Problems with first time using wipe on polyurethane varnish.

[Matthew Schneider]

Having not used varnish before (I always used drying oils), I decided to experiment using Minwax wipe on polyurethane to refinish a pine table.

I used a blue paper shop towel to apply it. The first few very light coats seem to go very well.

Once it started to have a decent amount of varnish on it though, it started having problems. Marks started to show from wiping it on.

After reading about what I might be doing wrong, I tried putting the next coat on heavier, thinking it might be drying too quickly and not being able to self level. But that seemed to make things worse. More marks, and the texture was very rough. It took maybe 18 hours before I could sand it smooth (sanding it sooner would just make it very rough).

After sanding it down, it seemed pretty good. I cleaned off all the dust really well with a dry rag and then mineral spirits. I applied as thin a coat as I could without pushing around the finish with a dry rag. I could see I was leaving wiping marks, but it didn't seem like I could do anything to help it, and I hoped that it would just flatten out on its own.

It mostly looks fine now, but if I inspect it carefully, I can still see some wiping marks and it's rough again in some areas. I'm not really sure what to do at this point (sand it again with 320 and leave it be?), or what I've been doing wrong.

[Matthew Schneider]

Briefly describing my technique:
Wet a folded blue shop towel with varnish, enough so that it doesn't dry out right away. Rub it in a circular motion, working quickly to cover a large area, overlapping about 1/3 of what I've just done. Let it dry for about 4 hours. Hand sand it lightly with a block and 320 sandpaper. Clean thoroughly, and repeat.

[Dan Hulbert]

I found this several years ago and it works like champ:

I suggest 50/50 with mineral spirits becauseit is easier to type than any other ratio and easy to remember.

The number of coats in a given day is not important. Important is to apply awet coat with an applicator and merely get it on. Think of a 16 year old kidworking as a busboy at Denny's you have sent over to wipe off a table. Sort ofrub/swirl the material on like you would if you were applying a paste wax.Don't attempt any straight strokes. The applicator should be wet but notsoaked. The applicator can be a non-embossed paper towel shop towel, half aT-shirt sleeve or that one sock left after a load of washing. Once applied, leaveit alone. The surface should not be glossy or wet looking and, if appliedcorrectly, there should be no "brush stroke" type marks. If you havemissed a spot, ignore it - you will get it on the next coat. If you try and fixa missed spot you will leave a mark in the finish.

Timing for a second coat involves the pinkie test. Touch the surface with your pinkie. If nothing comes off you are ready for another coat. If was tacky 5 minutes ago but not now, apply your next coat just as you applied the previous coat. Remember, you are wet wiping, not flooding. After applying the second coat, let it fully dry for 48 hours. Using 320 paper and a sanding block lightly sand the surface flat. Now, begin applying more coats. Do not sand between coats unless you have allowed more than 24 hours to elapse since the prior coat. The number of coats is not critical - there is no critical or right number to apply. For those who need a rule, four more coats on non-critical surfaces or six more coats on surfaces that will get abraded seems to work.

After your last coat has dried at least over night you will have boogers in the surface. You should not have marks in the surface because you ignored application flaws. You may have dust, lint and, if you live in Texas, bug legs.Use a utility knife blade at this point. Hold it between your thumb and forefinger, near the vertical, and gently scrape the surface. Gentle is the important word - no harder than you would scrape your face. If you start scraping aggressively you will leave small cut marks in the surface. After you have scraped to the baby butt stage gently abrade the surface with 320 dry paperor a gray Scotch Brite. Clean off the surface. Now, leave the area for two hoursand change your clothes. Apply your last coat with a bit more care than the previous coats and walk away.

An anal person is going to have a tough time with this process. Missed spots have to be ignored. Wet wipe, don't flood. Scraping to babies butt smooth means scraping no harder than scraping a babies butt. Ignoring any of these will leave marks that are tough to get out. Getting these marks out requires some aggressive sanding to flatten out the surface and starting over.

Jim Kull

[Matthew Schneider]

I've been pretty careful not to go over spots that I've already done. Although because of the large surface of the table, I do have to apply it in one direction and then come back to parts that I just did. I'm not sure what the working time is or if it's an issue.

There must be something wrong with how I'm applying it, because there's definitely swirl marks immediately after I apply it. My best guess is that I'm putting too much on the towel / applying too much at a time. Should I apply little enough that the applicator quickly dries out? I find that it takes a fair bit on there to not dry out pretty quickly. Seeing it look wet has been how I've been able to tell which parts I've done... I guess that's wrong?

[Larry Frank]

I wait longer between coats than you. I generally wait 36-48 hours. I do not sand but use 0000 steel wool very lightly and clean off with a clean cloth. I put coats on with a clean soft rag and put it on kind of on the light side with light pressure. I do not have any marks or such. Right now I have one more coat to put on an oak dresser and looking good.

I have had excellent results with the Minwax wipe on Poly.

What temperature are you applying it.

[Prashun Patel]

what brand and what sheen are you using? Sometimes it can help if you thin it a little.

[John TenEyck]

Everyone has the best and easiest method, guaranteed to work. None did for me, so I won't bore you with my method. Most everyone will agree that thinning about 25 to 50% gives you more time to apply the finish and helps it self level, and that is what I recommend you do. It will take more coats, but that's a small price if they go on smoothly.

John

[Matthew Schneider]

I'm using the Minwax satin wipe on poly. The temperature has been in the mid 70's I think.

Just to verify, that's thinning down the already thin wiping varnish 25%-50%?

[John TenEyck]

Wiping varnish is not low solids, just low viscosity, at least that's the case for the Arm R Seal I use. So, yes, thin it 25 to 50%.

John

[Prashun Patel]

What sheen are you using? I have not found the need to thin minwax wiping varnish so much. Perhaps another 5-10 pct as the can is used.

Are you sanding between every coat? I would not. Sand between every three. The coat immediately following a sanding can be swirly.

[glenn bradley]

As is generally mentioned here, more numerous, thinner coats.

[Matthew Schneider]

I accidentally thinned it to about 1 part varnish 1 part mineral spirits, and it went on really nicely.

Tried again 3 hours later, thin time 2 parts varnish to 1 part mineral spirits. It went on kind of swirly again, although it's to be seen how it'll turn out when it dries.

I'll probably just stick to the thinner ratio in the future though.

[Matthew Schneider]

The thinner ratio is coming out pretty smooth and looks good... mostly.

If you look at it at the right angle though, it still looks covered in application marks despite the extremely thin/light coats. I think applying it in straight lines might actually help, but I'm not sure yet.

It seems to look best immediately after sanding it and cleaning it with mineral spirits, so maybe I'll just do that and leave it.

I'm still confused though, and just don't get it.

[John TenEyck]

FWIW, I've NEVER had success with the busboy technique. I know many claim it works for them, but the only way I've had success is to apply it parallel with the grain.

If you applied your initial coats using the busboy technique but then switch to wiping it parallel with the grain, you will still see those circular swirl marks through those subsequent coats if you don't sand them out completely first.

John