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Thread: Best Quality 10" Cabinet Saw

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Wasner View Post
    Quality? No one makes a quality 10" saw that I'm aware of. You have to get bigger to get into the good stuff.
    Martin, everything is relative. Having read some of your other posts, I think it's safe to say your definition of quality (and size and weight) are at a much different standard than the OP would probably find necessary.

    It would be a treat to see your shop someday.

  2. #32
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    You guys are just bragging.The Op probably just needs a saw to cut some boards for some shelving or a new patio.
    Something simple.
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    Aj

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Kumm View Post
    Slope is slippery indeed. Tear into a 75 year old machine and see helical gears, thrust bearings for every handwheel, 63xx spindle bearings and adjusting gibs every place that could wear. Bases cast to carry heavy internals rather than hanging them off the top or sheet steel. Fine grain meehanite graded cast iron planed to tolerances too expensive to duplicate today, and you realize that in their own way, these machines are art. Run 24/7 for 50 years, sit for 25 and still clean up and adjust to zero runout. Whitney, Greenlee, Yates, Tanny, Oliver, Wadkin, and Robinson. May not make any of us a better woodworker but it does change our perceptions of how machines can be made. Not for everyone but it doesn't take much cash to try it. Dave
    Damn well said Dave!

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    Martin, everything is relative. Having read some of your other posts, I think it's safe to say your definition of quality (and size and weight) are at a much different standard than the OP would probably find necessary.

    It would be a treat to see your shop someday.
    My view has been skewed by making poorly informed decisions in equipment early on. Buying what I thought were good pieces from reputable manufactures only to be proven horribly wrong. It's all relative until something goes wrong and you're unable to get product out the door, and you're wasting valuable time fixing equipment instead of producing. Plus the time spent dealing with a lesser quality of cut, (I'm thinking more in terms of shapers or planers here).

    For what you can get a used industrial quality saw for, I don't understand why you'd get anything else new. That is omitting whether or not you want a blade to be stopped before it mauls you, then you're screwed and that's a one pony race.

    Swing by the shop someday. 95% of the time, someone is here.

  5. #35
    The question is too vague. Please limit down more:

    Is price an issue? If yes, what's the budget?

    What are you making/anticipate making.?

    What kind of space do you have?

    As an owner of a Sawstop, here's what I can tell you - not that it's best - just good for me:

    1) Great easy to change riving knife/guard.
    2) Easy to access cabinet for cleaning
    3) Very good fence that has been very accurate for me.

    What I don't like
    1) The braking feature can be an inconvenient and expensive if you own an aluminum miter fence, or like to use a dado stack frequently.
    2) Other saws feature front-mount wheels for bevel, which I would find better if I did a lot of that.

    While we all praise the fit and finish of the Sawstop, I suspect that the first thing to go will be all the fancy electronics or sensors. I have no reason to suspect this except that the electronics in cars seem to be the first thing to go. And when they do, it's not cheap. So, let's see what we're all saying about SS fit and finish in another 10-15 years...

  6. #36
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    Martin, obviously my view is the same as yours. I'm just a hobby guy - sometimes the hobby is rehabbing rather than woodworking- but I read a lot of posts about problems with machines and how to find parts, and customer support. Once my old stuff is adjusted and running it never needs any work ever again. Never goes out of adjustment and never fails. I'm not sure that old machines need more love than the new stuff. Hasn't been my experience. Dave

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
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    Boston, MA
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    I love looking at old industrial table saws. Would I want a 12, 14, or 16in table saw? Probably not. My 10in canadian made General table saw does everything I need it to do and will last my lifetime. A really large planer or jointer, that I could see getting.
    Last edited by Mark Carlson; 03-15-2017 at 1:18 PM.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Prashun Patel View Post
    While we all praise the fit and finish of the Sawstop, I suspect that the first thing to go will be all the fancy electronics or sensors. I have no reason to suspect this except that the electronics in cars seem to be the first thing to go. And when they do, it's not cheap. So, let's see what we're all saying about SS fit and finish in another 10-15 years...
    Prashun,
    That's a very interesting point of speculation. I've been debating whether to join the Sawstop club myself. My only theory in response to the question you've raised is that if the fancy electronics or sensors failed, it would affect the braking only. In other words, it's not likely that a sensor or sensing electronics going bad would cause the saw to stop cutting. Of course, if the braking system was no longer working in the long haul, I'd hate to think the only way to find out is the loss of blood. But the point is the saw would still be a functioning, well built saw.
    Do you have the PCS or ICS?
    It would be interesting to ask SawStop for price on the replacement parts associated with the sensing system (not sure if this is a circuit board or sensors or what).

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    Prashun,
    That's a very interesting point of speculation. I've been debating whether to join the Sawstop club myself. My only theory in response to the question you've raised is that if the fancy electronics or sensors failed, it would affect the braking only. In other words, it's not likely that a sensor or sensing electronics going bad would cause the saw to stop cutting.
    I suppose one could re-wire the saw such that the electronics were bypasses and the motor was powered directly off the mains and using a custom power switch, but the way it comes from the factory, if the circuitry, onboard "computer", or sensors no longer worked the saw woudnt still cut. The onboard "computer" runs checks every time the saw starts. If the saw fails these checks it wont turn on and the blade will not spin.
    If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    Prashun,
    That's a very interesting point of speculation. I've been debating whether to join the Sawstop club myself. My only theory in response to the question you've raised is that if the fancy electronics or sensors failed, it would affect the braking only. In other words, it's not likely that a sensor or sensing electronics going bad would cause the saw to stop cutting. Of course, if the braking system was no longer working in the long haul, I'd hate to think the only way to find out is the loss of blood. But the point is the saw would still be a functioning, well built saw.
    Do you have the PCS or ICS?
    It would be interesting to ask SawStop for price on the replacement parts associated with the sensing system (not sure if this is a circuit board or sensors or what).
    Based on conversations that I've had with SS, I think some of the sensor electronics is in the brake, itself. When I changed my brake, after I tripped it with a steel rule, I had trouble getting things adjusted so that it would work properly. Turned out I had the riving knife too close to the blade. When I asked why it worked with the old brake, the support guy told me that they changed the program in the brake.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  11. #41
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    Sep 2016
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    Edwin, the SS runs through an electronic "boot up" procedure each time you use it, so if something went wrong with the sensors I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be doing any cutting. No idea if it's even possible to bypass that system, but I doubt it.

    Oops, cross-posted with some others.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Decker View Post
    No idea if it's even possible to bypass that system, but I doubt it.
    Bypassing all the electronics is almost certainly possible in the end it is just an induction motor like every other table saw so wiring around the electronics ould be pretty easy. The only other issue would be locking the arbor arm in position which I think is all mechanical.
    Of all the laws Brandolini's may be the most universally true.

    Deep thought for the day:

    Your bandsaw weighs more when you leave the spring compressed instead of relieving the tension.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Henderson View Post
    Based on conversations that I've had with SS, I think some of the sensor electronics is in the brake, itself. When I changed my brake, after I tripped it with a steel rule, I had trouble getting things adjusted so that it would work properly. Turned out I had the riving knife too close to the blade. When I asked why it worked with the old brake, the support guy told me that they changed the program in the brake.

    Mike
    Huh, I wonder if they do update/make changes in the brake firmware. That would be a good reason to not buy spare brakes and have them sitting around for years. If there were new firmware versions on newer brakes that might make the saw safer or fix a problem Id think we'd want to have that latest version. I wonder if SawStop will swap unused older brakes for newer ones with possibly newer firmware.
    If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
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    This thread and others like it, start to make me feel lucky that I have no room in my shop for a cabinet saw. I do appreciate the collective experience here at SMC, and knowing more about any wood shop tool is of interest to me.
    Thanks all.

    Now back to the discussion...

  15. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Wasner View Post
    My view has been skewed by making poorly informed decisions in equipment early on. Buying what I thought were good pieces from reputable manufactures only to be proven horribly wrong. It's all relative until something goes wrong and you're unable to get product out the door, and you're wasting valuable time fixing equipment instead of producing. Plus the time spent dealing with a lesser quality of cut, (I'm thinking more in terms of shapers or planers here).

    For what you can get a used industrial quality saw for, I don't understand why you'd get anything else new. That is omitting whether or not you want a blade to be stopped before it mauls you, then you're screwed and that's a one pony race.

    Swing by the shop someday. 95% of the time, someone is here.
    I actually really agree with your thinking. Lots of small cabinet shops here in Ohio, both Amish and otherwise. There are auctions and decent used equipment available. Four grand to sawstop vs four grand on the used market is a no brainier IMHO for used equipment. Others opinions may vary.

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