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Thread: Need Help To ID and Date an Older Simonds Rip Saw

  1. #1
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    Need Help To ID and Date an Older Simonds Rip Saw

    I picked a few old hand saws recently and was trying to figure out the model# and approximate age of one in particular. It is a Simonds 4 tpi 28" long with a skew back. I can't see a number below the main etching but below the smaller one to the right looks like (U. "something". 0.) Here are some picks. Any ideas? Thanks
    IMG_1444.jpgIMG_1439.jpgIMG_1441.jpgIMG_1443.jpg

  2. #2
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    Mark,

    The only Simonds saw marked Simonds (not Bay State Mfg Co which bore their second quality line) that didn't have a wheat embellished handle was the #10. The conundrum is that the saw would have a Simonds medallion if it were, and not a "Warranted Superior" Medallion like yours does. Further, they didn't make the #10 in a 28" blade. I do not have as many catalogs for Simonds as I do Disston, but this saw seems to be an oddity to me. Either the handle was replaced (likely) or was a saw made under contract. I've seen quite a few saws marked NRA (National Recovery Act) or after some Raiload (PRR--Pa Rail Road). If there is something under the left Simonds Steel etch, I'm guessing that is what it is. Looks to be 20s manufacture to me. For contract saws, the sky is the limit as the customer would stipulate exactly what they wanted...and all the big makers were happy to oblige.

    Regards,

    Pete

  3. #3
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    Thanks for the info. Hopefully we can get others to comment as well.

  4. #4
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    I found this in my searching, does it shed any light?
    Untitled.jpg

  5. #5
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    Mark,

    That's interesting. The earliest Simonds catalog I have is the 1923 edition which does not have the #9. It must have passed out of production before then. My comments on the medallion still apply though. As you can see from the etch you show, the saw is marked Simonds. As such, the medallion should have Simonds on it as well, not warranted superior.

    Regards,

    Pete

  6. #6
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    hmmm Thanks if the handle or medallion was replace it was done extreme well. hmmm Thanks Pete

  7. #7
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    Mark,

    The fact that there is an etch below the smaller shield tells me it was likely a special made saw for some company. There is no way to tell the date unless you can tell what that company was. Here in 2016, we can only guess what they did 100 years ago. Saw makers were pretty consistent about using Warranted Superior medallions only on saws made for others or second quality saws. The saw you have doesn't fit neatly into any of the categories which make sense unfortunately. Looks like you have a good start on cleaning it up. I hope you put it to good use. 4 point are not common and they can really make some dust.

    Regards,

    Pete

  8. #8
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    So you still feel it was a 20s vintage? Thanks for all your input!!

  9. #9
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    hi Mark,

    There is little I can add to Pete's comments as he is one of the leading experts on vintage hand saws. We are truly lucky here on SMC to benefit from his insight.

    FWIW, as Pete mentioned, the 28 inch length and 4 PPI configuration is very hard to find, the standard was 26 inch length, 5 PPI. This alone qualifies you for a "you suck" comment (BTW, do we do that anymore for tool gloats? Mark, I surely mean no offense!).

    Personally I'm a big fan of Simonds handsaw's, in my experience there are they are always extremely well made with good quality steel. If your ever happened across one of their "Blue Ribbon" models, so named because I believe they won a blue ribbon in the 2010 Paris world fair for best tools, I would encourage you to put it back to use. IMHO, they are on par with other top-of-the-line Golden era saw such as the Disston #12, #16, 115 and the Atkins 400 series.

    All the best, Mike

  10. #10
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    I do indeed

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark R Webster View Post
    So you still feel it was a 20s vintage? Thanks for all your input!!

  11. #11
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    I'm certainly no expert, but I believe Simonds only manufactured handsaw's from around 1900 to 1928 so anything from them is definitely a Golden era saw – a period when saws were manufactured with technology like double taper grinding, hand tensioning etc. that no longer exist today. Good reason to visit Pete's site, vintage saws.com and find one for yourself. I have several times and have never been disappointed.

    All the best, Mike

  12. #12
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    So... first of all I am not offended easily but I am not sure I understand the "you suck" reference. Are you saying I found a saw of greater value or it is a hybrid of with minimal value so great job at finding a flop. If it has value, can anyone venture an estimate as to value. Same question if it is "just another hybrid".

  13. #13
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    It is not an insult. It means something along the lines of "you found a cool old tool and I am jealous of you."

  14. #14
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    Mark,

    Such light hearted antics were common back in the day when we started the old tools list back in the early 90s. It was always meant as an envious compliment. Sometimes even followed with a meep meep!

    Regards,

    Pete

  15. #15
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    Cool!

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