Walnut Kitchen Table Finish

[Ian Scofield]

I'm in the process of building a farm house table out of walnut with breadboard ends. This table will be used for a kitchen table, so it will see some abuse. I have never been satisfied with the finishing that I've done really on any of the projects I've ever done, so I'm really looking to see what everyone is recommending. This is the biggest project (surface area wise) so I'm wanting this to turn out great as it will be very visible. I've been reading threads on various forums for weeks and if I had a $1 for everyone's various methods, I could retire. It's overwhelming.


I plan on using transtint to darken the walnut as it's a bit lighter than the housse COO would like.


I typically finish things with wipe on or brush on poly, but that process takes forever, and I frequently end up with a less than stellar finish.


Because it's going to have breadboard ends, I'm thinking this means I can't do a film finish due to the expansion at the seam. I've read rave reviews about people using waterlox for a finish, but this builds a film, so I'm not sure how this would survive with a breadboard.


I'm really taking into account maintenance down the road and am preferring finishes that I can just recoat, as opposed to sanding and having to go through a whole stripping/refinishing process.


Lastly, I have a spray setup so I can go that route as well, or wipe on or brushed.

[Sam Murdoch]

My very favorite finish these days is a product called RUBIO MONOCOAT +2C. It is by far the best I have used by way of wipe on finishes.
I have used Watco and Waterlox for years and some of the homemade blends with linseed oil etc. Waterlox is hard and durable for certain. I have recommended it many times on the Creek for table and bar tops. Now I am saying go MONOCOAT.

It is intended to be a floor finish AND is intended to be true to its name, a 1 coat product.

I have used it now on 3 pieces of furniture including a dresser in a bathroom and am currently finishing a huge pile of red birch cabinet doors and cabinets with it.

My technique varies from the floor finishing.

1) I sand everything to no less than 150 grit and the high use surfaces - tops and doors, face frames, side panels etc - get sanded to 200 grit.
Then I apply a liberal coat of WATCO. Wipe on, wipe off as directed. This seals the wood and makes certain (at an affordable price) that all the wood is covered with oil.

2) After 2 or 3 days I sand all the Watco surfaces (but especially the high use as indicated above) with 400 grit up to 600 grit for table tops. I use Abranet Mesh with my Festool ETS 150/3 or the like for this purpose. The Abranet mesh is the ideal sanding medium (IMHO) for finishes but particularly oil and varnish types. Minimal clogging and very excellent smooth results. I do vacuum everything off before the next step but this finish is wonderful in that air borne dust is not the issue it is with Waterlox or varnish and urethanes.

3) The Monocoat session is simply a matter of mixing the 2 parts together 3:1 as directed and then applying with a foam brush or cloth - wait 8 to 15 minutes and wipe everything off. You CAN'T wipe too much but you can wipe off too little. I use the 3 rag approach. 1st rag is for the heavy pick up. 2nd rag is for the follow up and the 3rd rag cleans up any residue. By the time you are using the 3rd rag your hand is gliding over the surface. The 1st rag is like trying to pick up honey that is a bit on the dry side. Don't get discouraged - each of the rubs in quick succession reveals more and more of the silky smooth surface.

4) Final buffing can be done if needed after several days (watch some on line videos) but I find that a crumpled paper bag is buffing enough.

This finish is very very easy to repair if needed. It smells great and is as non toxic as finishes can be. I have been using it for 8 hour days recently without need for major dust control, ventilation, or respirator.

I was intending to spray a finish on my doors but the waterborne spray finishes I sampled - MY CAMPBELL and Sherwin Williams appeared so lifeless (even gray) in comparison to the Monocoat that I decided on this oil.

I used the PURE. Don't mistake the NATURAL as natural. It has a whitener in it to kill the ambering effect of the PURE. Also available in many other colors. I obviously did not care about the ambering. That is what I wanted and the Watco helped that along.

The Watco achieves 2 objectives. It seals all the wood covering in case I later miss spots or choose not to coat with the expensive MONOCOAT, so saves money/product. MONOCOAT is VERY VERY EXPENSIVE at least as far as initial outlay. To be fair it goes a long way. I measure it out with a digital scale, only using what I need. I did 2 pieces of furniture plus with 350ml size. That size can also did both sides of 25 doors - all pretreated with Watco. There are many sources but to my great surprise the big auction house is the best source/price by far. I don't know how those guys do it. Shop around. You can certainly use this without the Watco pretreat and in your case with the transtint you could go directly to the MONOCOAT. Just remember - the quality of your last finished surface will be the quality after the Monocoat.

More info if need be.

Sam

[Prashun Patel]

Wow, Sam, that's quite an endorsement. I will have to look into the Rubio Monocoat.

Ian, I made a walnut kitchen table and have found out a couple things:

1) It lightens. Kitchens are often the brightest rooms in the house, and UV lightens walnut. It unavoidable, IMHO. I would therefore not try to fight nature by dyeing it. You'll potentially end up with a color that does not look dark, or natural. Perhaps a UV inhibitor will help.
2) I am partial to oil/varnish finishes here. Because the user can refresh it themselves every year. It gets dull gracefully. Dings can be steamed out, lightly sanded and the OV can be easily re-applied.
3) If you are committed to a film finish, then a good trick is to brush on 2-3 coats, and then sand, then wipe on the final 2-3 coats thinned. I would finish the breadboard and top separately - at least for the brush on phase. Then you can glue up, sand, and do the final wipe on coats without sealing the seam.

[glenn bradley]

Hmmm, $162 for 1.3 liters. Is there a more economical source for this product without having to buy large quantities? I know my modifed phenolic goes a long, long way; maybe 1.3 liters is a lot (?).
.

[John TenEyck]

I've had no trouble dying walnut and having it stay dark. You just have to use a film finish with a good UV package. Of course, those UV absorbers will break down over time, but it takes a really long time; I haven't seen a change in 10 years though the pieces I did do not get direct exposure to sunlight. The two products I have used with a good UV package are GF's HP Poly and SW's Kem Aqua Plus. Of the two, HP Poly is far easier to use and looks better IMO. However, it's not KCMA rated and is relatively easily damaged with common household cleaners. I would not use it on a kitchen table. The Kem Aqua Plus is KCMA rated and much more durable, but I have not been able to get finish with it I've been happy with. Neither product is all that easy to repair.

Personally, I would dye it to whatever color you want and then use a brushing/wiping varnish. I would build up enough coats so that I could rub out the top. That will give you an absolutely flat, smooth, defect free surface that can be repaired by sanding, applying a few more wiped on coats, and repeating the rub out. If it lightens, it lightens. If it happens, and got intolerable, I'd strip/sand the top and start over.

John

[Sam Murdoch]

Hmmm, $162 for 1.3 liters. Is there a more economical source for this product without having to buy large quantities? I know my modifed phenolic goes a long, long way; maybe 1.3 liters is a lot (?).
.

Yes the price is painful when considering the amount in the can BUT it goes a long way. 1.3l will cover a room full of table tops. I have purchased at $ 155.00 delivered and at least 1 guy is selling for $ 120.00 delivered. As I wrote the 350ml was good for several projects and/or an average kitchen worth of doors and drawer fronts. My experience has convinced me that the price is far outweighed by the advantages. Consider, my projects required 1 coat of Watco and 1 coat of Monocoat and after the MC I was done. There is no worrying about bubbles, alligatoring, brush strokes, overspray or dust nibs - the project is done and beautiful. I'll post photos when I have time though, admittedly photos of finished work don't really tell the true story.

By the way - I came across this product from a reference from my wife. No investment in this stuff other than the 2.5 liters I will have used when my current project is complete. My 2¢ of course.

I can PM a reasonably priced and dependable source that I found on the auction sight if anyone cares to know. I tried to get a really super deal from one guy who fell off the earth but this 2nd guy has sent me two shipments, very well packed, priority mail delivery and better delivered price than the general retail selling price. He carries all the MonoCoat products.

[Robert LaPlaca]

Hmmm, $162 for 1.3 liters. Is there a more economical source for this product without having to buy large quantities? I know my modifed phenolic goes a long, long way; maybe 1.3 liters is a lot (?).
.

FWIW the product does seem to be available in a 350ml size for $53. First I have ever heard of the product ..

[Ian Scofield]

Thanks everyone for the responses thus far. I'm going to research some of these various options further, especially the rubio monocoat. Sam do you have any pictures of things you've finished with it? In looking online, all I can find are pictures of floors so I'm having trouble equating it to my table.


Prashun and John, do you have a specific oil/varnish finish you typically use? Would you be willing to share your go to method/process?


Lastly, does anyone have any additional thoughts/experience regarding the finish with breadboard ends? Will the oil/varnish finishes leave a film on top? if so, won't they crack once the center of the table expands/contracts?

[Prashun Patel]

For oilvarnish I mix equal parts Minwax poly , boiled linseed and mineral spirits. Again. This is not designed for durability, just ease of repair and application.

Also I would not apply oil varnish over dye. The reason is that it won't protect it. And if you have to do any sanding it can affect the dye. Last, wiping an oil varnish over dye can lead to dye lifting.

[Sam Murdoch]

Photos as requested. This finish does not create a crackable surface. It is like a highly refined waxed finish. The sheen is a satin. Can be bumped up with another of their products called UNIVERSAL MAINTENANCE OIL (again you need to select the color) but as oil sheens go this - to my eye is very nice. Reflects light better than Watco alone and encourages you to touch and slide your hand. Can be buffed as I mentioned to bump the sheen if desired.

Here are a few projects:

The drawer cabinet was the inspiration for using Watco & Mono Coat. The MC is expensive and I knew that in this "towel" cabinet most of the open shelving and cabinet interior did not need a hard shiny finish. The Watco brought it all together. Where the light shines the finish shines - where the light doesn't shine it all looks just right in the shadows.

Towel cabinet is Red Alder with Birds Eye Maple top.

Muir-Batch-Cabinet-copy.jpg Muir-Bath-Cabinet-End-view.jpg

Shoe Bench is of Butternut.

Muir-Bench-Left.jpg

My current project - 78 Red Birch doors of all sizes. Posting this because its fun . The 2nd photo shows a bit of the sheen.

Wood-Clunks.jpg Door-finish-1.jpg

I don't hesitate to recommend this MC for your project. The 350ml can will easily do your table and importantly in years to come will be very easy to sand and recoat - maybe 20 minutes work including sanding. I have learned that the mixed left overs can be stored in an air tight container at least overnight and still be used the next day. You might need to peel off a thin surface film but is still spreads and polishes off nicely. Even the bit of globs that normally you would filter out of varnish or other finishes can be spread on your work with no negative results. They just get rubbed off with your final clean rag pass.

Yup - I like it

Sam

[John TenEyck]

Sam, have you done any testing for chemical resistance? The finish looks so thin as if it's not even there so I have to wonder how well it will protect the wood with even just water sitting on it for a few hours. For low exposure furniture projects, sure, no problem, but for a table or kitchen cabinets I'd want to be sure it can stand up to a lot more than just water.

John

[Sam Murdoch]

John - I have not done any testing. This product is marketed and well reviewed as a 1 coat floor finish. None of the pieces I show in the photos will likely be subjected to the abuse that any floor will incur. I don't believe everything I read but I have read many reviews and talked (and emailed a few times) to one manufacturer of wood products who is very happy with this product as a furniture finish. We were discussing my plan of using Watco as the seal coat as well as the MC characteristics and durability.

I haven't had anything sitting in the shop longer than a few weeks to test the truly hardened finish - up until now. I can at least try an overnight standing water test on a finished piece. I'll let you know how that turns out.

[Robert Engel]

Finishing is my weakest point, but I will say you want to use an impermeable water stain resistant finish on a dining table.

I could be wrong, but I don't think an oil finish will provide this.

I'm getting ready to embark on a dining trestle table project of QSWO. I will definitely go with a spray finish for the top.

The only finishes I have considered so far are polyurethane and lacquer.

Hitching on the OP subject, how do you guys feel about poly and lacquer?

[Prashun Patel]

Depends what lacquer. Brushing lacquer is not very durable at all.

An oil finish may not be durable. An oil varnish finish is durable enough to resist typical spills. But like I Said, plan to refresh it periodically.

[Sam Murdoch]

Here is a link to one review which compares to other FLOOR products and discusses their test and results.

http://napervillehardwood.com/blog/t...rt-2-monocoat/

Other reviews also available if you look. I like it but certainly not everyone - or every project - will.

An important consideration is that it is intended to be applied to good solid surface BARE WOOD. I violated the bare wood rule with my WATCO pretreatment. Sanding between coats after several days of drying time seems to work very well. No problems whatsoever with adhesion. Just be aware that MonoCoat will not be compatible over most products. I do not know if a dye wood is considered a bare wood.

Secondly - it is easy to repair the surface - and invisibly so BUT - I don't know how invisible the repair would be if you were needing to sand an aged or sun exposed cherry or mahogany floor or table a year or two or longer after the effects of sunlight has darkened the wood. Could you still sand the surface and reapply MC without a color variance? Not likely would be my guess.

Will it stand up as a table top finish? I don't actually know from experience but the reviews of it as a floor finish are very encouraging that it will more than do that job well. The pieces I have delivered over the last 18 months are doing fine with daily use.

Just sayin'. Not offering the final word on this age old question by any means.