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Thread: CU300 or C3-31

  1. #1

    CU300 or C3-31

    I have decided to pull the trigger on a combo machine and narrowed my choice between the Minimax CU300 or the Hammer C3-31. I wanted to see if anyone has recently been through the same decision process and if so what way the went and why.

    My thoughts so far from all the posts and reviews I've read is the Minimax is a bit more robust and heavy duty. I've heard the Hammer is more comparable to the Minimax Lab300. Minimax is more expensive. Hammer has better value with the great pricing on the anniversary package. I've seen lots of positive reviews on the Hammer.

    I'm a serious hobbiest so it won't be in a professional shop. But do want this to be a 20 plus year tool.

    Amy words of wisdom would be greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Phoenix AZ Area
    Posts
    2,505
    I have a Felder 700 series saw / shaper so I can't comment on the two options you are considering. What I will say is that I got opinions and read all I could on the forums for a few months before I bought and I talked with Felder and SCMI and got consistent advice on a few things.
    1) Spend once, get the options you want and cry once. Many pointed out that most used machines are shorter on features because owners ordered a more stripped machine first and then later upgraded to one with the features they wanted all along. I spec'd mine pretty well but wish I had sprung for the digital fence stops and rip fence. I can easily live without but adding after the fact is either way more expensive for factory, or a compromise if you build your own.
    2) Get a slider that can cut an 8 foot panel with room for clamps on the ends if you use sheet goods. This one was easy for me as I knew I wanted to cut sheets length wise. Lots of owners who regretted getting a shorter one first.
    3) Service and support are key. I've had great support from Felder and I also own a 1970s SCMI jointer and I got some fantastic and quick help over the phone on how to tear it down. Called the US sales office and they said one field service tech who was around in the 70s would know and they would have him call me. Literally a few minutes later he called and it turns out he didn't know but he knew another tech who would for sure know. Sure enough within a few minutes Italian tech #2 called and knew exactly what I needed. BTW, both tech has really Italian names like Guido and Giuseppe
    - I chose to upgrade to power raise/lower for the shaper and saw because with a combo there would certainly be times I would have to tear down a shaper setup to cut something. this was a good call.
    - I got variable speed, love it, especially for the router spindle.
    - I chose a slider that's about 9 ft long
    - I chose the wider crosscut carriage, good call
    - I upgraded to an Aigner shaper fence, expensive but I would do it again.
    - I got a 1 1/4" spindle because there are tons of used but good 1 1/4" shaper cutters on ebay. I also go a high speed router spindle, with my machine I can run up to 22,000 RPM.
    - I have added air clamps (Mac's Clamps) and they made the machine so much easier to use.
    - I ordered a ripping shoe and I've never put it on the saw.
    - I ordered an eccentric clamp and I hate it, the wood shifts when I clamp
    - research parallel cutting guides on the web, Brian Lamb makes a nice one. With this you can get amazingly accurate rips.
    - I got a micro adjust rip fence, good add.
    - I got a remote start on the end of the slider, very convenient. I don't know if SMCI offers that.
    - I wanted Dado capability. SCMI has that on one line but not the others.

    The Felder owners group is a yahoo forum that has tons of advice on how to use a euro slider.
    Last edited by Joe Jensen; 08-13-2016 at 2:29 AM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Houston, Texas area
    Posts
    1,308
    I'm in the same position as you Jeff. FWIW, the Hammers have a lot of extra cost add-ons that are included standard in the CU300, so you do need to do a little work to price apples to apples, and then to determine if you want the 'free' bundled stuff on the CU300, such as the mortiser, mobility kit, scoring unit, second short crosscut fence,... So fully spec out both machines before doing the price comparison.

    Conceptually, I really like the Tersa knife system on the CU300.

    One of the factors that is tipping me towards the CU300 is the persistently excellent and practical pre-sales support I've received from Erik Loza. I expect Erik will still be helping me out after the purchase. He's tireless, and has been working with me for about a year, which shows great patience. It's hard not to like the guy. His daily presence here is a testament. The only reason I haven't bought the CU300 yet is my building won't be ready for ~ 6 more months.
    Mark McFarlane

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Coppell, TX
    Posts
    908
    I've had my C3-31 Comfort for a few weeks now. In short, I'm very happy and the machine has met or exceeded my expectations in terms of quality, accuracy and ease of use. Changing from one tool to another is quick and straightforward. The deciding factor for me was the substantial discount available right now on the C3 due to the anniversary year.

    Moving from a cabinet saw to a slider has some significant differences in methods of work, but even after a few weeks of use it feels safer and easier to use.

    I looked at both brands and, like Joe and Mark commented above, spent a lot of time researching and reading owners opinions. My conclusion is you can't go wrong with either brand - which of course makes it a tough choice

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,688
    I agree that both are excellent choices. I'm a MiniMax guy since that's the direction I went long ago and the people like Erik and Sam have treated me very well over the years. No regrets on my purchases. I can't speak to the CU300 specifically since I went slider + J/P based on my shop's physical constraints, but I've seen them up close and personal a number of times and know they are of the same excellent nature as my own choices. And yes, they are "well equipped" standard from the factory. I've also been around a number of Felder/Hammer machines and they are also great tools.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #6
    Hi Jeff,

    I have B3+A331. Very happy about the purchase. They are well built, joy to use, and worth every penny.

    Having said that we, seasoned hobbyists, have already learned, often in a hard way, that "you get what you pay for."
    These machines are something we'd use more than 10 years and the time spent for hobby should be something very pleasing.
    I don't think you can't go wrong either way. I just feel it is usually a good idea to stretch your budget little bit more than your initial plan for something you'd use a long time.

    For me, B3+A331 was QUITE a stretch but now I'm very happy with my decision. If I had more $, I'd have gone for a CU300 (heavier) or a Felder (heavier and bells and whistles).

    My suggestion is to go for an outrigger, if you have a enough space.
    For the slider, I chose 78", which doesn't take as much space as I thought. I haven't encountered a situation when this length is not enough.
    I use sheets only occasionally and do the initial cutting at the purchase as my car can't carry the full sheet anyway.

    Oh, also, I would factor in the proximity to the service centers or personal connections. These companies have much more personal relationships with customers. After few years of use, you can ask service visits. You may order tooling and equipment. You may have some issues, or want to ask how to adjust the alignments. I live in Maryland and Felder is only 1.5 hours away. I benefited it a lot right from the delivery to a recent service visit. Their employees have relatives live nearby. Once you can develop personal relationships, things can go only better. Just my 2 cents.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    10,304
    I notice that Felder is currently advertising a sale price on a C331 in the Deals & Discounts section of SMC.

  8. #8
    Thanks for the feedback. Some great information. I like those Lamb parallel cutting guides. I have wondered how you get consistent accurate and reportable rips with a slider. Seems like a great solution.
    Jamie. What sale on the C331 did you see? Can you provide a link?
    I think I'm leaning towards a CU300 but the only thing that's holding me back is I do think it's more expensive. Even with options considered. With the Hammer anniversary package it's about $1,500 less then the CU300. And I'm pretty sure the asessories are fairly comparable.

  9. #9
    Happy CU300 owner here. Almost 10 years now.

    These type of machines are sold by the pound. (heavier is better)

  10. #10
    Actually scratch my last post. I took a closer look and the Minimax is closer to $2,200 more. I am leaning toward the Minimax but that just is a lot of dough! Especially if the machines are comparable.

  11. #11
    If the 2 grand difference is the longer slider with outrigger it's worth every penny. Mistake without it.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    10,304
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Finazzo View Post
    ...
    Jamie. What sale on the C331 did you see? Can you provide a link?
    ....
    In my post I said "in the Deals & Discounts section of SMC". SMC is SawMill Creek -- this forum.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Finazzo View Post
    ...I took a closer look and the Minimax is closer to $2,200 more...
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Hollingsworth View Post
    ..These type of machines are sold by the pound. (heavier is better)
    I obviously can't give you an unbiased answer but will add a few things for your (or anyone's) consideration..

    1.) IWF pricing is happening soon. True that SCM doesn't do a big internet promo like some other vendors do but I've been getting guys good deals recently. Call your Minimax rep and ask them. We want a customer's business as much as the next guy.

    2.) To Mike's point, the CU300 is the heaviest and most robust machine in its class. Especially after the 2012 re-design. I've seen all the competitors. Once you put your hands on the the CU300 and then any of the others, it's evident. The only time this is not the case is if someone is comparing two different levels of combo machine, which is a different conversation.

    3.) SCM has a Southern California warehouse now and stocks machines there. This has really helped out my west cost customers from the freight cost side of things.

    Also, here is my 2-cents regarding the purchase of combo machinery in general. Feel free to accept or reject as you wish: I would not get too wrapped up in add-ons on the front end. Reason being that you don't know what you don't know until you actually take possession of the machine and start using it but more importantly, it would be a bummer to pay the the same price for two diffrent machines and have one be smaller/lighter/less powerful than the next, because your money really went to add-ons rather than actual guts. A free spindle, for example, does not make the machine heavier, more powerful, or cut better. Focus on the actual machine performance rather than value-added accessories that you can always buy later if you really decide you need them. Just my 2-cents and best of luck in your search.

    Erik
    Ex-SCM and Felder rep

  14. Hello Andy,
    Just joined the forum and am new to posting.
    I ordered my c3 31 and expect it around Mid December.
    I am concerned about getting it off the pallet and onto the floor. I would appreciate any advice and hope we can discuss the machines set up and use.
    Thank you

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Compton View Post
    Hello Andy,
    Just joined the forum and am new to posting.
    I ordered my c3 31 and expect it around Mid December.
    I am concerned about getting it off the pallet and onto the floor. I would appreciate any advice and hope we can discuss the machines set up and use.
    Thank you
    That is easy. Get a narrow pallet jack, build a ramp using 2x4 or 2x6 and OSB. Attach the ramp (using screw) to the pallet, then use the pallet jack to get machine off the pallet.

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