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Thread: Oklahoma Homestead 40x80x12

  1. #1

    Oklahoma Homestead 40x80x12

    Hey guys,

    I'm in the early planning stages for a workshop that will be used as both a woodworking shop and a metal fabrication shop. I'm trying to figure out how much lighting I can afford to put in and have a rough floorplan with 21 - 4 foot 4 bulb high bay fluorescent fixtures (at about $60 a piece) in a 40 x 70 work area. I know I could probably put in some more, but what do you guys think as far as a starting point for this plan? Oh, and it will have 16 foot ceilings and 2-10x12 garage doors and 6-3x4 windows in it.

    Thanks!

    shop w lights.jpg
    Jeff

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
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    Hatfield, AR
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    961
    I think there are lots of threads discussing lights and "is it enough" and "bright enough", yada yada. I'm in a 40x80x16 and there are only 8 8ft fluorescent lights and I can see just fine. Maybe I could see a lot better - but I'd rather buy more tools than lights as I don't see a problem (see what I did there? - twice) I did add a 4' fluorescent over my face frame table. IMO - I think your shop will be plenty bright.

    Where about in OK are you located? My home town is Tahlequah.
    Last edited by Justin Ludwig; 01-20-2016 at 6:35 AM.
    -Lud

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Ludwig View Post
    I think there are lots of threads discussing lights and "is it enough" and "bright enough", yada yada. I'm in a 40x80x16 and there are only 8 8ft fluorescent lights and I can see just fine. Maybe I could see a lot better - but I'd rather buy more tools than lights as I don't see a problem (see what I did there? - twice) I did add a 4' fluorescent over my face frame table. IMO - I think your shop will be plenty bright.

    Where about in OK are you located? My home town is Tahlequah.
    I will be just north of Claremore on Rt. 66. We are going to build the shop first and live in it while the house goes up.

    Thanks for the perspective on your shop. My eyes aren't as good as they used to be so the more light the better I think.

    Jeff
    Jeff

  4. #4
    It doesn't look like enough to me. Lighting can be tough, especially when the fixtures are that high.
    What kind of bulbs are they?

    When I did a shop expansion my electrician sold me on 8' T8 fixtures and got them for me for about $40 ea. They take 4 - 4' bulbs and have 2 ballasts.

    Jeffrey's suggestion will not be adequate for a shop, IMO. There is a big diff in lighting for living and lighting for working.

    In my 1200SF shop, I've got 16 of these fixtures about 10' off floor. For comparison, in your shop that translates into at least 30 lights.
    Its about right, but I wish I had more light, especially over the workbenches.
    In this case you can hang a fixture 5 or 6 feet above the bench.

    I agree with you there's never such a thing as too much light in a shop!!

    If you've got more than one access to shop, 3 way switches are quite a plus.
    Last edited by Robert Engel; 01-20-2016 at 8:30 AM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    Upland, CA
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    1,077
    I would use these:
    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-MVH/202193185
    6 bulb with two ballasts. Wire your basic lighting to light 3 bulbs each and then the other 3 bulbs on another switch or even several so you can add light in sections. That will let you run each half on a 120v breaker. They will run on 240v or 208/277 if you have 3 phase power. HD and some others have had these at a better deal on a pallet of 20.

    You need to keep the 3 rows but I think you would find 6 in each row to work well. Where are your benches going?

    Sylvania 21681 if you want 4100K 85cri , 21660 if you want 5000k 81cri, 21659 if you want 6500k 81cri. All those are 97 lumens per watt. I just paid $98 including freight for 30 21681 for my own shop. Can't get any decent deal except on boxes of 30.

    Are you going to have any skylights? If so, can't see you wanting to run all 6 lamps during the day at all.
    Last edited by Greg R Bradley; 01-20-2016 at 9:57 AM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    41,843
    Honestly, since this is a new build...go LED up-front. IMHO.

    I recently added (6) 4' LED fixtures to my shop to replace aging fluorescent fixtures and couldn't be happier. And they are less likely to get broken when something goes "flying" in the shop, too.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker View Post
    Honestly, since this is a new build...go LED up-front. IMHO.

    I recently added (6) 4' LED fixtures to my shop to replace aging fluorescent fixtures and couldn't be happier. And they are less likely to get broken when something goes "flying" in the shop, too.
    I may just do that Jim. I just saw some "Lights of America" LED's for $36 at Sam's Club. I read some of your thread where you had bought some Feit's I think? It makes sense and at that price, it's doable. I think I'll buy one at Sam's and test it in my current garage.
    Jeff

  8. #8
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    Jun 2010
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    We would need more information on the intended use to make that decision. With the basic assumptions that you are building this shop for fairly regular use and wanting a certain amount of clearance, it would be unlikely that any LED lighting is the best choice for your High Bay General lighting. It is even less likely that the Sam's Club fixtures would be anything other than a horrible choice for what I'm seeing as your most likely use. One of two of those could be a good choice if you are backing off on the High Bay Lighting and need something extra over a few workbenches.
    They could even be a good choice for a storage room or something like that. LED lights are likely to make sense in the bathroom and possibly the office.

    Are you using this most days? Lights on for hours at a time? I'm also assuming with an 8' wide door that you weren't planning on mounting lights at the full 16' height. I was just guessing you weren't driving any big equipment into the shop.

    For the intended use I'm guessing at, you were on the right track. Let's put it this way. How much do you think people with big warehouses analyze this?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg R Bradley View Post
    We would need more information on the intended use to make that decision. With the basic assumptions that you are building this shop for fairly regular use and wanting a certain amount of clearance, it would be unlikely that any LED lighting is the best choice for your High Bay General lighting. It is even less likely that the Sam's Club fixtures would be anything other than a horrible choice for what I'm seeing as your most likely use. One of two of those could be a good choice if you are backing off on the High Bay Lighting and need something extra over a few workbenches.
    They could even be a good choice for a storage room or something like that. LED lights are likely to make sense in the bathroom and possibly the office.

    Are you using this most days? Lights on for hours at a time? I'm also assuming with an 8' wide door that you weren't planning on mounting lights at the full 16' height. I was just guessing you weren't driving any big equipment into the shop.

    For the intended use I'm guessing at, you were on the right track. Let's put it this way. How much do you think people with big warehouses analyze this?

    After reading this Greg, you have some valid points. I had planned to test with a light meter the output at the 15-16' distance, which will be the ceiling height on my building. I think I'll get one of those high bay 4 or 6 tube models and test also. I've read some positive's and negative's now on the LED stuff at the discount stores.

    The planned usage is a full on woodworking shop on one end and a metal fabrication/welding shop on the other end. I will be working in there most every weekend all day/night and some weekday hours at night. It may become a side business eventually so I want to get this right the first time. I do love LED technology, as I have quite a bit of it in the current house and it's great.

    Thanks to everyone for chiming in so far. It's valuable to hear your opinions.
    Jeff

  10. #10
    You probably already saw it but the Shop lighting tread at the top of this forum links to a worthwhile article by Jack Lindsey.

    http://www.sawmillcreek.org/content....y-Jack-Lindsey

  11. #11
    Join Date
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    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    Greg does have a good point about ceiling height. You have to take that into consideration for sure. For a shop of this size, it may actually pay for you to discuss things with a lighting specialist at a real supply house. It could be useful to you.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  12. #12
    Join Date
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    I agree! Those lights are very dim compared to some options out there for sure. You have super tall ceilings - This is not a 12' ceiling (much less 8'-10') you are dealing with.

    I think you are really wanting some T5HO lights. Some may say T8HO but taking into account your 3200sqft and a rough stab at 400 sqft per fixture you are looking at a minimum of 8 six bulb fixtures at about 3 amps each which will be a couple circuits. I am actually running 8 now on two circuits in a 40X64X16 in two rows of 4 ea and plan to add two more rows of four lights on a total of 4 lighting circuits. It is super nice having good lighting and I want no issue seeing anywhere. I am running Howard ballasts/fixtures purchased from corslighting on ebay in jacksonville IL using the 5000k lamps. I really like the light and so has everyone that has been in there. Cost is about $110 ea with bulbs shipped.
    Glad its my shop I am responsible for - I only have to make me happy.

  13. #13
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    My original post was assuming you would mount the lights at 12-14'. If you wish to mount them at 16', that does open up the 4xT5HO as a reasonable option. They basically have the same light out of a smaller area so they glare more at lower heights. Being a bit smaller and lighter they are easier to mount. At 16' either is a good option. I mounted the 167 6xT8 units in the big building at 28' and they work fine at that height.

    85 avg Lumens per watt - 216 watt for 18,200 lumens: 4 T5HO using high output long life bulbs
    89 avg Lumens per watt - 192 watt for 17,200 lumens: 6 T8 using high output long life bulbs
    88 avg Lumens per watt - 128 watt for 11,200 lumens: I-Beam LED $199 at HD.

    All these are using average lumens which is after 30,000 hours of use at 12 hours per day. T5HO specs drop below 95 degrees, certainly not a problem near the ceiling around here.

    ALL of these require 2' clearance to ceiling. LED also spec 104 degree max.

    T5HO lose the ability to turn half of the bulbs on and then turn on the other half when/where you want more light. May be a big deal for some, certainly for me. Could be a huge money saver if you have skylights. OK is sunny a lot, right?

    You mentioned trying some. You probably need to try 2 mounted at your intended height and separated by your planned row distance. Pretty easy with a forklift.

  14. #14
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jefferey Scott View Post
    I will be just north of Claremore on Rt. 66. We are going to build the shop first and live in it while the house goes up.

    Thanks for the perspective on your shop. My eyes aren't as good as they used to be so the more light the better I think.

    Jeff
    That's what my Wife and I said in 1980 when we decided to build her pottery shop first, and live in it for a while. We've been here for coming up on 36 years.

  15. #15
    I just built A 50'X80'X14' new shop. My electrician had the lighting designed. I have 18- 6 bulb t-5 high bay fixtures.

    The light output is awesome. I would have went LED if there would have been rebates available to help with the cost. Unfortunately, the utility here only offers rebates on replacing existing fixtures.

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