Should I try to lap and one more question about plane rehab.

[Lasse Hilbrandt]

First picture I made an arrow towards a small rivet that holds the lateral ajusterarm on my Record # 4. I want to remove the arm in order to be able to lap the frog on the surface where the blade is put. But can I get a new rivet somewhere ?

nitte1.jpg

Next picture I made arrows towards the resting points for the frog on the plane bottom. The four restingpoints are very rough in the surface, not milled like on the frog. I used an ink pen to paint the resting points and then I pressed the frog on the points while pushing forth and back, to see how much surface area that connected. I dont know if you can see it on the picture but the frog only scratched on the few tops of the resting points meaning that there is not much connection. I think I can lap it with carborundum powder and oil, but the question is, does it matter at all ?

flader1.jpg

Maybe I should mention that I already bought a Veritas PM-V11 blade and cap iron for this plane.

[Mike Brady]

This will help:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYyV6IUpsYk Don't take that rivet out since it is not in the way of 90% of the frog's top surface. Was that plane sand-blasted? Everything looks quite "gritty". The attached video will help you with the tuning. Looks like you need paint, though. Tell us what you are up to and what you have done. Did the plane ever work for you? Sorry for the scattered reply but we have to know the background and the plan.

[Trevor Goodwin]

Okay I'm sure lots of other people are wondering this, what finish is that? It looks like you've covered both parts in primer? Or is that a sand/bead-blasted finish?

Regarding the rivet, I had a frog off an old Falcon plane that was shaped like a banana. Lapping wasn't going to fix it so I drilled out the lateral adjuster rivet and went to town on the frog with a ball peen. I was a bit worried about getting a new rivet, but this wasn't a 100 year old Stanley so it didn't have to be perfect. I ended up using a copper rivet my brother had from his model steam boiler build and it worked fine. I just check Mcmaster-Carr and they have domed head rivets in every type of metal you could ever need, copper probably isn't the best choice for a moving part like this. Lapping the frog is so much easier with the rivet removed as you don't have to do little sections at a time, which is not an accurate method for achieving a dead flat surface.

Regarding the frog bed, you need to be careful removing material from those points as the faces need to remain co-planer and the at the correct distance apart. Ie, if you remove too much from the lower contact point, the frog might have a gap when you screw it in because all the contact is on the upper surface. You don't need the faces on the frog and the sole to completely mate, but you want a relatively smooth surface so the frog can be adjusted forward and back without jamming.

[Lasse Hilbrandt]

The plane was rusty and lots of the japanning was missing. The blade and cap Iron was not true. I have just glas bedded it to remove the rust and japanning. The plan is to make it a very good user

[Pete Hotard]

For the resting points, I use some lapping (grinding) compound that I bought at the auto parts store. I squirt a little on each resting point, and put the frog on top, then move it back and forth until they are relatively smooth. It can be somewhat tedious but it has worked for me.

[steven c newman]

Way too many people have broken the end of a frog, either trying to remove that rivet, or installing a new one....leave it alone!

When a plane comes through the Rehab Shop of mine, I set up the beltsander upside down in the bench vise. I can sand the face flat as can be, and never hit the lever's disc. Mainly I stay towards the side of the sander. I also sand the two pads under the frog, mainly to remove the paint. A wire cup brush in the drill press will clean the pads on the frog's seat. There is also a flat area under the frog, right where it meets the mouth opening's ramp. I try to sand it flat -er, and usually smooth out the very rough casting there. Gives it a dull knife's edge..

BEFORE you paint the base.....put a few drops of light oil into every threaded opening. Keeps the paint OUT of the threads. Then, just run a bolt in each hole after the paint is dry.

Biggest question I have concerns the new cutter assembly....too thick of an iron, the tab that changes the depth settings will NOT reach the slot in the chipbreaker. Of course, one COULD change the depth with a small hammer onto the end of that new$$$ iron).......

[Curt Putnam]

If the frog sits solidly, without wobble, I'd leave it alone and try it out before committing to unnecessary boring labor.

[Chris Hachet]

Way too many people have broken the end of a frog, either trying to remove that rivet, or installing a new one....leave it alone!

When a plane comes through the Rehab Shop of mine, I set up the beltsander upside down in the bench vise. I can sand the face flat as can be, and never hit the lever's disc. Mainly I stay towards the side of the sander. I also sand the two pads under the frog, mainly to remove the paint. A wire cup brush in the drill press will clean the pads on the frog's seat. There is also a flat area under the frog, right where it meets the mouth opening's ramp. I try to sand it flat -er, and usually smooth out the very rough casting there. Gives it a dull knife's edge..

BEFORE you paint the base.....put a few drops of light oil into every threaded opening. Keeps the paint OUT of the threads. Then, just run a bolt in each hole after the paint is dry.

Biggest question I have concerns the new cutter assembly....too thick of an iron, the tab that changes the depth settings will NOT reach the slot in the chipbreaker. Of course, one COULD change the depth with a small hammer onto the end of that new$$$ iron).......

That drop of oil trick is a good one!

[Phil Mueller]

FYI, Paul Sellers just added a plane rehab video on YouTube....worth a look.

[Robert Engel]

The most important part is from below the rivet to the mouth.
All I've ever done is just lap the part below the rivet.
They are generally flat enough all it takes is a little work on a diamond stone or similar.

The resting points are critical so you want them matching up as perfectly as possible.
I generally use a file on the plane bottom and lap the mating surface of the frog on a stone.

As long as the blade/frog and plane/frog are in good contact you can adjust any discrepancies out.

[Shawn Pixley]

I am no plane restoring expert, but can offer a practiced perspective. If I were to remove and subsequently replace it, I would make a new rivet out of brass.

I think you might have made more work by Glass Blasting than you will save.

[david charlesworth]

As I think someone has already said, the frog surface does not need to be perfectly flat.

Chipbreakers, (except Stay Set), Bend the blade so it touches frog at top and bottom.

It is important to check that bottom is flat in width. This ensures blade is well supported with no voids to encourage chatter.

Hundreds of student planes have been tuned in my workshop.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth