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Thread: What are you doing for DC?

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Leland, NC
    Posts
    476
    Brad, I hear what you are saying.

    However, the idea is to not put fine dust in the air. That is the goal. When I use the shoe, I do not get any fine dust particles floating around the machine. Whether it picks up the chips when the hose portion goes over the cut does not matter to me. Typically, on a long job I will have maybe a small handful of large chips that escaped over the edge of the material.

    One of the problems with using a router for the spindle is that the router blows straight down at the material. This is both a problem and a help, sorta. The problem is that the exhaust from the router gets all the debris flying. But, if the dust shoe is hooked up to a decent DC that works to help remove the debris. One of my early designs deflected that air blast. It helped, and it didn't. Tended to have more chips in the cut.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Dawson Creek, BC
    Posts
    1,033
    Ted, I have never had a problem with collecting the fine dust. To me collecting the chips is just as important, but I think I am going off topic of the original question.

    Mark, I think you will have other equipment that requires more HP than the CNC you mention.

  3. #18
    I'm using the HF 2hp on our 2x4 CNC, mostly cutting Walnut and other hardwoods but occasionally MDF for templates or fixtures. It seems to work good with my homemade dust shoe though, as others have said, it doesn't pick up large chips but gets the dust out easily - smaller chips get sucked right up just like the dust. It's rare for me to run another tool while the CNC is running so it gets the full capacity of the DC all to itself.

    David

    Here's our setup (brush isn't on in this photo) -
    David
    CurlyWoodShop on Etsy, David Falkner on YouTube, difalkner on Instagram

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Deep South
    Posts
    3,970
    The problem with the Kent shoe is that the brush goes up and down with the spindle. This is undesirable because it can be so close to the work piece at one point that it crushes the bristles and at some other point in time, the same brush doesn't even come close to the work surface an dust and shavings alike escape. The only reason anyone uses the movable brush height is that it is so much easier to design and build. You have to compromise sometimes.

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Norfolk, UK
    Posts
    94
    I upgraded this year to a 2hp, 1700cfm dust collector with a pleated filter from a "1hp"/570cfm with felt bag, i had a home made cyclone on the 1hp which was very effective. The cyclone was too small for the volume of air the 2hp pulls, so I gave it away when selling the 1hp collector.

    The 1700cfm handles me running a 3/8" bit at 24,000rpm, 12,000mm/min (470ipm) through MDF, but so did the 1HP unit - however with the 2hp I can also run the planer/tablesaw/bandsaw at the same time without issues.

    I use a brush based system very similar to the KentCNC that I designed, I built it long before I found his, but they are pretty similar. Design files on github: https://github.com/issus/CNC-Dust-Collection. I build LED strips into my dust collectors so I can see through them, it also makes changing endmills and setting up the job easier with the light directly on/under the spindle.

    I've never had trouble with the brush height.. on the 1.6kW spindle I used to run a 2" brush for everything, even with a decent gap between the workpiece and the brushes nothing much would escape except when aggressively drilling (the swarf would get compressed in the flutes and flung out with great force) - when milling even at very high speeds/loads nothing much gets out. With the 2HP collector and 2.2kW spindle I'm running a 3" brush now, again, *nothing* gets out. The bristles getting crushed into the workpiece doesn't matter - just helps brush dust off :P

    The single biggest improvement I've had to dust collection on the CNC routers has been using my coolant nozzle for just air when cutting wood. I used to get dust/swarf at the bottom of slots and deep pockets, running a very low flow/psi jet of air against the endmill when cutting leaves me with no dust or swarf on the cuts at all, and keeps the endmill/drills (especially the drills!) cooler giving me much longer life on them. I'm just using locline and 5-15psi (depending on cut depth, the 2hp collector moves so much air through I need more pressure to get a jet that isn't disturbed).

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Deep South
    Posts
    3,970
    You make a good point. If you have enough vacuum and it is close enough, you don't need a brush at all. I have seen several designs that work like that.

  7. #22
    We have a Kent on our machine and its abysmal processing sheet goods. We have a dedicated 3HP Onieda cyclone on the CNC with 5" flex running right to the Kent with a 5x4 reducer. We had to fit plastic flanges inside the Kent because the DC would suck the bristles into the shoe. The adapter coming off the Kent is just glued in with some sort of soft rubber adhesive and when it gets hot in the shop if there is any load (flex not perfectly straight or pulling slightly) the adapter simply peels off the clear acrylic. We had to foil tape the adapter back in and put a few screws in it.

    Today for instance we were breaking down 5x10 melamine and on X+ cuts, its like there is no shoe and no dust collection. Our tooling runs about 1/2" longer than the bristles on the shoe but we cant use the 1/2" extension with our tool changer.

    A new shoe design is most definitely in our future as soon as we slow down enough to deal with it.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Bloomington, IL
    Posts
    6,009
    I keep my KentCNC Shoes (own two) bristles at the end of the bit as much as I can. The 3" bristles are enough to keep whatever clearance I need for clamps. I have ZERO issues with plywood or MDF except when the shoe comes out off the table in the front of the machine and even then it collects most of the dust just fine. With super long bits you would use spacers. I have also had zero issues with build quality or it coming unglued.

    Whats you ATC setup look like Mark?
    Glad its my shop I am responsible for - I only have to make me happy.

  9. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Heidrick View Post
    I keep my KentCNC Shoes (own two) bristles at the end of the bit as much as I can. The 3" bristles are enough to keep whatever clearance I need for clamps. I have ZERO issues with plywood or MDF except when the shoe comes out off the table in the front of the machine and even then it collects most of the dust just fine. With super long bits you would use spacers. I have also had zero issues with build quality or it coming unglued.

    Whats you ATC setup look like Mark?

    Any of my panel processing tooling (3/8" or 1/2" Comp. or down shear) all run about 1/2' below the bristles. This means on a full depth pass on 3/4" material the bristles are just in contact with the top of the work. X+ cuts the chips just fly straight out of the cut and off the machine. Ive given a thought about the air nozzle but just never gotten around to it.

    I am not trashing the Kent. Its a fine shoe for what it is. A static shoe that is easily and quickly removable which is handy. The ATC on our machine (ShopSabre4896Pro) is an aluminum angle with conventional forks on top. the body of the Kent is just slightly off the angle in a tool change so if we were to run the extension we would have to remove it for every tool change.

    This isnt an uncommon issue on any cnc processing sheet goods. Even large commercial machines we have seen with static shoe's have the same issue.

    The issue of the exit adapter coming unglued is something Im sure many have dealt with. If you put any lateral load on that abs adapter it will just peel off the acrylic over time as there are no mechanical means holding it on.

    Gary C. has posted some video of nearly 100% shoes and Im thinking something like that is the route we will have to go. Cutting at full speed I cant see how any static shoe is going to pickup on the troublesome cuts.

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