Laser tipping the work life balance...

[Brett Tossell]

Hi there. Happy cinco! Not the best question - as it's not technical - more of one for a beer in hand chat rather than here - but I thought I'd toss this out there...

More of a lurker than a poster for the most part - but because of shared knowledge here and elsewhere online, I've been operating a laser out of my garage as a side gig for the past year or so. Thanks to you folks, I've been happily cutting and engraving all manner of things, but my laser stuff has taken an unexpected turn - and I'm at a loss for what to do.

I'm more of a maker. I really enjoy small micro-controllers (arduino, raspberry pi etc...) and making parts that enable me to build toys and gizmos to teach my daughter things. The laser works great for that, and on the side - we do stuff for her school, and oddball things for the kids in the neighborhood - it's mostly for play. I have done a few things for other folks - after seeing a neighbors gun collection I developed a couple of custom gun accessories, and apparently I stumbled on a little niche product - but this wasn't a focus - simply something that bought more materials, and kept a few beers in the fridge.

Well - the gun accessories thing went better than anticipated - and I had a friend who would take them to gun shows and sell them. Each unit had my contact info on it, and that lead to more calls and sales - and I know there's a business there, as folks still track me down. I did try going to the gun shows with the intent to maybe one day set up a stall and sell - but it's just not me - my time is full, and my weekends are precious. I've got a full time job - one involving extensive travel - and I love my free time for my family - so this just isn't a fit for me now. That said - my phone still rings with folks calling to buy something my heart's just not into turning out one after another. I enjoy more the thrill of the design process, sharing that with my daughter, and creating something new vs. simple mass production.

Anyway - If I was at a different stage of life - if I was retired or unemployed - or not my current skewed work / home life balance - I'd chase this thing down, as I think there's a business there, as despite my efforts at neglecting it - customers manage to find me. So I'm at a crossroads, and not sure what to do. I'm not looking to leave my career - I love what I do for work - but there's this growing side gig that part of me feels bad when I ignore an opportunity to make a few bucks and despite my continued neglect - folks still call looking to buy.

So that's the guts of it. You guys are smart. ...and I'm sure some of you have faced this type of thing before. What do you suggest? What did you do?

Thanks for your time and your input.

[Bert Kemp]

You might share your Idea with us and we can take some of the load off for ya I think it has happened to most of us, we spent a lot of time cutting things and then someone like one of what we did and it kinda grew from there. Some went big some stayed small. Some just let it die.

Hi there. Happy cinco! Not the best question - as it's not technical - more of one for a beer in hand chat rather than here - but I thought I'd toss this out there...

More of a lurker than a poster for the most part - but because of shared knowledge here and elsewhere online, I've been operating a laser out of my garage as a side gig for the past year or so. Thanks to you folks, I've been happily cutting and engraving all manner of things, but my laser stuff has taken an unexpected turn - and I'm at a loss for what to do.

I'm more of a maker. I really enjoy small micro-controllers (arduino, raspberry pi etc...) and making parts that enable me to build toys and gizmos to teach my daughter things. The laser works great for that, and on the side - we do stuff for her school, and oddball things for the kids in the neighborhood - it's mostly for play. I have done a few things for other folks - after seeing a neighbors gun collection I developed a couple of custom gun accessories, and apparently I stumbled on a little niche product - but this wasn't a focus - simply something that bought more materials, and kept a few beers in the fridge.

Well - the gun accessories thing went better than anticipated - and I had a friend who would take them to gun shows and sell them. Each unit had my contact info on it, and that lead to more calls and sales - and I know there's a business there, as folks still track me down. I did try going to the gun shows with the intent to maybe one day set up a stall and sell - but it's just not me - my time is full, and my weekends are precious. I've got a full time job - one involving extensive travel - and I love my free time for my family - so this just isn't a fit for me now. That said - my phone still rings with folks calling to buy something my heart's just not into turning out one after another. I enjoy more the thrill of the design process, sharing that with my daughter, and creating something new vs. simple mass production.

Anyway - If I was at a different stage of life - if I was retired or unemployed - or not my current skewed work / home life balance - I'd chase this thing down, as I think there's a business there, as despite my efforts at neglecting it - customers manage to find me. So I'm at a crossroads, and not sure what to do. I'm not looking to leave my career - I love what I do for work - but there's this growing side gig that part of me feels bad when I ignore an opportunity to make a few bucks and despite my continued neglect - folks still call looking to buy.

So that's the guts of it. You guys are smart. ...and I'm sure some of you have faced this type of thing before. What do you suggest? What did you do?

Thanks for your time and your input.

[Scott Shepherd]

Hire someone to work part time to make the items on the laser.

[Ross Moshinsky]

Bad: You're treating this as a side business. Let's say you'd want to partner or sell the idea. Are the margins right? Is the idea really marketable? Can people really make money pursuing this? For example, if you're selling these things for $5 and the cost on them is $2.50 before labor, unless you're really moving merchandise, is that worth it to anyone?

Good: You have a product people want. I have no idea what kind of demand you truly have, but developing a product people call you about has some value. Maybe under the right hands they can turn it into something really profitable.

Basically, I think you're in a position where you're going to either have to give away/sell for cheap the design to someone, let the side business die, or invest time into developing things. For example, I'm always interested in making money. The issue is, if you tell me you sell 5 of these a month by word of mouth, who's to say if I invest time/money into marketing/website, I'm going to turn that 5 into 500 or 5000? Is this business regional? Could I successfully run this business out of the North East where guns are less popular?

[Mark Sipes]

Go on Shark Tank and sell your idea. So far I don't see anything to sink my teeth into... and of course you don't want to share just in case it's a million dollar idea. If you don't have a trade mark, license, patent etc then it is just going to get copied by someone who wants that second one for a friend that you are not willing to make.

I take it the item is personalized. if not, then just get a firm to make them for you and sell them on line.


.

[Dave Sheldrake]

What do you suggest? What did you do?

I ended up with a lot of lasers and a headache that lasts 18 hours a day, the guys above have it pretty much nailed, farm it out on a tight NDA and sell them finished, don't work yourself into the ground trying to do too much yourself, the richest guy in the graveyard is still dead

[Kev Williams]

Like others above have suggested, maybe see if you find some help with fabbing and selling your wares...

I've been engraving guns and parts of, and for guns for 40 years. It's a pretty fickle business. Not one "we'll sell a million of 'em!!"
prophecies have I known to pan out. One gun company had a certain gun market all but cornered about 7 years ago. I was
engraving daily for them until they broke down and bought their own engraving machine...
I got bankruptcy papers from them about a month ago.

About 6 months ago I was barraged with RFQ's from a local gun
dealer about my prices for tool engraving and laser etching various parts for various guns. I was told their customer was
more than pleased with my pricing, and to brace myself, that orders of 50 to 500 parts per week were likely...
Haven't seen a single part yet.

And, I have a $600 bag of useless SS tags for a gun company who assured me they'd be needing 1500
parts per month. After 300 parts, crickets...

Obviously my experiences with the firearms business will vary from others, however, I'm pretty
sure my experiences are fairly typical...

That all said, I think you're wise to stand your ground with your current career. It may be that your product
will beat the odds, and could make you even more money. But you're in a great position at the moment,
where you can likely teach, and pay, someone to do what you're doing. Nothing beats a business
where everyone else does the work while you reap the benefits...

[Tim Bateson]

I don't like most of these ideas.... As someone who does a lot in the gun industry & will soon retire (from day-job) and depend on this business full-time, I say give me the idea and I'll send you a licensing fee for every one I sell?

[Jim Coffee]

What do you suggest? What did you do?

Help your daughter start a business with this product as the core.

-Jim Coffee-

[Brett Tossell]

I think my minds made up, and that said - I sincerely appreciate the time, thought and effort each of you put into your responses. You all brought your wisdom to bear, and I'm grateful.

I've got a couple of folks locally interested (and if you're that curious - feel free to private message me.), and I'm going to sell it for a buck or two to buy some supplies to focus more on why I got into lasers, 3d printers and whatnot in the first place - this was meant to be something to do with my daughter, and to help her learn that tinkering and building is cool, and fun. To me, (and hopefully her) building something new is a whole lot more satisfying than simply buying things. For the money making side - I have a career that I enjoy - and I won't consider giving it up, as its a passion of mine, and it brings in a comfortable income I don't want to jeopardize through division of attention.

I will say a couple of your remarks hit the mark - Dave's comment really resonated: "I ended up with a lot of lasers and a headache that lasts 18 hours a day", and Kev's remark of "That all said, I think you're wise to stand your ground with your current career." Those comments help to make my decision clear. Mark's comment of "If you don't have a trade mark, license, patent etc then it is just going to get copied by someone who wants that second one for a friend that you are not willing to make." - reminded me of another business I sold years ago - where countless hours and money was wasted in legal battles over patents... That was time and money that I never got back - and only the lawyers won. That's not a road I want to go down again. I'm not certain that patents really protect you anymore, they simply publish your ideas for less scrupulous folks worldwide to leapfrog you with, and you end up spending more on lawyers. I'm not saying it's all bad - I just think the patent system has some pretty big faults, and high costs to play with many opportunities to lose your shirt when you're a small fish.

Jim - to respond to your comment: "Help your daughter start a business with this product as the core." - Her interests lie elsewhere. She's been around guns, out to the range with me, and seen me in the garage working away filling boxes, and these aren't things she loves. She and I really enjoy playing around making new things - little gadgets, and models of the animals she enjoys. One day, I'd love to help her start a business of her own - and I'll be the hardest working and lowest paid employee she'll ever know - and I'd bring a garage full of tools... but for now - I want her to focus on being a happy eight year old. She can be the businesswoman later if she chooses.

Again - thanks to all who participated. I'm glad that I'm not alone - and that I have the perspective of the group to illuminate the roads ahead. You've given me the insight to do what's right for us. I'll get back to making little gadgets and animal models.

All the best.

bt

[Dan Hintz]

One other suggestion I often pass along to people who believe they've got the next great idea... just because you sold a few and people LOVE the idea, make sure you truly understand the market. Markets get saturated a LOT faster than most realize, and after you've gone all in, THEN is a bad time to realize your market just dried up.