
    I consider the LN one of the finest looking planes they make, but when I purchased a LAJ I went with the LV... Why? mainly because of the stout handle and the norris adjuster. Turns out after really using the tool for hours those ended up being the two things I dislike about the plane - I tend to mess up the lateral adjustment more than I'd like, and the handle was just uncomfortable after 15+ minutes of use (replaced with Bill Rittner's Stanley type)

    What I didn't expect about the LV, but ended up being my favorite aspects are: 1) the increased width (very handy in some cases); 2) The excellent quality of the blade (very long lasting edge!); 3) The absolutely fantastic manufacturing precision, I mean the level of machining quality was better than I ever expected at the very reasonable price they sell it for. (just like every other Veritas branded plane I've purchased since)




  3. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Silicon Valley, CA
    Posts
    989
    Toothed blade was great for flattening workbench with reversing grain and knots.
    (although I would recommend going the easier route and ensuring your grain is plane-friendly from the outset)

    Matt

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    9,467
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Choi View Post
    Hey guys,

    So I decided to take a plunge and buy a new low angle jack plane. Im torn between the LN and the LV. LN has a nicer aesthetic and I personally think it looks nicer but the LV has multiple angle blades. Is there any other differences between the two? I know that LN uses baileys design while LV uses norris. But I'm not really sure what that means.
    Hi Peter

    Realise that the LN and the LV bevel up jacks are two different planes. The LN is the size of a #5, and the LV is more of a #5 1/2 (a little less, but the analogy applies). The LN uses a 2" wide blade and the LV a 2 1/4" wide blade.

    They have different methods of adjusting the mouth opening. The LV is more intuitive and ergonomic.

    The blade adjustment systems is different - the LN is fixed fore-and-back only, while the LV has a Norris-type adjuster that includes side-to-side .... nevertheless, this is not a deal breaker as I would use a small hammer to adjust sideways as well.

    The LV (only) has side set screws to (re)position the blade - and this is worth the price of entry alone. It makes setting up so much easier.

    The LN is prettier. Buy the LN if this is important enough. For some it is.

    The LN has a hotdog handle available as an option. The LV does not. Because of this I built one for my LV. See here: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMad...ck%20pics.html

    The irony is that I no longer recommend it - build it if you must, but there is an easier way. Just hold the LV BUF correctly when shooting, and it is comfortable and very controllable: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furnitu...sCompared.html





    The handles of the LN and LV are different. This has been the source of much controversy. I have switched back-and-forth over several years between the original LV handles and LN/Stanley-style handles made by Bill Rittner. Here they are ...




    I have a thing for ergonomics. During the recent examination of the LV Custom planes I explained why I have returned to the original style handles

    http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolRev...omPlanes3.html

    Here is my LV LA Jack ..



    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Last edited by Derek Cohen; 04-24-2015 at 9:27 AM.

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Cohen View Post
    The irony is that I no longer recommend it - build it if you must, but there is an easier way. Just hold the LV BUF correctly when shooting, and it is comfortable and very controllable: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furnitu...sCompared.html
    Derek, I read your excellent article but Im not where I can try it out just now - and I cant quite visualize what you're teaching. Am I to apply both downforce AND the slight forward force you recommend at the thumb?

    As always, thanks for teaching me.
    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  6. #21
    Me too. Thanks Derek.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    9,467
    Quote Originally Posted by Frederick Skelly View Post
    Derek, I read your excellent article but Im not where I can try it out just now - and I cant quite visualize what you're teaching. Am I to apply both downforce AND the slight forward force you recommend at the thumb?

    As always, thanks for teaching me.
    Fred
    Hi Fred

    There is an addition that I will add to the explanation.

    Firstly, the single best addition to a shooting plane, or a plane for shooting, is actually to the shooting board, per se. This is a side fence (or "running fence", the name I used in an article): http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMad...tingBoard.html

    You see it here with the LV LA Jack with a hotdog ...



    The side/running fence holds the plane against the sidewall and then all that is needed is forward movement (push the plane).

    Now the hotdog is not really necessary since the round finger holes provide enough grip on their own when you pinch them simultaneously from these indents and underneath the lever cap.

    If you do not use the side fence to hold the plane against the sidewall, then the lower (four) fingers need to do so ... push down with the thumb and across simultaneously with the other fingers.

    Now it is time to read again the section in the article I linked to earlier.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Camden, SC
    Posts
    140
    LN and/or LV buj will do you a fine job but I would buy the Lv. I believe it is a better user although the Ln looks better. Unless you have a specific need for it, I would not buy the jack rabbet; a fine plane and I own one, but I would buy the Lv buj first because it is a better daily user. As to the type of iron, marry this to the sharpening system you use.

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    29
    I took a plunge and bought the one from lv with the pm v11 blade. It was 50 dollars more than ln CUZ lv charges me tax and shipping. But then again if it doesn't feel right I could return it. Would just hold it and see how it feels and paying another 65 dollars or so for the handle/tote would make it so much more than the ln and at that point I would go ln.

    also is oil stones or water stones recommended for the pm-v11 blade?

  10. #25
    Congrats, Peter. Welcome to Club Slippery Slope.
    The PM-V11 wokrs fine with my Shaptons (water stones). I don't notice that they are significantly harder to sharpen than A1.

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    windsor, New York
    Posts
    34
    I own the LV low angle jack and its a nice plane, I like it alot but there are a few things you should be aware of. as for the set screws on the sides, they seem to be practically usless, mabye I dont know how to use them but if you tight them enough to prevent the blade from shift you cant get the blade back in after sharpening without loosing the screw thus negating the whole point of them, its just one more thing to adjust so i stopped even bothering with them. as for the blades i bought all three and really only use one that i reground to 40 degrees anyway, I primarily use it for smoothing and shooting and that angle works just as good as any other for both, but i will say it is convenient to have a 50 degree blade for very figured wood prone to chipout. the only problem i have with the plane is that when shooting the way my hand fits the plane often pushes on the cap screw and slides the blade out of alignment. a hot dog type hand that LN has would probally solve this issue however.

  12. #27
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    BC, Canada
    Posts
    58
    I have no problem with PMV11 on my arkansas stones or water stones. It takes maybe a few more strokes than O1.

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Longview WA
    Posts
    27,347
    Blog Entries
    1
    as for the set screws on the sides, they seem to be practically usless, mabye I dont know how to use them but if you tight them enough to prevent the blade from shift you cant get the blade back in after sharpening without loosing the screw thus negating the whole point of them
    It may be the set screws are only a guide to help center the blade after sharpening. None of my planes have set screws and sometimes getting the blade centered is a little extra work. Not enough for me to drill and tap the sides of my plane to see if a set screw would help.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Rural, West Central Minn
    Posts
    218
    I have both, the LN and LV low angle jack planes both are great and in my inexperienced hands I can't distinguish a difference. I will say that the set screws on the LV are kind of a pain and I don't use them either. I think because the sides of the blades are not vary smooth the set screws tend to restrict the movement of the blade in and out also in removing and inserting the blade. The set screws have to be loosened and readjusted each time. Maybe there's something I don't understand or maybe I just need some guidance???
    Chet

  15. #30
    you cant get the blade back in after sharpening without loosing the screw thus negating the whole point of them...

    Unless there is a defect there (e.g. the screw moves by itself after you set it right), it means you have overtightened the set screws. All my planes (Veritas) have set screws and none of them behave in the manner you described after every sharpening of the blade. My school has more Veritas planes and again, no students have ever reported having the issue you reported.

    Overtightening, not just the set screws, is a common mistake people make with regard to planes. I once had to resort to use a pair of pliers to loosen a knob on a plane and that should never be the case.

    This is how to tune up the set screws: place the blade in position. Tighten one set screw till it touches the blade and then tighten the opposite screw until it touches the blade too. Now, back track one of the screws so very slightly.

    Try it and you should not have the same problem you have been suffering from.

    Simon

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