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Thread: I put things together backwards. A lot.

  1. #1
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    I put things together backwards. A lot.

    From cutting inverted joints, to screwing and gluing pieces together backwards, upside down, and/or whatever other incorrect orientation that I didn't even perceive I could possibly mess up.

    All this, when I'm working carefully and marking my faces and orientation! At least, I think I'm working carefully.

    Now, I do this often, and as I tackle larger projects with more parts and more things to go wrong, it's becoming more and more of an issue.

    Working on my bench, I was going to add width-wise stretchers to the bottom to increase the width of the base. Glued and screwed them on backwards before realizing my mistake. Had to take the screws out and split them off. Now I have to replace the stretchers, and I have screw holes drilled in the wrong places in my legs, and I need to reglue/screw everything. Not to mention make the trip to buy another 2x4.

    Before attaching them, I remember specifically thinking "Ok - no mistakes! Is everything positioned right? Nothing's backwards right?" I double checked, and somehow, I still didn't notice that I had them backwards. I had, apparently, forgot that in flipping my table upside down, the side that was previously the front became the back. But the more vexing issue is that I specifically thought to check for that, and still, somehow, didn't notice.

    I find that marking faces and orientation doesn't help much either. Somehow, even with reference marks, I wind up putting things together wrong. Of the 4 legs that I mounted, I noticed that one of them was joined upside down from how I had originally decided to orient and marked them. It didn't matter in the end, but....

    I'm probably the world's worse when it comes to noticing these things, and making little mistakes like this. I grasp the big picture, and I can focus in and work carefully, but it seems I can't do both at the same time. I get tunnel vision when I have to be detail-oriented.

    I guess I'm a bit predisposed to this sort of thing; if anyone's familiar with psychology, I'm very much an Intuitive, as opposed to Sensing orientation. That means I naturally tend to skim over the details, and look for the big picture, essentially, and this is reflected in my every day life; I could not, for instance, tell you the color of the shirt the person who I was just talking to was wearing, or the stores or names of streets that I cross every day to work. On the other hand, I'm very good at grasping general concepts and principles, understanding how things relate to one another, and getting a "feel" for things. I can be detail oriented/focused when I need to be, as is the case with woodworking, but it's definitely a bit contrary to my natural focus. Does all that matter in the end? Well, maybe not. It just means that I have to develop certain functions that I'm not used to using, or have a natural inclination to.

    I'm sure that all beginners struggle with this to some extent or the other. But, it seems that I need to troubleshoot my work-flow, or be more systematic about things. What baffles me is not so much that I make mistakes, but that I make mistakes even whilst being under the impression that I'm working carefully and have my ducks in a row.

    Is this something that any of you struggle with, or have any procedures for beyond "marking faces and checking things before you glue them"? My problem seems to be that I'm not mindful of everything at once, so I think I need to form habits in my work flow that remedy this carelessness. Just "remembering to do X" and "being careful" doesn't work so well for me, I think. As to what those habits should be, I don't yet know.
    Last edited by Luke Dupont; 04-24-2016 at 3:43 PM.

  2. #2
    You describe my working problems quite closely!

    I recently started making full sized plans and putting the pieces on the plan to see that i have the right parts in the right place. It still doesnt always work, sad to say.

    Darrell

  3. #3
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    Perhaps your penciled in ( I assume?) orientation marks on the various parts do not stand out as well as they should. Maybe putting the orientation marks on blue tape fixed to the part will catch your eye better and you can work on getting yourself to watch for the blue tape when assembling. I do this when I have lots of parts that are very similar on something I am building. I mark for left/right, up, and upper/lower on the face side of the parts to help keep my head straight.
    David

  4. #4
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    We've all been there so your not alone. Even the best screw up and buy extra stock for this reason. I was having this same type of issue and started to plan my projects out better.

    After I figure out what I want to built and sketch out what it looks like I make a full size plan. I get the 2x3 paper and tape it together. If the project is really big I will make the side view, front left view, etc. From there I generate a cut list and list out all of the parts I need. I made a cut list that lists the final size, how many pieces, what part and what size to rough out. Ex, if you are making a cabinet you can separate it but outside case, face frame, etc. I make cut lists for each step.

    Now I get the stock and at least 2 or 3 extra boards for screw ups. Mark it out, rough cut and mill it over sized slightly. This way all of my boards are all planed to the same thickness. I even add a few extra pieces incase I screw one up. Now I cut them to size and built that particular section.

    I mark everything, top, bottom, left, right, inside and outside. If I have 4 legs I mark each one 1A, 2A, etc. I double check everything before I cut it to make sure I cut the right side etc. Everything gets dry fitted and then glued. I will even wait until other parts are done and dry fit everything together.

    You need to think in steps and it will help to eliminate mistakes. Don't feel your alone.
    Don

  5. #5
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    Yep, yep, did this tonight myself. I was putting together a little paper towel holder for the shop and I made a little recess that allowed the towel rod to pass through and then lock in on the other side. Well, now this piece is on the inside rather than the outside. I redesigned and it works great but I still end up kicking myself when it happens.

  6. #6
    I'd be surprised if most of us don't have your problem, Luke! Sometimes I'm very attentive to detail, but mostly I tend to get bored with details unless they involve something enjoyable--and stuff like measuring, marking, and keeping myself from doing something irreversible until things are in the right place isn't exactly a thrill.

    Basically I need to idiot-proof everything, no matter how simple the job. I make big thick marks all over the place with a worn thick-leaded pencil, though Don's blue tape would let me use an even more obvious Sharpie. Forget symbols and arrows; instead, I write down as much information as I need in plain English. In the case of your bench legs I might have labeled the front of the benchtop "front" and its bottom "bottom" so and a note saying "bottom" on the bottom of the legs to keep their orientation in mind. Marking all this takes time, but it's well worth getting it right the first time.

    Dry fitting your pieces, even if it's not otherwise necessary, gives me another chance to see if I've followed my own directions. In the case of your bench, you might have still ended up with extra screw holes, but at least you wouldn't be dealing with dried glue.

    You might also consider writing down your intended workflow in the form of a checklist, including boxes for checking which way your pieces should be facing. It might seem silly, but the best workflow is a routine that will ultimately become a habit that won't require any reminders.

    I also get myself to take breaks before moving on to an important step. I tend to get so involved with getting something finished that I don't notice if I'm tired, hungry, or bored enough with the details that I'm not thinking clearly. I just step back, have a drink of water or a little snack, get up and stretch, or do anything that makes me step back. It doesn't just help me work better; I end up enjoying the whole process more.

  7. #7
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    As said above, you're not alone. I'm left handed. Been left handed for 50+ years. Still to this day left is "right" sometimes. Marking things left and right just doesn't work for me. I mark everything with blue tape. And the tape stays in place from rough pieces to final assembly. Joints are marked with numbers. #1 tenon goes to #1 mortise...with an arrow on each showing the matching direction. I have messed up when I marked left/right, front/back/ etc. so everything gets numbered. And yes, sometimes something still gets miss cut.

    Don't you just love that immediate shock of disbelief when you first realize it's wrong?

  8. #8
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    I'm left handed. Been left handed for 50+ years. Still to this day left is "right" sometimes. Marking things left and right just doesn't work for me.
    I am somewhat ambidextrous. It can get real confusing.

    Marking R & L can be confusing. My current method is to have an arrow pointing up or out. I also try to mark inside my joinery so it will be covered by assembly. My preferred marking is the Greek alphabet and Arabic numerals.

    Inside Layout.jpg

    This is a pin board for a single dovetail marked 1 omega with an arrow pointing up. The arrow on the end grain points to the outside of the joint. The outside arrow is gone when the waste is removed. All the other marks are hidden inside the joint.

    Before gluing all the pieces are laid on the bench and checked for orientation. They have usually been checked with a dry fit, but sometimes it is done again before gluing. My clamps are standing by and have been checked against the work for size setting. There are also ample glue blocks close by.

    Getting parts and procedures mixed and confused is common. When I become tired or my mind starts to wonder, it is time to take a break. At times, finding a solution requires walking away from the problem.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  9. #9
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    I'm left handed,and don't have these problems. Sometimes I make a stupid mistake,but only every GREAT once in a while. Perhaps you are dyslexic?(sp? My spell check is messing with me).

  10. #10
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    I all honesty, I don't have the problem you describe. I don't know why.

  11. #11
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    Perhaps you are dyslexic?
    I know I am mildly dyslexic. It is something to take into account when I am working.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  12. #12
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    In the world of manufacturing we use a term called poke-yoke to describe the methodology for 'fool proofing', I call it idiot proofing, the design such that things only go together one-way. If you have trouble with this sort of thing, then design the joinery for example such that it only goes together one way. A prime example of this is hand cut dovetails where you make a part and then fit the next to it. You can't put this joint together backward or upside down. Offsetting things tad bit so they are not symmetrical is a key way to manage this - do the assembly wrong and it should either be impossible or so wrong that its obvious. Save the symmetrical approach for things that are truly don't care for orientation.

  13. #13
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    I call it idiot proofing
    The more one attempts to make something idiot proof the more one will encounter more tenacious and motivated idiots. DAMHIKT!

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Koepke View Post
    The more one attempts to make something idiot proof the more one will encounter more tenacious and motivated idiots. DAMHIKT!

    jtk
    Well, in this case Jim, the idiots I was referring to and proposing the poke-yoke for is ourselves

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