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Thread: Plane choice for a beginner?

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    Anyone passing through my area is more than welcomed to stop in, and try both their NIB plane AND and plane or three older than I am. Be glad to show them HOW to set their plane up and how to use it.

    Since I doubt a Brand new plane also has a "How-to" manual packed in the box with it......who will be there to show them how? One can read all they want, here and other places, but once the plane is in their hands?

    At least with a rehabbed, set up old plane, the learning curve isn't quite so steep.

    Have also noticed...placing a new, thicker blade in an older plane as a "cure-all" for not actually set the plane up right.......more actual trouble than the $ is worth. Set up the plane the way it was designed to work.
    Note: All of the Millers Falls planes in my shop still have their original irons...and not one has ever "chattered"
    DSCF0008.JPGDSCF0009.JPG
    A #14,#11, #9, and the #8 ( stanley sizes: #5, #5-1/4, #4 and #3) can't find a better set.

  2. #32
    So Scott....

    Let's ask an important question before we go on too far down the road.

    Whats your hobby? Do you want a hobby of rehabbing old planes or do you want a hobby of doing woodwork.

    Neither of these is a wrong answer... But it's good to be honest with yourself.

    So.. Assuming you have valid reasons not wanting to get into rehabbing old rust... Trust me - you have not made a bad decision here. I spent probably the better part of a year fettling old rust before I came to my senses and realized I was not actually doing any woodworking.

    Knowing all that - here's is where I would go...

    Decide on which sort of woodwork projects interest you. Use that as a driver for your tool purchases...

    If you decide you really like bowl or pen turning - there's not much use for a plane until you start getting into the fancy segmented turnings.
    Chip carving - nope.. I wouldn't start with any planes.
    Chairs - block plane or spoke shave.
    If you decide you are more interested in small boxes - a block plane is a good place to start.
    Musical instruments - block plane
    Inlay work - block plane or scraper plane.
    Tables and larger boxes - probably a #4 and #5

    Next - decide your budget. You can drop a huge amount of $$$$ on tools before you really know what you want/need.

    Brand wise - new... New production Stanley has been pretty decent stuff for me. They are probably the best value for their cost.. And you can get in the door pretty cheap.

    Next - Woodcraft's wood river. Also generally a very good value for the price. They are flatter and have better adjusters than the Stanley's.

    Next up - Clifton, Lie Nielsen, and Veritas. Very good stuff. Very well made. Generally nothing needed except for adjustments and sharpening the iron.

    Thanks

  3. #33
    Since you have a block plane and aren't sure what projects you would be doing, I recommend just one plane (plus one spare blade or two):

    The Veritas Low Angle Jack - http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/pag...82,41186,49708

    If your budget is an issue and can't follow the best approach to buying tools (Buy the best you can afford), go for a LAJ from a cheaper source.

    Why LAJ?

    It can do all planing jobs from jointing. flattening, smoothing, shooting and even scrubbing (with a heavy cambered blade because it is low angle). When handling difficult grain, use a high angle blade and that is where the spare blade comes in. It is a jack of all trades and it will be used more than most other planes if you're into furniture building.

    Each plane user has their favorites and mine is the LAJ. It is no longer much used as a shooter as I have got the shooting plane as a gift.

    Not all LAJs are made the same and you must examine different brands to see what features you want most. After using three different of them for an extended period of time (that was before Wood River's time), I settled with the Veritas which also offers second-to-none customer service.

    Simon
    Last edited by Simon MacGowen; 03-24-2017 at 10:39 AM.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by John C Cox View Post
    So Scott....

    Let's ask an important question before we go on too far down the road.

    Whats your hobby? Do you want a hobby of rehabbing old planes or do you want a hobby of doing woodwork.

    Neither of these is a wrong answer... But it's good to be honest with yourself.

    So.. Assuming you have valid reasons not wanting to get into rehabbing old rust... Trust me - you have not made a bad decision here. I spent probably the better part of a year fettling old rust before I came to my senses and realized I was not actually doing any woodworking.

    Knowing all that - here's is where I would go...

    Decide on which sort of woodwork projects interest you. Use that as a driver for your tool purchases...

    If you decide you really like bowl or pen turning - there's not much use for a plane until you start getting into the fancy segmented turnings.
    Chip carving - nope.. I wouldn't start with any planes.
    Chairs - block plane or spoke shave.
    If you decide you are more interested in small boxes - a block plane is a good place to start.
    Musical instruments - block plane
    Inlay work - block plane or scraper plane.
    Tables and larger boxes - probably a #4 and #5

    Next - decide your budget. You can drop a huge amount of $$$$ on tools before you really know what you want/need.

    Brand wise - new... New production Stanley has been pretty decent stuff for me. They are probably the best value for their cost..

    Thanks

    John thank you for this reply as it is most helpful. I guess I shouldn't be jumping to tool purchasing before I know what I'm working on but at work as a millwright apprentice we bring a lot of tools with us to the job and only use a small amoun,t but if we need something it is right there. Maybe this is where I'm getting the mentality of purchasing a lot of tools and having them sit here.

    Why I don't want to play with old planes is because I did straight razor restoration for a long time. I spent hours upon hours doing this and it was fun but it took up a huge chunk of my free time I could have been spending with my wife and dog. I don't want to invest boat loads of time fixing up old planes right now. It's not that I can't do it and in the future I might just right now is a very busy time for me.

    I do not want to do any turning. Did enough metal turning and i dont have room for a lathe.

    I will mostly be building tables, benches boxes and other furniture. Chairs could be fun too I could see myself doing that. I will mostly be working with pine now because it's cheap.

    I am borrowing my dads block plane for now but maybe should get one for myself.

    I heard new production Stanley (even the sweetheart) wasn't good and could not be used for working wood. Which Stanley's would you reccomend?

    Lots to to think about. .

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by steven c newman View Post
    Anyone passing through my area is more than welcomed to stop in, and try both their NIB plane AND and plane or three older than I am. Be glad to show them HOW to set their plane up and how to use it.

    Since I doubt a Brand new plane also has a "How-to" manual packed in the box with it......who will be there to show them how? One can read all they want, here and other places, but once the plane is in their hands?

    At least with a rehabbed, set up old plane, the learning curve isn't quite so steep.

    Have also noticed...placing a new, thicker blade in an older plane as a "cure-all" for not actually set the plane up right.......more actual trouble than the $ is worth. Set up the plane the way it was designed to work.
    Note: All of the Millers Falls planes in my shop still have their original irons...and not one has ever "chattered"
    DSCF0008.JPGDSCF0009.JPG
    A #14,#11, #9, and the #8 ( stanley sizes: #5, #5-1/4, #4 and #3) can't find a better set.
    That photograph si a site for Friday! Millers Falls made a darned nice plane.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Archi View Post
    John thank you for this reply as it is most helpful. I guess I shouldn't be jumping to tool purchasing before I know what I'm working on but at work as a millwright apprentice we bring a lot of tools with us to the job and only use a small amoun,t but if we need something it is right there. Maybe this is where I'm getting the mentality of purchasing a lot of tools and having them sit here.

    Why I don't want to play with old planes is because I did straight razor restoration for a long time. I spent hours upon hours doing this and it was fun but it took up a huge chunk of my free time I could have been spending with my wife and dog. I don't want to invest boat loads of time fixing up old planes right now. It's not that I can't do it and in the future I might just right now is a very busy time for me.

    I do not want to do any turning. Did enough metal turning and i dont have room for a lathe.

    I will mostly be building tables, benches boxes and other furniture. Chairs could be fun too I could see myself doing that. I will mostly be working with pine now because it's cheap.

    I am borrowing my dads block plane for now but maybe should get one for myself.

    I heard new production Stanley (even the sweetheart) wasn't good and could not be used for working wood. Which Stanley's would you reccomend?

    Lots to to think about. .
    I have the new production Stanley Sweetheart and it is a really decent plane. If you have the mechanical sense to be a millwrights apprentice a plane should be child's play for you.

    What is good about the new sweetheart-

    Norris style Adjsuter makes adjustment intuitive IMHO.

    Frog is cast into the plane body and is very stable if you are planing very hard wood, mine loves Hickory and Purpleheart like there is no tomorrow.

    Mouth adjustment is very smooth.

    It is a hundred dollars cheaper than the LN or Veritas Bevel up #5.

    Mapllable Iron so will not shatter if dropped on the floor like an older plane.

    Machining on my plane was pretty good. Edge retention is decent but not spectacular for the blade.

    Blade will take a really nice edge.

    Handle is a comfortable shape, at least in my hands.

    It is no Lie Nielsen #4, though it does a fine job.

    Also, if you are building with pine because it is cheap you might consider finding a small sawmill or someone who has excess hardwood stock. I just bought a bunch of 8/4 Oak cheaper than SYP for a workbench from another woodworker....cheaper than SYP would have been.

    A vintage plane should not take weeks to restore, clean up, sharpening, lubricate a few things and you should be off to the races. Don't think that a plane needs to have concourse work done on it to be a good user.

    Just a few random thoughts.

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Simon MacGowen View Post
    Since you have a block plane and aren't sure what projects you would be doing, I recommend just one plane (plus one spare blade or two):

    The Veritas Low Angle Jack - http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/pag...82,41186,49708

    If your budget is an issue and can't follow the best approach to buying tools (Buy the best you can afford), go for a LAJ from a cheaper source.

    Why LAJ?

    It can do all planing jobs from jointing. flattening, smoothing, shooting and even scrubbing (with a heavy cambered blade because it is low angle). When handling difficult grain, use a high angle blade and that is where the spare blade comes in. It is a jack of all trades and it will be used more than most other planes if you're into furniture building.

    Each plane user has their favorites and mine is the LAJ. It is no longer much used as a shooter as I have got the shooting plane as a gift.

    Not all LAJs are made the same and you must examine different brands to see what features you want most. After using three different of them for an extended period of time (that was before Wood River's time), I settled with the Veritas which also offers second-to-none customer service.

    Simon
    The Veritas is probably the best of the low angle Jacks IMHO....but the wood river plane is a fine plane. The gentleman I share my shop space with owns one, it is a very good user in its own right.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Longview WA
    Posts
    27,347
    Blog Entries
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    Whats your hobby? Do you want a hobby of rehabbing old planes or do you want a hobby of doing woodwork.
    I enjoy both. Haven't done a lot of metal work of late.

    Restoring an old plane can be done fairly quickly if one doesn't get overly meticulous. My restorations tend to get deep into the job and sometimes includes repainting and other things not needed to bring an old tool back to work.

    My experience of restoring planes gave me a deeper insight into how a plane works and how to take care of problems when something isn't working.

    I have also met other users who had "out of the box" problems at Tool Events. Sometimes a box gets bumped in shipment and something shifts.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Archi View Post
    I bring a lot of tools with us to the job and only use a small amoun,t but if we need something it is right there. Maybe this is where I'm getting the mentality of purchasing a lot of tools and having them sit here.
    Work is different from hobby. Your work tools pay for you.... You pay for your hobby tools.

    I will mostly be building tables, benches boxes and other furniture. Chairs could be fun too I could see myself doing that. I will mostly be working with pine now because it's cheap.

    I am borrowing my dads block plane for now but maybe should get one for myself.
    The best plan for now is to keep doing that. Sounds like you aren't having problems because of a lack of tools... As you use it - you will get a feel for what you need and want and are willing to pay for.

    I would use that until you have to give it back.... A new stanley will probably be about the same as what you are using now. If you find you are using it all the time - then step up a notch to a Wood River or better plane.

    I heard new production Stanley (even the sweetheart) wasn't good and could not be used for working wood. Which Stanley's would you reccomend.
    I have heard that too - but it hasn't been my experience.

    You are getting very good value for the price. Their castings are generally good and only require a little clean up. If you get a bad one - send it back. Last one I bought was a standard Stanley block plane at Lowes (probably 10 years ago now)... It was very square and flat out of the box. The blade is good quality steel and sharpens easily without much work. Far less work than any vintage plane I have bought - which have generally all been way out of whack.

    My complaint is their adjusters... They aren't smooth and clean tracking.

  10. #40
    My dog and I jumped in the truck for a ride and passed a surplus store. I needed a few clamps so I went in. Asked if he had any bench planes. He had a crap Chinese tool bench and an old Stanley.

    $29.99 CAD I think all the parts are there. I am unable to post photos from my phone or I would add the photos I took. If anyone wants to take a look at it I can send pictures through email but everything looks to be in order. Bevel on the iron is mangled but easily fixable. Not sure what the other parts are?

    i guess that quickly settled which plane to get first.

    As much as I wanted a new plane you can't pass up on a deal like that.

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    5,582
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Archi View Post
    My dog and I jumped in the truck for a ride and passed a surplus store. I needed a few clamps so I went in. Asked if he had any bench planes. He had a crap Chinese tool bench and an old Stanley.

    $29.99 CAD I think all the parts are there. I am unable to post photos from my phone or I would add the photos I took. If anyone wants to take a look at it I can send pictures through email but everything looks to be in order. Bevel on the iron is mangled but easily fixable. Not sure what the other parts are?

    i guess that quickly settled which plane to get first.

    As much as I wanted a new plane you can't pass up on a deal like that.

    What model was it? I agree - never pass up a good deal on a tool

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Koepke View Post
    I enjoy both. Haven't done a lot of metal work of late.

    Restoring an old plane can be done fairly quickly if one doesn't get overly meticulous. My restorations tend to get deep into the job and sometimes includes repainting and other things not needed to bring an old tool back to work.

    My experience of restoring planes gave me a deeper insight into how a plane works and how to take care of problems when something isn't working.

    I have also met other users who had "out of the box" problems at Tool Events. Sometimes a box gets bumped in shipment and something shifts.

    jtk
    One could look once again to both yourself and Steven Newman, two of the more productive hand tools guys here in this forum. Both of you find time for both...

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Putney, Vermont
    Posts
    1,042
    Scott, Try not to believe everything you read and hear.
    I bought a used #4 Stanley Handyman plane for 15.00. It was my first plane. I flattened the sole though it was fairly flat to begin with. Flattened the part that holds down the blade, and flattened and sharpened the blade. This all took about 2 hours and got me familiar with the tool.
    The plane takes translucent shavings in pine and is easy to sharpen. Now most people would turn down a Stanley Handyman plane as cheap, mass produced junk, but I beg to differ.
    I have an older Craftsman #4 that looks just like the Millers falls version and and is a bit heavier then the Handyman plane. I leave that plane set up for roughing cuts and the handyman for finishing cuts.
    Less the 30.00 for the 2 planes.

  14. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Archi View Post
    My dog and I jumped in the truck for a ride and passed a surplus store. I needed a few clamps so I went in. Asked if he had any bench planes. He had a crap Chinese tool bench and an old Stanley.

    $29.99 CAD I think all the parts are there. I am unable to post photos from my phone or I would add the photos I took. If anyone wants to take a look at it I can send pictures through email but everything looks to be in order. Bevel on the iron is mangled but easily fixable. Not sure what the other parts are?

    i guess that quickly settled which plane to get first.

    As much as I wanted a new plane you can't pass up on a deal like that.
    It will become addictive once you get that plane working sweetly. And it will also speed up your woodworking immeasurably. Was joining up a few boards for a panel the other night....they didn't fit quite perfectly...a few swipes with the #7 I acquired off of Mr Newman and we were in business.

    There is also the issue that sanding is dusty, and sandpaper is expensive. I buy very little sandpaper any more. You will find other benefits as well.

    Also, hand planes seem to be like lost puppies...once you start showing them love, they seem to show up on your door step.

  15. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Pat Barry View Post
    What model was it? I agree - never pass up a good deal on a tool

    It it doesn't say. All it says on body is made in USA and on the blade made in Canada. It's a blue colour and wooden tote and knob.

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