Upgrade Current TS or Buy a New TS? What would you do?

[Ken Frohnert]

I am still working fulltime (hopefully for 8 more years) but starting to look to retirement. I am pretty busy right now but I do like to get out to my shop - which is a free standing 250 square foot building and is wired for 220volts - 20 & 30 circuits. About 15 years ago I purchased an older Delta Unisaw (made in Pittsburg, Pa) - then happened on to the short Beismyer Fence on clearance at Lowes. BTW all my tools are mobile and the TS is on a heavy duty mobile base welded by old neighbor. Here is my dilemma:

I have a free standing router table which is big - I don't use it alot and would like to get rid of it. I was thinking of putting a cast iron wing extension to replace the Beismyer wood extension on the right ride of my cabinet saw. Doing this would run about $400 for the extension and fence. Then probably add another $350 for a lift. But that would free up significant space - and my TS mobile base would hold the weight no problem. However, the Unisaw is only 1.5 hp (kind of small for a cabinet saw and I don't have the motor cover which would run me $200 if a want to have any dust collection at all - which will not be great since it was not designed that way back then. It has a splitter not a riving knife - which I believe is a significant improvement. However, I love the fact my saw is made when USA made products were still great - and I doubt in terms of quality any of the newer saws will be better made.

Around my area TS come up on a regular basis so I can probably find a newer saw with a riving knife and dust collection ready with a 3hp motor; e.g. Grizzly G0690 (perhaps $1000 lightly used). Or a Powermatic 2000 for $1800 (used). Anyway something with more updated dust collection and a riving knife and more than enough power. Maybe one with an router table already onboard for a few more dollars. I would hope to be able to use my current mobile base on any saw I buy.

I just don't want to drop $400 for the extension and $200 to get a motor cover and then in a couple of years regret no having 3hp saw with a riving knife. Do you guys think upgrading to a 3hp motor and a riving knife is worth it? Or should I just put the money into upgrades on my current Unisaw?

Assuming you think I should wait and find another newer saw on C/L any particular saws I should be looking out for?

[Mike Cutler]

Ken

For $600.00, I can buy a complete 3HP Unisaw on Craigslist. Even in New England.
Me personally, I would upgrade.

The riving knife is another issue. If it's important to you, you're limited to "newer" table saws. There are after market alternatives.

For the $750.00 projected, for the router extension and lift, I'd buy a used 3hp, Delta 43-xxx shaper first.

[Roger Marty]

Depends on what you value. I personally don't care about 3 hp, but I love the peace-of-mind knowing that if I make a mental mistake, that my SawStop will probably do its job and save my flesh.

[Matt Day]

Do you have a 1.5hp bullet motor? That’s what I’ve got, and I used to have a 3hp motor in an import saw. I don’t notice much of a difference. I work predominantly with 4/4 and 8/4 stock and it cuts it without issue.

I also have the Unisaw pop up splitter. It’s worked great and a riving knife isn’t a big enough step up for me to justify a new saw.

As for the router table extension, you’d use that on any ts right? Current or new one? Why not put it on now then? As for cost, you can save a few bucks using a Router Raizer for $100. I’ve got one on my 3hp Hitachi and it’s worked great.

[Cary Falk]

I was about in the same boat 5 years ago. I had a 3hp 1972 Uni that I restored. I had the Biesemeyer snap in splitter but wanted a riving. There were a couple of things that bothered me about the Uni that bothered me. I sold the Uni and bought a G1023RL. I think the swap cost me $300 out of pocket. I couldn't be happier. Life is too long to be unhappy. If you want a riving knife and can afford it, go for it. The Grizzly table saws are not a downgrade from a Uni.

[glenn bradley]

You will have to sort through the responses on this one, including mine. There are folks who love the Unisaw and who love old American iron. I applaud them, that's not me. There are folks who love "Euro-sliders" and feel anything else, even American, is inferior. There are folks who hate any ThaiChi machine and some particular color in particular. I respect their right to their opinion, that's not me.

I ran an American made Delta in the 70's that was a decent machine. I ran an Emerson made Craftsman from the 80's that was about the same. I've run cab saws and hybrid and Jet's and Saw Stops, . . . and lions and tigers, oh my. I have run a router wing format for years and my router table is even still bolted to my saw station so I can share work surfaces. This does not make me an authority. That's OK because no matter how much I know or think I know, it is the solution that fits you that will be best.

I found my 1-3/4HP hybrid Craftsman/Orion 22124 to have plenty of power. I too moved to a new saw for the riving knife (and thanks to an unexpected windfall). The cuts in general from my more powerful, heavier current machine are better. My confidence in using the saw for the many, many things I use a tablesaw for, is better. If all I did was crosscut and rip with the occasional dado thrown in I may have never changed.

You have additional challenges. You want a riving knife, you want better dust collection (and we both know the machine is only a small portion of that accomplishment), you want to add a router table and you want to be mobile.

The Grizzly G0690 and their G1023 both have a loyal following, the current versions come with riving knives and they are inexpensive.

The Saw Stop PCS has a riving knife, a well praised mobile base and a fit and finish that often wins the bake-offs.

The Powermatic PM2000 is a very nice machine as is the Saw Stop ICS. Both are heavier machines so the mobile base may be the tipping factor here if the price isn't.

Your router wing options may also affect your tablesaw choice but, you mention it is seldom used (something I cannot even imagine but, this is about you ) so that may not be a deal breaker on any of your choices.

Make a short list of what is important to you. This will differ from what is important to others. It is a crowded field of opinions and preferences. Filter through everything and then apply what you learn against your short list of things that are important to you. I hope this helps with your decision.

[Jim Becker]

My advise to you is do what you want/need to do now while you're working because it will likely be more difficult to accomplish after you retire. I actually retired at midnight a week ago Saturday and am truly thankful that I made my shop decisions in previous years. I know this doesn't cover the "what to do", but the "when to do it" is while you still have potential "disposable income". While many of us have done the right thing and will have a relatively comfortable retirement with regards to normal living expenses, most of us will have to cut back on non-essential spending.

For "me", a riving knife would be an essental safety consideration because it's on the saw 100% of the time and for all kinds of operations, both through and non-through cuts. But that's a personal preference. That said, those older US-made saws are very nice and certainly worthy of upgrading, too.

[Frederick Skelly]

. I actually retired at midnight a week ago Saturday .....

Congratulations Jim! Enjoy every minute!
Fred

[Jacob Mac]

I think these are tough decisions bc you are guessing about the quality, price, and availability of the used saw. I would keep an eye out for a good used saw, and if it doesn't happen in a reasonable period of time, just upgrade. But there are a ton of variables in the used market.

[John TenEyck]

I have a 1954 Unisaw, born the same year as me. As far as I can tell, it still works as well as when it was new; I'm showing a little more wear and tear. It has a 1.5 HP modern Rockwell motor on it, not the bullet motor. I have often wished for but never needed more. If you are a hobbiest who rarely intends to cut anything thicker than 8/4 then you won't either; with a sharp blade it cuts fine. And if you don't believe that, or just have to have a larger motor, then find one and install it on your current saw.

I find a splitter to work just fine for me. But a splitter, or a riving knife, is just one piece of safety equipment, the overhead guard being the other critical one. I rarely see a guard on any TS, except my own, yet it is equally important in helping reduce injury. Installing a guard would be a far better use of your funds compared to a riving knife. If you have a guard on your saw now, great. If you have one but don't have it installed, please do. If you don't have one, please buy one.

You don't need to spend $200 on a motor cover. It's easy enough to make a plywood box to cover the motor opening and that's what I did. It hangs on a cleat I bolted to the saw and takes just a few seconds to remove if needed. Same thing with the front door. My saw didn't have one so I made one; not a big deal. Dust collection? Sure, a new saw will collect most all the dust if you buy the right one, but I have no issues with my old saw. I have a top guard that has a dust pickup built into it and nothing more than the typical 4" hose connection on the back of the saw cabinet. It doesn't get everything that goes down into the cabinet, so every few weeks I have to clean it out through the front door. It takes all of 10 minutes.

I put a cast iron router table on my saw, w/o a lift, and like it a lot as well as the freed up real estate. I use the TS rip fence with the router function; just clamp a supplemental fence to it when needed. Lifts? Nice maybe, but certainly not necessary to doing good work.


John


Jim, congratulations on your recent retirement. Welcome to weeks where every day is Saturday. You soon will wonder how you ever had time for work.

[Mike Kees]

Ken,I agree with with John and Jim and Glen. I personally have two Unisaws set up and in use. Check out a Sharkguard. I have installed them on my saws and really like the way they collect dust. I have 5'' duct connected to the base of the cabinets and it works pretty well but I am still' tweaking'my dust collection.I also have built two motor covers from plywood. On my jobsite saw (delta contractor) I use a extension wing router table,works really well,I also use my fence as John described. At the end of the day it is your shop and only you can truly decide what you will do. You have a good machine that with a few upgrades will be fine or you can sell and buy something else. Good luck ,Mike.

[Bill Adamsen]

These ideas about improving efficiency and evaluating upgrades are always so interesting. Of course there are always more variables than we the readers can really understand.

I too have an older Unisaw (34-802) purchased new about 25-30 years ago. At one time I had an extension table with a shop fabricated undermount router. It worked but there are better ways. In your limited 250 square feet of space I think a separate router table, even if portable (like Roland Johnson's "stow and go" table) would make more sense. That's just me and the way I work.

Your other questions about power and dust collection. While my machine came with a the motor cover, the dust collection configuration was very poorly planned. I worked with it like that until about two years ago when I said, "enough is enough." I modified the original (see photo) and it now works quite well. I built the mods in scrap plywood and angle iron. I don't see why you couldn't do the same for your saw including the motor cover. The engineering is not especially sophisticated and you should be able to make something in an afternoon that works quite well. If you buy the cover you will still spend a good part of the day getting it configured properly. If this is a saw you have successfully worked with until now (thinking power) there is no reason it shouldn't keep serving you into the future. In other words, keep your saw and your cash.

In order to make the footprint smaller I removed the extension table, cut down the rolling base, cut-off the Unifence, and added a factory cast iron extension wing. It works great for how I use it which is box joints, rabbets and dadoes (none of which would require a riving knife). Cut down in size it is much more portable.

[Mike Wilkins]

I once owned a 1 1/2 horse Unisaw of 1964 vintage. Built my own dust door out of plywood, cut a hole in the back for a dust port and made many projects with it. Rarely had a problem with the horse power number.
With your limited space, I would keep the current machine and add a router table extension that replaces one of the wings, add a lift and call it a day.
In the future, if and when you get more space, you can always upgrade; or not.
The cast iron Bench Dog unit looks real tasty.

[Michelle Rich]

Sharkguard makes a riving knife retro to fit unisaws. It is called the Delta ARk.

[Terry Wawro]

I envy you guys that live in areas where you can find lots of good hand tools at flea markets and decent power tools on craigslist. It must be a regional thing. I live in South Carolina (near Greenville) and the pickin's are slim in this part of the south. That is unless you're looking for rusty Craftsman table saws at Delta prices.