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Thread: How to work Black Locust

  1. #1

    How to work Black Locust

    First a quick introduction since this is my first post in this section. I have been reading here for a while as I integrate more hand tools into what has primarily been a machine driven shop. Woodworking in my vocation primarily consists of building structures/furniture that live outdoors (decks, arbors, benches, gates, etc.). Some of my work has been evolving towards minimizing steel fasteners in non-structural applications (e.g. mortise and tenon gate/door construction) and I am finding hand tools to be a better fit.

    On to the present conundrum. I have acquired some Black Locust, milled from a couple of fairly large trees that blew over onto my shop last winter.

    This wood is like nothing I have ever worked with steel knives. It dulls chainsaw cutters, chisels and plane irons so fast that I wonder if it's worth the effort (and I'm fairly stubborn). It tears out when planing with the grain, but planes fairly well cross grain. High speed steel knives seem to work best, but I'm sure those will be dull in short order. A short session with the smoother and the edge was gone.

    The grain, once revealed, is quite beautiful. Getting there is anything but a beautiful experience.

    I did a search and saw that Juan Jovey (sp?) did a workbench top using Black Locust. In the thread he indicates that it was easily milled, but my experience has been just the opposite; at least with steel cutters. I offered a burl to a wood turner friend and he declined for similar reasons.

    Since I have read both good and bad reviews on the workability, I can only assume that the difference in experience boils down to two possibilities. The wood takes on different characteristics depending on where it's grown (soil conditions), or the craftsman are using different methods.

    Is there a plane iron set up/technique that might make planing a reasonably fruitful effort on this wood?

    And if Juan is still around, it would be good to hear how the bench top has held up.

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Howdy Eric and welcome to the cave by the Creek.

    You may have the answer about the difference between a wood being easy to work or not so easy, location, location, location.

    Some species are prone to pick up silica in the soil and disperse it throughout the living tree. This spells bad news for edge tools.

    There may also be other factors to consider:

    Overall working characteristics for Black Locust are mixed: although the grain is usually straight, its high density and hardness can make it difficult to machine. Black Locust also has a moderate blunting effect on cutting edges. Responds very well to both lathe turning and steam bending; glues and finishes well.
    That is from: http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-.../black-locust/

    Looks like a pretty wood. Not sure if blades of PM v11 from Lee Valley would be of any help.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  3. #3
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    As a kid I used a lot of locust for fence posts. My experience was that it was easy to cut when green, but once seasoned was very resistant to decay and hard as a rock.

  4. #4
    Black locust is one of those tame domestic hardwoods that Derek used to tell us about. I have worked it occasionally. It is hard, but I never got the impression that it had silica in it. In general it is harder than white oak. Some oak species that are lumped with white oak are close to black locust in hardness. Hickories are generally a bit harder. Locust has nice color (the yellow gradually changes to brown) , but not as much depth and luster as our best cabinet woods.

    My guess is that you are the one dulling the tools, not the wood itself. A lot of people react to one of the harder woods by using the plane or chisel in a rough manner, which is what is hard on the edge. The edge can only take so much brutality. Think instead of working in smaller bites and using the same force that you would use for a softer wood.

  5. #5
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    In these parts they call it ironwood. It's like working with stone when it's dry and seasoned. I've seen it throw sparks when cutting it with a chainsaw. It has more BTU per cord than most firewood. It dulls anything you try to cut it with. As some have noted, it makes great fence posts.

    I'd suggest light cuts and A2 plane irons. Plan on sharpening often.
    Sharp solves all manner of problems.

  6. #6
    It’s a bow wood, so if you have long, straight-grained pieces, might want to offer it to bowyers.

  7. #7
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    I've cut it with a chain saw and almost always get sparks due to the silica in the wood. I think it is just the nature of the beast and you either put up with the difficulty or make fence posts which really last a long time.

  8. #8
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    I like it for woodturning, no more difficult that some other hard woods we use. I can't imagine enjoying working it with hand tools.

    It does make good garden stakes although I prefer Osage Orange for that.

  9. #9
    This is an interesting thread as I have been contemplating black locust for building a deck and wondered how hard it was to work. We used to cut a lot of firewood from it growing up but it was always wet. Plac out of Wisconsin sells decking materials out of it and same as the OP was thinking of it for outdoor furniture.

    Eric, if you get some stuff built I would love to see pictures.


    Bob

  10. #10
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    The best way to tell when a black locust fence post is in need of changing is to set a rock on top of it. When the rock crumbles naturally, the post needs changing.

    Black locust is a beautiful wood and is a long lasting choice for decking material. It's a bit harder to work than normal, but the experience you're having is not typical. It's definitely harder on planer and sawmill blades, but I've not experienced the extreme dulling you speak of when putting a hand plane or chisel to it. More frequent sharpenings; yes, but not instantly.
    Jeff

  11. #11
    I've turned Black Locust without any special problems and the results were beautiful. I've also worked it by hand without any difficulty though I did have to sharpen more often than normal. A friend built a strip sailing dingy hull from it though the transom and dagger board box were mahogany. It was quite heavy though the strips were only 1/4" thick. It is an absolutely beautiful boat.

    Here in NH we say that one Black Locust fence post will outlast 4 post holes.
    Dave Anderson

    Chester, NH

  12. #12
    Other than having to sharpen more often I have not had any unique problems with this....but then I like working with hickory, Quarter sawn white oak, and hard Maple.

  13. #13
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    It is supposed to last 10 years longer than STONE!

  14. #14
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    Jeff has it wrong. Don't worry about the stone. When the soil around the post rots away it is time to replace the soil. The post will still be there.
    Jeff, I'm just jerkin' your chain.
    Bill
    On the other hand, I still have five fingers.

  15. #15
    I'm not sure I can think of another wood that elicits such a varied opinion as to the work-ability. To be fair, my tentative stance began when we bucked up the fallen trees and may be effecting my view of its work-ability. I have never sharpened so many cutters in such a short period of time and I'm fairly certain I saw/heard sparks at one point. Hard to be sure with all that orange saw dust flying around. I have never been puzzled by a species/specimen of tree, but I find this wood quite unusual (not quite sure what to think of it).

    I am curious how it would perform as a decking material. It seems very sustainable. There are a hundred sucker shoots coming out of every root and stump from the area where these trees came down; it propagates its own groves. I came across an article and apparently it is being farmed in eastern Europe for outdoor wood projects. Its rot resistance is legendary. I have not seen it sold here in the Pacific NW yet.

    I'll sharpen the plane iron and give it another go, although this particular specimen may be better left to carbide cutters. I was initially planning on making a large raised garden bed with it. It is an uninteresting wood in its rough sawn state. When I exposed the grain a little I was surprised. That strange orange saw dust I first encountered had evolved into a beautiful face grain. There are a lot of Honey Locust here, but strangely in over 25 years of working outdoors I am not sure I have ever seen the inside of a Black Locust.

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