Pole Barn

[Todd Burch]

On my journey to creating a new workshop, I need another building to keep my equipment out of the weather and to house the sawmill too. I'll build a 40X40X12 pole barn. I'm going to do it myself to save some money. My goal is $10/sf ft, but I suspect it might be closer to $15/ft. Still, not bad for a 1600/sf clear span building with 2 doors @ 10X10 and 1 door @ 20X10, plus a man door and a window or tow. Roof will be 6/12 pitch.

This is my work in progress so far. Still have to add stiffeners across the lower chords of the trusses, cross bracing on the outer 3 trusses on each end, and diagonal bracing between the trusses and side walls.

SketchUpScreenSnapz007.jpg

Before I start digging, I'll have a designer review it. (And, feel free to comment yourself too!)

[Jamie Buxton]

You build the trusses on the ground, right? Then you lift each one on to the walls, right? How do you do that -- a crane?

And what about the poles? Are they just pressure-treated lumber stuck in the ground, or are there footings under them?

And do you worry about hurricane winds in coastal Texas? What prevents this style of building from flying away?

[Mike Heidrick]

Call around. Amish brought in the building and erected mine on site for $10.18 a sq/ft. 2560 plus a 12X24 porch. It has 3 man doors with 9 lights, 4 36X50 windows, two 14X14 garage roll up insulated doors, complete bubble wrap roof and walls, trusses 4' on center, double 2X12 truss carriers, 8' on center 6X6 laminated posts that are pressure treated to about 4-6' above ground (just in dirt but on cement) then transition to reg wood, 2X8s PT grade boards (at ground), 2X6 wall girts, rat guard, 36" wainscotting, 1' overhangs all around, 12'X24' porch (with ceiling) with wrapped dutchman posts. Pretty sure that is all I spec'd. They did it in about 6 full days of working 12hour days and that was leaving early one Friday and working one hour the next Friday.

no electrical, no concrete, no openers

S&L Builders in Indiana - prob too far for them to build for you but have your Amish call them if needed

[Todd Burch]

You build the trusses on the ground, right?

Yes. Lay out sheets of plywood and attach blocks to them to make a jig.

Then you lift each one on to the walls, right? How do you do that -- a crane?

They'll be pretty heavy. 2X12 top chords, 2-high stacked 2X6s for bottom chord, a 2X8 for one of the web verticals, and the rest 2X4s. 1/2" ply gussets on both sides. Bottom chord 2X6's are spliced too.
A boom pole might do it, but a sky track / tele handler would be easier (@ $350/day). With 12' walls and a 6/12 pitch, they will have to be lifted 22'+ to clear the top of the walls.

And what about the poles? Are they just pressure-treated lumber stuck in the ground, or are there footings under them?

6X6's and 6X8's, 16' to 26' long. Pressure treated to .60 cca. Dig holes about 4.5'+ deep. Pour concrete in hole for a pad to the 4' depth. Let cure. Insert pole and tamp earth around it to the top. Another option, to resist uplift, is to drill 2 through holes through the post sides at the bottom, about 4"-5" up and insert 9" to 12" long rebar through to make a plus sign. Then, pour another layer of concrete to surround those, and then tamp the earth on top to fill the hole.

And do you worry about hurricane winds in coastal Texas? What prevents this style of building from flying away?

I'm really not so coastal any more. I'm about 120 miles from the gulf coast. Most building manufacturers have been calculating about 5 PSI snow load and 90 MPH winds for my locale. The house I'm living in now lost a lot of it's shingles back in '08 during hurricane Ike though, but I suspect due to a small, localized tornado though. During Ike, sustained winds were recorded here at 38 MPH with peak gusts to 51 MPH. Not so bad, really.

[Todd Burch]

Call around. Amish brought in the building and erected mine on site for $10.18 a sq/ft. 2560 plus a 12X24 porch. It has ...

That's a pretty good price. No Amish around here that I know of though.

For the metal buildings I've spec'ed out, the bids I've been getting range (so far) from $9.13/sf through $13.21. The low end bid had framed openings, but no doors, no overhang, shallow pitch, and comes in a kit.

No bids come with any dirt work, concrete or electrical.

Best bid so far (National Barn Company) is $11.90/sf delivered and erected, with sliding doors, but the 20X10 door is on a gable end and the 10X10's are on the side walls. Not a big deal I guess - it's a square building. For another 60 cents/sf, I can insulate the roof and walls.

I don't know… $11.90/sf is starting to sound pretty good…

[Mike Heidrick]

They will move the doors wherever you want them. My guess is less than 1K to upgrade to roll up door.

I added the site prep to the work my concrete guys bid. It was his guys that did it.

I did the trenching of electric to the site after site prep but before the building showed up.

[Tom M King]

Unless I had my own Lull, I'd stick build that roof. Why does it need to be that heavy in Texas?

[Martin Wasner]

My new building is going to be about $40 sq/ft. I don't know how I could make it much less than that.

[Jim Andrew]

Question, are your trusses @ 5' oc? Morton buildings uses about that heavy a truss on 12' centers. And in Kansas, more snow load. Don't understand why you want such a steep roof. Metal roofs are very slippery. My steel building is 4/12, and it is so slick, only the screw heads keep you from sliding off.

[Todd Burch]

I'm not a builder and not an engineer. (Wish I were both.) After my designer reviews it, if it can be lightened, (AKA, requires fewer materials…) I'm OK with that. I was referencing the truss design handbook and pole barn plans put out by Midwest Plan Services. I have the poles and trusses designed based on their 8' centers, but have placed them on 5' centers. For the header across the 20' opening, it have it designed to be built out of 2X10s, 2X4's and 1/2" ply. Here's an exploded view:

SketchUpScreenSnapz008.jpg

I would love for my trusses to be strong enough to support chain hoists that could lift, oh, say 4,000 lbs, but I'm pretty sure they are not even remotely designed to that level.

[Todd Burch]

Don't understand why you want such a steep roof. Metal roofs are very slippery. My steel building is 4/12, and it is so slick, only the screw heads keep you from sliding off.

Mostly for aesthetics. I don't plan on being up there a whole lot.

[Todd Burch]

My new building is going to be about $40 sq/ft. I don't know how I could make it much less than that.

Tell us about your building. Does it use pole construction?

[Ed Labadie]

6-12 pitch, been there done that, won't go there again. You CAN'T stand on it. Putting the ridge cap on requires being tethered off......the chance of severe injury overrides aesthetics any day for me.

If you are not using the commercial tie plates (like purchased trusses), I don't think you can make them strong enough to prevent collapse on a free span like a pole barn. You will need to check the material, at a certain width a truss goes from SPF to southern yellow pine for strength.

I've built trusses before, 60' wide, it's no fun. (these weren't for a free span).

IMO, go with 4-12 pitch purchased trusses, 4' OC and use 2x4's for purlins.

Ed

[Tom M King]

How about steel in one of the headers, and put your 2ton lifting point there. I'd go with Ed's plan too of buying trusses, if I didn't stick build it. I can walk on a 9in12 pitch metal roof, but only after a good rain has washed all the dust off, and then with a safety line coming over the other side, but I have very flexible ankles, and don't wear boots-no fun to build though. You have to clean the bottom of your shoes often. A thick foam rubber pad makes it easy to work on almost any pitch roof if you will mostly be sitting down. I like 5 in 12 if easy building is the priority-not hard to walk on, and don't have to bend over any more than necessary. I've been building stuff myself for over 42 years.

One addition on our house has metal on a 9in12. The front side is snap together standing seam, and the back facing the woods is screw down. I can't understand why they get so much more for the standing seam, but it is my preference if the cost doesn't matter, or worth it for the way it looks. We get calls every year to find the problem with screw down metal roofing that has developed leaks. I would only put that on if I run in every screw myself. I've also put copper on a roof with a 8 in 12 pitch main roof, but it had a complete wrap around porch of 4 in 12. It required a LOT of fabrication. I can't post a link here without ruffling feathers, but if you want to find my website, look at the roofing page for pictures of the copper roof.

[Todd Burch]

Well I broke down and ordered a pole barn kit from the local lumberyard. 40x40x12 with a 6/12 pitch. Just the kit worked out to be around $7.35/SF.

Dirt work will run about $6700. I'm putting the building in a low spot, so will need about 380 yards of select fill. ($4200 for dirt). Labor for pad and dirt work will be $2500, but that includes a lot of other grading to fix existing issues and grading to reroute water to go around the pole barn.

Erection cost - not sure of yet. One bid was $5500, but I expect the other bid to be closer to $3500.

Now, just waiting for the ground to dry up a bit.