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Thread: Pine finish - shellac, then varnish

  1. #1

    Pine finish - shellac, then varnish

    I've been looking for the numerous threads on folks finishing pine and have narrowed done a plan for finishing my bedframe.

    The one comment I kept seeing for the initial stage is sticking with shellac. Maybe play around with garnet flakes as I do like the samples I've seen so far. Aside from the possible color change of the garnet flakes, I don't have any massive need to alter much else. Letting this age over time is just fine by me.

    Given how fast shellac can dry, what is the average number of layers to apply in a day via spraying? (assuming ideal spraying conditions) overall?

    One of the points mentioned about shellac though was needing to do a topcoat to achieve a semi-gloss or satin type sheen.

    Have my earlex 5500 station ready to dig into this, but aside from shellac I'm not as familiar with what varnish is idea to spray for this scenario.

    Could anyone offer some words of wisdom? specific topcoat product to look for? number of topcoats?

    Thank you

  2. #2
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    On small and medium sized projects on reasonably warm afternoons, I've done 3 and 4 coats of shellac with an HVLP. I generally work out on the driveway and so have to wait for the sun to swing over to the other side of the house so I'm working in open shade. A splash of turpentine gets added to the pot on days hotter than 80F to slow the dry time a smidge.

    I like garnet flakes for the color it imparts to just about everything. I keep super-blonde, amber (orange) and garnet on hand in dewaxed flakes. Probably cheaper to buy SealCoat in gallons if all you need is to use it as a sealer between color coats and topcoats like poly, etc. though. Any color of dewaxed shellac over top of pine is a good idea for sealing in the pitch. Even before painting.

    You can get nearly any sheen you want with shellac by working it over with various grits of steel wool, fine sandpaper, non-woven abrasive, felt-block+loose grit (rhottenstone, etc). Chance are you will need to at least rub down lightly to remove nibs and any bounce-back roughness anyway.
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  3. #3
    Thanks for the info.
    The weather here in mid WI is hanging around the high 70's for midday. Certainly not our normal but nobody is complaining on a mild summer!

    I do see that Woodcraft carries garnet flakes, but is there another store you would recommend checking out that might have better pricing?

    Although you mention being able to work the shellac via steel wool for a sheen, do you still recommend a final topcoat? The one point I kept running across when reading posts on shellac was it isn't terribly durable.

  4. #4
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    Try Lee Valley, I think they have better prices.

  5. #5
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    The shellac harvest has had several poor years, so prices have been up. Check out Tools for Working Wood.
    -- Jim

    Use the right tool for the job.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by James Morgan View Post
    The shellac harvest has had several poor years, so prices have been up. Check out Tools for Working Wood.

    TFWW is one of the most expensive sources of flakes around. Last large purchase I made was about 4 months ago from WellerMart (dot com). Quick check, super blonde is $27/lb vs about $46/lb for TFWW. Order more than $30 or $40 from WellerMart and you can get free ground shipping.
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  7. #7
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    Spraying varnish is a thankless task...the overspray is major sticky since varnish dries so slowly. The best finishes to spray are evaporative finishes, like shellac and lacquer (the latter only if you have proper environment) and water borne finishes.

    Your general plan is good...shellac to provide additional color, etc., followed by varnish for additional protection. If you choose to use varnish, if it contains polyurethane, you'll want to be sure to use de-waxed shellac for your first steps. That holds true if you opt for a water borne finish, too.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  8. #8
    Thanks Jim,
    I did come across the point about making sure shellac and any additives were de-waxed. Garnet flakes are in the de-waxed category though right?

    Would you have a specific varnish I should aim to try?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Young View Post
    TFWW is one of the most expensive sources of flakes around. Last large purchase I made was about 4 months ago from WellerMart (dot com). Quick check, super blonde is $27/lb vs about $46/lb for TFWW. Order more than $30 or $40 from WellerMart and you can get free ground shipping.
    Prices at Tools for Working Wood are a bit less than those at Lee Valley, Woodcraft, or Homestead Finishing. But you are right - the sale prices at Weller Mart are outstanding!
    -- Jim

    Use the right tool for the job.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy Patrick View Post
    Garnet flakes are in the de-waxed category though right?
    This is not automatic. There are dewaxed garnet flakes but, they will clearly state that they are dewaxed.
    "A hen is only an egg's way of making another egg".


    – Samuel Butler

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy Patrick View Post
    T
    Would you have a specific varnish I should aim to try?
    It's difficult for me to make a studied recommendation because I honestly haven't use an oil based varnish in many years. That said, Pratt and Lambert #38 and Waterlox are favorites of many folks who do use an oil based varnish. Both can be wiped or brushed and are quality products.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  12. #12
    If I were to stay away from oil based items, what would be your suggestion for a water based final topcoat for additional protection?

  13. #13
    when I looked on LV, their price was only 49 cents cheaper than woodcraft.

  14. #14
    or should I just stick with shellac and not worry about a final topcoat?
    I'm green enough on this that I'm simply looking for a direction you folks with far more experience can advise works. From there I'll branch out and try other things to gain my live and learn experience.

  15. #15
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    Personally, I use Target Coatings EM6000 most of the time, but there are quite a few great water borne clear finishes available from pretty much all of the "names", such as General Finishes. The benefit to these finishes is that they are low- or no-VOC and can be sprayed with simple safety gear, are designed for spraying, dry quickly for re-coating and offer a variety of features that can be desirable. The finish I generally use, for example, "burns in" chemically to previous coats in a way similar to solvent based lacquer which means you end up with "one layer" of finish once you're done.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

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