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Thread: Lie-Nielsen Issues

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    I agree with Patrick that it’s obvious that the lever cap can never tighten and loosen the way it is. I’m less sure that it is due to a miss drilled hole. It looks like to me that the hole is in the right place or the cap would not be flush on the finished side.
    If you look at the pictures closely and visualize where the lever's pivot point is for each of the two cap irons, you can see that the bad one's pivot point is further "back" along the long axis of the lever. That wouldn't impact its flushness on the finished side, though it would impact the gap between the base (non-toggle, cam end) of the lever and the cap.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    What I think the problem is that they missed a step in finishing the lever part of the cap. When the lever is at a right angle to the cap, there is too much material protruding. If you wanted to, 5 minutes with a file on the protruding piece would tune it right up. Clearly you shouldn’t have to do that on a new plane, but if you are tired of waiting, just take a mill file and remove the thickness between the spring and the lever when it is sprung so it looks like the one that works.
    Yep, that's the "file fix" that I alluded to in post #2. It's not without downside though. If you look at the right picture you'll see that he'll have to file the entire end of the lever off, and that will create a larger (cosmetic) gap between the base of the lever and the cap when the lever is in engaged/flush position.

    The more I think about this the more I think L-N may have botched a design change or mold replacement here. From personal experience as a product designer it happens to even the best teams sometimes (though far less often than to not-best teams). I'm no longer convinced that a simple machining error could move the pivot point that far. That would explain why they shipped two identically bad lever caps in a row, and are having trouble shipping the fourth one.

  2. #17
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    I'm surprised in the variability in these parts. They certainly don't look like 'production' parts to me. They look more like model shop experiments. In fact, having three that don't work really bothers me more than anything. I think LN should step up and resolve this properly, not by the customer having to file the parts to work properly, which they have ample opportunity to do. I think I would send it back and ask for a complete refund at this point.

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Chase View Post
    I'm no longer convinced that a simple machining error could move the pivot point that far. That would explain why they shipped two identically bad lever caps in a row, and are having trouble shipping the fourth one.
    Good analysis here.

    It always amazes me (not specific to this case) that people often don't pay enough attention when trying to fix or dealing with a screw-up situation.

    In another tool specific forum, users share how frustrated they are when their tool maker fails them not once but twice or even thrice in the same repair/service transaction. I have also experienced something similar with a new vehicle, going back to the car dealership a few times on the same problem that wasn't fixed properly in the first place.

    A mistake made is a learning opportunity, but only if it is fixed as speedily and satisfactorily as the circumstances allow and is not allowed to repeat itself. As a woodworker, when I deal with a blunder, I pay 101% of my attention to the process of preparation and fixing as I know if I screw up on a screw-up, it could become a fatal blunder.

    Treating an unusual or untypical error with the usual level of attention to details is often a recipe for further predicaments.

    Simon
    Last edited by Simon MacGowen; 11-16-2017 at 8:44 AM.

  4. #19
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    I would suggest that you send a PM to Rob Lee, who is a contributor here at SMC and a principal at Lee Valley Tools.
    Lee Schierer
    USNA '71
    Go Navy!

    My advice, comments and suggestions are free, but it costs money to run the site. If you found something of value here please give a little something back by becoming a contributor! Please Contribute

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
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    Broadview Heights, OH
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    What would Rob Lee say, except maybe you should have bought a LV and not a Lie Nielsen?

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Schierer View Post
    I would suggest that you send a PM to Rob Lee, who is a contributor here at SMC and a principal at Lee Valley Tools.
    Did you mix up on the company here? The OP is not having an issue with a Lee Valley product.

    Simon

  7. #22
    Send a note to Tom - the two times I've had an issue in 20+ years of dealing with LN, both were resolved quickly. When the #4 came out and my first lot plane had a yoke issue, new frog assembly FEDEX'd and received in a day. When the infil on my 1/2" bronze body shoulder loosened a bit after 15 years of use, Tom repaired it and paid shipping both ways. Call or email him - only takes a moment.

  8. #23
    I called them first thing this morning. The gentleman I talked to looked at the pictures I had sent and wanted to further investigate after I explained everything. So I'm waiting for a call back. I would hope they would try to make up for the everything, but I doubt it.

  9. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Stock View Post
    Send a note to Tom - the two times I've had an issue in 20+ years of dealing with LN, both were resolved quickly. When the #4 came out and my first lot plane had a yoke issue, new frog assembly FEDEX'd and received in a day. When the infil on my 1/2" bronze body shoulder loosened a bit after 15 years of use, Tom repaired it and paid shipping both ways. Call or email him - only takes a moment.
    Do you have his contact info you could send me? It's not on their site.

  10. #25
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    Jul 2015
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    Steven,

    As a consumer who has paid top dollar for a premium product, it's not your responsibility to act as their unpaid quality control. I'd tell them to issue a call tag for it and issue a refund. That's assuming you bought it direct, if you didn't, I'd do the same with whoever you bought it from. One time you can chalk it up to stuff happens. Twice, maybe. Three times, you are out. Works for baseball and for life.

    Let us know how you make out.

    Pete

  11. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    Steven,

    As a consumer who has paid top dollar for a premium product, it's not your responsibility to act as their unpaid quality control. I'd tell them to issue a call tag for it and issue a refund. That's assuming you bought it direct, if you didn't, I'd do the same with whoever you bought it from. One time you can chalk it up to stuff happens. Twice, maybe. Three times, you are out. Works for baseball and for life.

    Let us know how you make out.

    Pete

    I actually purchased it from Craftsman Studio. I contacted them first when all of this happened and he talked to LN and was told to have me contact them directly. You think they should issue a refund for the whole purchase? And what's a call tag?
    Last edited by Steven Harrison; 11-16-2017 at 10:05 AM.

  12. #27
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    Absolutely. Do you have a functioning plane? If Craftsman Studio won't send a new one that works, I'd initiate a charge back. As a consumer, you have more power than you know. You paid with a CC, and you didn't get what you paid for. You have gone above and beyond to work it out, and waited over a month for that to happen. Short of creating your own sand cast patterns and making your own lever cap in your backyard, I don't know what more you should be expected to do. If random people like Patrick and I can see the problem immediately, why can't Lie-Nielsen? Not their finest hour.

  13. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    Absolutely. Do you have a functioning plane? If Craftsman Studio won't send a new one that works, I'd initiate a charge back. As a consumer, you have more power than you know. You paid with a CC, and you didn't get what you paid for. You have gone above and beyond to work it out, and waited over a month for that to happen. Short of creating your own sand cast patterns and making your own lever cap in your backyard, I don't know what more you should be expected to do. If random people like Patrick and I can see the problem immediately, why can't Lie-Nielsen? Not their finest hour.
    Very true. I'm stuck, because I want this plane and what are the alternatives? So your opinion is keep the plane, try and get a new part, and get a refund?

  14. #29
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    Jul 2015
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    No, I'd tell TLN that I'm done acting as their quality control. Issue a call tag to pick up their parts plane, and send you one that works. That's what you paid for, and that what you want. They may offer more than that to compensate for your time and effort, but I think it's asking too much to expect that you get it for free.

    Your only other option is to buy a LV if you are only interested in a new, production plane. Otherwise, there are plenty of used tool dealers that can sell you a #7 or #8.

  15. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    No, I'd tell TLN that I'm done acting as their quality control. Issue a call tag to pick up their parts plane, and send you one that works. That's what you paid for, and that what you want. They may offer more than that to compensate for your time and effort, but I think it's asking too much to expect that you get it for free.

    Your only other option is to buy a LV if you are only interested in a new, production plane. Otherwise, there are plenty of used tool dealers that can sell you a #7 or #8.
    I will see what they say when they call back and go from there. Thanks
    Last edited by Steven Harrison; 11-16-2017 at 10:22 AM.

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