New Laguna lathe

[Roger Chandler]

Just FYI.....most lathes from China do not have hardened spindles these days.

[Greg Parrish]

Just FYI.....most lathes from China do not have hardened spindles these days.

Guess that's one of the things the extra $5k would have gotten me. LOL. One day though.....................

ill still call Laguna to see what they have to say. Who knows they may offer to replace it anyway. Worth a 5 minute call.

[Steve Mathews]

Greg - Sorry but I didn't see your question about the spindle hardness reference until just now. I should have stated that I was referring to my Oneway manual. But that doesn't mean Laguna shouldn't have taken the same care in manufacturing their spindles. You appear to have a good quality machine and probably paid a good amount for it. As such I would not expect a spindle thread to be damaged by a set screw as shown in your picture. I would remind Laguna that if they refuse to correct the problem and try to shift the responsibility your way that they should've cautioned in their manual that the spindle threads could be damaged because they were not hardened. Based on what I've read it's more customary that lathe spindles be hardened than not. Also, what little I've read about Laguna's customer service it seems very good. I would definitely give them an opportunity to make good on that reputation. It would also be great if you would let us know what they decide. Future Laguna customers may want to know.

[Greg Parrish]

Greg - Sorry but I didn't see your question about the spindle hardness reference until just now. I should have stated that I was referring to my Oneway manual. But that doesn't mean Laguna shouldn't have taken the same care in manufacturing their spindles. You appear to have a good quality machine and probably paid a good amount for it. As such I would not expect a spindle thread to be damaged by a set screw as shown in your picture. I would remind Laguna that if they refuse to correct the problem and try to shift the responsibility your way that they should've cautioned in their manual that the spindle threads could be damaged because they were not hardened. Based on what I've read it's more customary that lathe spindles be hardened than not. Also, what little I've read about Laguna's customer service it seems very good. I would definitely give them an opportunity to make good on that reputation. It would also be great if you would let us know what they decide. Future Laguna customers may want to know.

good points. Will let you know what comes out of the call.

[david privett]

is there a reason that someone has not developed a spindle that has the option of using a jam nut on the backside of whatever attachment you are running to lock things in place in reverse ?

[Thomas Canfield]

Gregg - Check out using a jam chuck with rubber or leather pad and live center to hold bowl/turning to reshape the majority of bottom down to a small nub to remove with chisel. It works well for a tenon with dimple in center and one of the reasons that I almost always use a tenon. The dimple also helps line up with vacuum chuck if you later get one. I do not like to use a force jam chuck to fully support piece since it only works on a true round piece and I turn too many natural edge pieces and hollow forms.

A friend bought a early model Laguna like yours and did similar damage to drive threads. He bought a die from automotive parts store for less than $20 to clean threads, and loaned it to me to clean my 3520B where I damaged it turning a crazy piece in reverse since I could not get on back side of lathe to get proper tool insertion. Lots of new things to look forward to.

[Greg Parrish]

Gregg - Check out using a jam chuck with rubber or leather pad and live center to hold bowl/turning to reshape the majority of bottom down to a small nub to remove with chisel. It works well for a tenon with dimple in center and one of the reasons that I almost always use a tenon. The dimple also helps line up with vacuum chuck if you later get one. I do not like to use a force jam chuck to fully support piece since it only works on a true round piece and I turn too many natural edge pieces and hollow forms.

A friend bought a early model Laguna like yours and did similar damage to drive threads. He bought a die from automotive parts store for less than $20 to clean threads, and loaned it to me to clean my 3520B where I damaged it turning a crazy piece in reverse since I could not get on back side of lathe to get proper tool insertion. Lots of new things to look forward to.

Never imagined finding an affordable die or thread restorer in 1.25". Will have to check that out but will still check with Laguna tomorrow. If they do replace then win, win. If not then I have to fix and maintain anyway.

Im going to pick up some 4x3 rectangular steel in 3/8 or 1/4 tomorrow to make some risers. I really can't see paying $269 on sale for the cast iron ones

[Jeffrey J Smith]

You might want to replace the set screws with brass tips ones - available at McMaster - Carr, for one place. I had a similar incident on my old Jet 1642. Replaced the set screws on all my chucks and faceplates. It's only a couple bucks for a bag full. The spindles on all Jets are not hardened. I'd be surprised if any of the Asian imports have hardened spindles these days.

The brass tips are softer than the steel spindlethreads and will usually deform before taking out the threads. You can get set screws with either brass or nylon tips.

[John Keeton]

Greg, I just took another look at your spindle image. The Laguna spindle has approx. 7 threads, which is what you have. The flat area behind the threads is factory, so the only "damage" you have is some damage to one thread and perhaps a portion of another. I think it is easily repairable and you will never notice the partial loss of that thread. It certainly isn't worth any effort to replace the spindle in my opinion. I doubt Laguna would agree to do anything as all the lathes I have owned do not have hardened threads. As others have said, I doubt any of the Asian made lathes for the past decade or so have hardened spindles.

[Leo Van Der Loo]

To add to John Keeton’s reply which I do totally agree with, the groove on the spindle is to have the set screws go down into, and hold the chuck from unscrewing, the blue color showing has to be from the screws or some other material, not from the heat of a spinning/slipping material, if you ever again want to use the set screws, make sure they are tightened down well, and even then you better take very light cuts in reverse direction, these screw can hold only so much, certainly not like in the normal forward direction

Oh one more thing, make sure the setscrews do go down into the groove of your spindle, and not onto the threaded part, as there is no standard for those grooves on the spindles or chuck setscrew hole placements.

[Greg Parrish]

Greg, I just took another look at your spindle image. The Laguna spindle has approx. 7 threads, which is what you have. The flat area behind the threads is factory, so the only "damage" you have is some damage to one thread and perhaps a portion of another. I think it is easily repairable and you will never notice the partial loss of that thread. It certainly isn't worth any effort to replace the spindle in my opinion. I doubt Laguna would agree to do anything as all the lathes I have owned do not have hardened threads. As others have said, I doubt any of the Asian made lathes for the past decade or so have hardened spindles.

John, so yours has that one flattened thread closest to the headstock also?.

Thanks.

[Steve Mathews]

The responses following the OPs mention of the spindle damage have been informative and surprising. A factory faceplate was used when the damage occurred so the set screw should've aligned with the spindle groove, assuming of course the faceplate was fully seated. The depth of the scoring on the spindle clearly shows that the setscrew was fully engaged. Why there are 2 parallel grooves in the spindle made by the set screw is a mystery through. Based on the depth of the scoring it seems logical that a lot of heat was generated resulting in the bluing shown. As for the damaged threads I'm not sure how that could've happened that high up on the crown if the setscrew was fully engaged in the groove. Perhaps it occurred after the setscrew sufficiently wore away or it happened afterwards when the setscrew wasn't fully engaged. Based on Greg's comments I don't see anything that he did wrong and shouldn't have to settle for what resulted. I agree that installing a new spindle would be a hassle and possibly more trouble than it's worth but that could easily be remedied by swapping out a complete headstock, which I believe the manufacturer should do.

Now the surprising. I had no idea that any manufacturer of a lathe would use a non hardened spindle. I have 2 lathes, one for woodturning and another for metalwork. Both have hardened spindles. I didn't choose either one on that basis but just assumed that it would be required because of the lateral stresses involved and the constant changing of chucks, etc. Why we let manufacturers get away with inferior quality totally baffles me.

[John K Jordan]

...The depth of the scoring on the spindle clearly shows that the setscrew was fully engaged. Why there are 2 parallel grooves in the spindle made by the set screw is a mystery through.

Based on the depth of the scoring it seems logical that a lot of heat was generated resulting in the bluing shown. As for the damaged threads I'm not sure how that could've happened that high up on the crown if the setscrew was fully engaged in the groove...

It is fun to analyze from the two photos but it is difficult to do so thoroughly without the parts actually in hand for close inspection. It would be easy to misinterpret the measurements and angles due to lighting and distortion from the camera lens.

If the bluing is actually from this incident it is conceivable the set screw could have generated the heat as it was dragged (2 revolutions?) around the spindle land until it crashed into the thread. It could have turned a bit to loosen or tighten as it moved.

The play built into all the lathe spindles I've seen would allow the faceplate to tilt a bit relative to the spindle axis once it broke away from the seat, compounding the variability of the forces. The deep gauling on the second photo running parallel to the thread could have been aided by that tilt or the set screw turning to tighten or loosen. I can imagine the set screw being turned a bit counter clockwise shortening it as it ran up the side of the thread. Did it remain intact or break from the impact? Was there just one set screw?

Regardless, I agree the spindle should still function acceptably unless it was bent from the the incident. Whether I pursued a free replacement would depend on if I thought something I did wrong caused the incident. If it was my lathe and if I planned to use set screws with any particular faceplate or a chuck I would make one small modification: mount the faceplate and mark the location of where the set screw bears on the spindle land. Then make a flat in the land for the set screw, perhaps with a file or Dremel. (Make sure the set screw is still long enough afterward.) Make other flats as needed for other faceplates or chucks.

If I often turned heavy things in reverse I would consider drilling and tapping to provide for a second set screw. (For a really massive lathe a locking pin/bolt might be appropriate!)

Was the faceplate properly seated on the spindle? I would inspect each faceplate (and any chucks) to make sure they do in fact seat properly. Some chuck manuals recommend inspecting the chuck threads for burrs or chips which can prevent complete seating.

From a Teknatool manual on mounting a chuck with to a lathe:

...Make sure the chuck is screwed to lathe thread properly -a good check is to see whether
it screws home on the spindle the same as another lathe fixture such as a faceplate.

POOR FIT OF CHUCK TO LATHE SPINDLE CREATES A SERIOUS HAZARD WHERE
CHUCK COULD DISLODGE FROM LATHE. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO USE CHUCK UNLESS
THE CHUCK US CORRECTLY FITTED TO LATHE SPINDLE.

JKJ

[Greg Parrish]

Contacted Laguna who issued a case number, asked for pictures, serial number and proof of purchase and said they would get back to me. Will keep you guys posted on what they say.

for the additional pics I took, not much better detail I'm afraid, you can look at txbonds.zenfolio.com under my workshop folder. They are the last photos in that folder.

in this case the factory face plate has 2 set screws and I seated it with the provided handle bar.

[Mike Goetzke]

Greg - looking at your spindle photos it also looks like your lead thread is "boogered" up too. The marks from the set screws do look strange. You might expect the galled material to be in the loosening direction of the reverse turning but the galling is toward the headstock.


All - I'm not the most experienced turner but what reasons would there be to turn in reverse? I can see sanding but not for basic operations.

Thanks,

Mike