Lacquering green wood bowls?

[Chris Gunsolley]

Have any of you tried applying lacquer to bowls that were just turned from green wood? (Yes, lacquering before the wood is dry.)

If so, I'm just curious, what was the end result? Did the lacquer hold up well through time, or did it crack or break apart amidst warpage of the wood?

[Bob Vavricka]

I haven't tried it, but most lacquer is not very flexible so I imagine it would crack or craze as the wood dries. I have a friend that turns a lot of green wood and puts a finish on it after turning (not lacquer), but most of it hasn't been turned long enough to know the final result. He turns a lot of end grain stuff and I have wondered if the finish might act like a green wood sealer and slow the drying down enough to prevent cracking. I'll be watching to see what others say.

[John Keeton]

What exactly are you trying to achieve - sealing the wood or an actual finish that would be appropriate on a completed bowl? There would seem to be better ways of doing either as getting a good finish on a wet piece of wood might be challenging and lacquer is not the best sealer for green wood.

[Dennis Ford]

I have seen mold grow under lacquer when the wood was not dry, would not even consider applying lacquer to green wood.

[Olaf Vogel]

I did try this on a piece of maple - the lacquer discoloured badly.
so the whole thing looked very blemished.

fortunstely it was only a scrap piece.

[Chris Gunsolley]

What exactly are you trying to achieve - sealing the wood or an actual finish that would be appropriate on a completed bowl? There would seem to be better ways of doing either as getting a good finish on a wet piece of wood might be challenging and lacquer is not the best sealer for green wood.

I was hoping to gather a few answers before we talk about why it may be a good or bad idea. I'm aware of the common methods for sealing and finishing bowls. I'm not aware of anyone who's tried this before besides myself on a couple of small bowls, so I'm just curious as to what the end result would be.

Getting to your question, I'm just curious about what the end result would be because I could see it going in a couple of directions. The two favorable facts to consider here are that 1) the lacquer would seal the wood, slowing the drying process and 2) multiple layers of lacquer provides a strong yet flexible finish. Let's consider the ideal result. If the bowl warped little to not at all, and the lacquer didn't crack, now wouldn't that be significant? As unbelievable as that may seem, this result seems plausible for reasons pertaining to both properties of the wood and properties of lacquer. As Bob mentioned the lacquer could seal the moisture in, slowing the drying process of the wood enough to minimize warpage and perhaps prevent cracking. At the same time, multiple layers of lacquer actually produces a strong yet flexible finish. So, if the lacquer were to seal the wood enough to minimize warpage, and the lacquer is flexible enough not to crack in the face of such minimal warpage, perhaps both the wood and the lacquer would survive, allowing you to finish your bowl immediately after turning it? How much time do you spend hassling with the drying process? This result would save a lot of time, wouldn't it? Sure, it may still warp a tiny bit, but for the most part your green wood bowl would be immediately finished! (It is carefully drying--under the lacquer.) I could be off track here, but hey, it's worth asking the question in the forum, because if this is the case, it's a pretty big deal. I have two small bowls that support this possibility. One is a cottonwood bowl, and the other is a black walnut bowl. I lacquered them immediately after sanding them. The walnut bowl didn't warp and is perfect. It was turned months ago. The cottonwood bowl was turned a couple months ago. It warped a tiny bit, but the lacquer did not crack and it looks great. However, both of these bowls are just over 4 inches in diameter, so I'm wondering about what the result may be on larger bowls.

Another result could be that the lacquer cracks in the face of warpage. Given that lacquer has some flex to it, the bowl would have to warp a good amount.

And perhaps mold could be a problem, but I find that unlikely if the bowl is turned to its final thickness.

[Olaf Vogel]

Chris,

the piece i experimented on is 16" Diameter.
If your intent is to slow the drying, then anchor seal does a better job.
cheaper, non toxic, easy to work with. Of course that assumes the piece gets turned twice.

i loved the shape, so despite the crappy finish it's still on my coffee table, saying "hey, do this again! But this time get it right!" 😀

[Chris Gunsolley]

Chris,

the piece i experimented on is 16" Diameter.
If your intent is to slow the drying, then anchor seal does a better job.
cheaper, non toxic, easy to work with. Of course that assumes the piece gets turned twice.

i loved the shape, so despite the crappy finish it's still on my coffee table, saying "hey, do this again! But this time get it right!" 

Olaf, I love what you said about your Maple bowl, as I can relate! You sound a lot like me, designating your 'imperfect' bowls as your 'users'. As a result, some of my most beloved bowls are the imperfect ones with a patina from the history that I've built with them. They're the one's that I decided I didn't want to sell due to some imperfection, but I'll be sure to pay myself back for the time I spent making them :-) My most frequently used bowl is a 7.5" diameter Maple bowl with a crack in it. That's a great size for just about anything. After the crack formed, I filled it then designated that bowl a user, and as a result of its frequent use, its actually become very special to me. Similarly, my fruit bowl is a 15" natural edge Hickory crotch bowl that had an apparent crack as I was turning it. Again, I filled it, smoothed it out, and determined that it would play a significant role in my kitchen. Just curious, if you love the shape but hate the finish of that Maple bowl, why not sand the finish off and refinish it? If you can't remount it for some reason, it wouldn't take much time to sand it off the lathe with a random orbit sander or drill...

All that fun stuff aside, I appreciate you mentioning the discoloration in the lacquer of that bowl, as that's the largest bowl I've heard of someone lacquering while green. So, that's a very informative example, and thank you for that. Why do you suppose the lacquer discolored?

I may just lacquer a bowl or two immediately after turning them just to see how they fare through time. I can always sand it off if something goes awry.

[Leo Van Der Loo]

Chris,

the piece i experimented on is 16" Diameter.
If your intent is to slow the drying, then anchor seal does a better job.
cheaper, non toxic, easy to work with. Of course that assumes the piece gets turned twice.

i loved the shape, so despite the crappy finish it's still on my coffee table, saying "hey, do this again! But this time get it right!" 

How about a picture Olaf to show us the way it looks now ??

[Bob Bergstrom]

I would say with all the experience turners have on this forum, if it were a good idea we all would be doing it. I think just about every way of of using finishes has been tried and we all have our favorites, but lacquering over wet woods would not be one of them. I've microwaved some and sprayed them within 24 hours, but they were quite dry.

[George Morris]

I turn wet wood to finish a lot, I always use Minwax Antique Oil. No problem with warpage.

[Peter Blair]

I turn wet wood to finish a lot, I always use Minwax Antique Oil. No problem with warpage.

George, do you turn to final thickness or turn twice? If final thickness do you sand the wood at all when wet before the Antique oil?