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Thread: List of replacement impellers for HF dust collector?

  1. #1

    List of replacement impellers for HF dust collector?

    I've seen the Rikon 60-200 impeller mentioned several times as an upgrade for the HF dust collector, but does anyone know which other impellers will fit without modification?

    I would bet that several other manufacturers use the same impeller as Rikon, so there should be other sources.
    Last edited by Craig Starnes; 12-06-2017 at 1:01 PM.

  2. #2
    All this interest and nary a reply.

    How about this... does anyone have the specs of the Rikon impeller (shaft size, weight, exact diameter... any other pertinent info needed to source one independently?)

  3. #3
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    If the Rikon is known to fit, why not just use it?

  4. #4
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    Craig - I am using a HF unit with a Wynn filter - has anyone measured what kind of improvement we can get by going to the bigger impeller?

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by John Lanciani View Post
    If the Rikon is known to fit, why not just use it?
    Mainly because they are backordered until mid February...but it also wouldn't hurt to have some other alternatives; maybe even less expensive ones since Rikon apparently has the "HF impeller upgrade" market cornered and is taking advantage of it.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Schreib View Post
    Craig - I am using a HF unit with a Wynn filter - has anyone measured what kind of improvement we can get by going to the bigger impeller?
    I haven't seen any hard numbers, but the general consensus seems to be a significant improvement once the proper impeller is installed.

  7. #7
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    I just did a google search and a guy on the Thien forum says that the Grizzly 12 3/4 by 3 1/2 impeller # P1028Z2010 works.

    On another forum a guy says that his cfm at the end of a 41 ft run went from 325 cfm to 640cfm. He was exhausting outside so no filter to add resistance.

    Good luck

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Schreib View Post
    I just did a google search and a guy on the Thien forum says that the Grizzly 12 3/4 by 3 1/2 impeller # P1028Z2010 works.

    On another forum a guy says that his cfm at the end of a 41 ft run went from 325 cfm to 640cfm. He was exhausting outside so no filter to add resistance.

    Good luck
    Did the Grizzly have to be machined to fit the HF shaft? The only other impeller I saw referenced required the hole to be opened up a little...but I don't remember if it was that Grizzly or not.

    Thanks

    EDIT:

    After some more searching and reading, it looks like the Grizzly impeller was too heavy for the HF motor (even though it is for a 1-1/2hp machine?), and the shaft diameter wasn't exactly correct. So, we're still at only the Rikon impeller so far.
    Last edited by Craig Starnes; 12-07-2017 at 3:09 PM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    A few words on HF DC.

    I have the HF D.C. It was a gift to me, and I have made considerable changes to the original system.I added the Supper Dust Deputy and the Wynn 35 A filter. I also removed the original impeller cover that was 5 inches in Diameter made a new cover plate from MDF and used a 6 inch HVAC to connect the blower to the suction side of the Supper Dust Deputy.
    Opening the suction from 5 inches with obstructions to 6 inches a straight pipe connecting to the SDD, I gained a lot more air flow. On the exhaust side of the blower I did use the stock HF dust ring I trashed the dust distribution system I mean the dust bag and replaced the bag with the Wynn 35A filter. To couple the dust ring to the exhaust of the blower I used a plastic ABS coupling from Lowes $1.98 seriously I found it with abs plastic gutter drain pipe, it is called a snap coupling.
    The Wynn Filter also increased the air flow another major increase the Wynn has much less airflow restrictions that the dust bag.
    I do not have the instrumentation to propely state airflow numbers I hate to say however I do have an Amp probe to measure the current flow of the motor. With the motor running and stableized it draws 10.0 amps other considerations are my Altitude I am at 1900 feet above Mean Sea Leval (MSL) and this is with the stock impeller.
    my duct system! I am using all 5 inch ducting. If you want to use 5 inch PVC find a well driller supply,Well drillers use 5 inch PVC for well caseing.

    The Rikon 60-200 impeller $99.00 from Rikon $8.00 Fed ex Shipping from MA to West Texas. The bad news I ordered the impeller last October 15, the good news it is scheduled to arrive on Friday October 8. 2017 Yahoo.

    At one time when the impeller was $60.00 from Rikon they were reluctant to sell the impeller without a serial number from a Rikon D.C. System. I guess they decided to sell them on the open market because the parts guy told me they were back ordered due to the HF conversation popularity. When I ordered the fan in October I was told I should have it by Nov 15 that date was pushed back.

    I also ordered a fan hub puller from eBay $20.00 I have a 3 jaw gear puller however it will not grasp the cutout's on the fan hub to remove the fan from the motor shaft. Don't think about using a drift to hammer the shaft off the fan unless you want to replace the motor or the bearings. Don't ask how I know.

    I made another upgrade a Dust Sentry to monitor the dust level in my dust collector bucket. Search other threads for this mod well worth it. My dust bucket is not real deep due The the available vert height in my garage 8 foot. If the dust bucket fills up at some point the dust will get sucked into the filter, not good so I found the proximity sensor Banner QS18VP6D
    for $35.00 and a 12 volt led strobe light for $ 2.95 and a $2.50 2 amp power cube all from eBay. I hooked it all up and thought the strobe is there but I might not see it since it is not real bright to reflect off of the walls unless I am looking at it. So I decided to add sound. I had an old smoke detector that was not being used so I first removed the son alert from the PCB when I applied 12 volts to the contacts no sound was emitted. I reinstalled it back in the PCB applied power to the smoke detector battery contacts pressed the test button and it sounded. I messured the current draw to be sure I did not exceed the ma limit of the Banner QS18VP6D. The combined current draw of both the smoke detector and the strobe did not exceed the senor so I now have an audible as well as a visual alert to dust height in the duct barrel.

    Since the sensor does does not have a test feature I made a little pattle that I could swing in front of the sensor to simulate the dust level exceedance. Bear in mind that the dust collection buscket can not have any air leaks if you do it will cause the filter to clog because it is sucking dust from the bucket. Leaks are BAD. Filters clogging are bad too!
    More on that next.

    How I made a leak free way of moving the test paddle in the beam of the sensor! Simple I used all thread a 10 inch 1/4-20
    Length made a paddle at the bottom with two 1/4-20 nuts holding it. I drilled a hole and tapped the hole in the MDF cover of bust barrel the MDF being 3/4 of an inch thick gave me many threads to act as a seal thus not having leak plugging up my filter.

    How much suction do I Have? As I said before I do not have the proper instrumentation to give definitive numbers of CFM.
    But I do have two Manometers to messure relative efficiency, one to monitor back pressure on the filter, filter back pressure is bad i.e. Clogged filter (maybe caused by leak in dust barrel!��)
    On the inlet or suction side also called pressure side I have a Manometer that allows me to evaluate what the effect of adding bends and flexible ducting have to the system. I.e. Using two 45's rather than a 90 degree bend.

    If I had it to do over again!!! What would I do?

    Cost?

    HF DC free but could be bought on sale $169.00
    Supper Dust Deputy $200.00 delived (round figures)
    Wynn 35A filter delivered $208.00
    Bannor sensor dust depth sensor system $40.00 (power cube, strobe, sensor)
    misc other things scavenged
    $108 Rikon 12 inch empeller

    i can not consider the cost of the flex duct or ridigid ducting because I would have that with any other system.

    If you had to purchase the items above you would have about $750.00 into the project.
    me I would look into a real 3 HP system with a two stage Cyclone separation system with a hepa filter equal to the Wynn 35A

    With all the the changes I have made the weak point is now the HF motor. They call it a 2 HP motor I doubt if it really is.
    more like 1.5 my guess how will adding the 12.0 inch Rikon fan affect the performance it has to get better considering I am at 1900 feet MSl, at Sea level maybe not the HF motor may not be able to spool up the larger fan with out exceeding the current limits of the motor.

    That is my storie!

    Lane

  10. #10
    Join Date
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    I for got to add photos
    IMG_0134.jpg
    IMG_0133.jpgIMG_0082.jpg

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig Starnes View Post
    Did the Grizzly have to be machined to fit the HF shaft? The only other impeller I saw referenced required the hole to be opened up a little...but I don't remember if it was that Grizzly or not.

    Thanks

    EDIT:

    After some more searching and reading, it looks like the Grizzly impeller was too heavy for the HF motor (even though it is for a 1-1/2hp machine?), and the shaft diameter wasn't exactly correct. So, we're still at only the Rikon impeller so far.

    First off a 12 3/4 inch impeller will not fit in the housing of the HF blower with out serious modifications, the Areo dynamics of the fan housing may not support a positive outcome!

    the Rikon 12 inch will barely fit through the original hole.
    2 nd I doubt the HF motor has enough HP to swing a 12 3/4 inch fan unless it was on Mount McKennly.
    I would even say that the HF motor would burn up in Denver at 5000 feet with that Fan.

  12. #12
    Thanks for all the info Lane. I talked to Rikon today, and they said they would have impellers sometime mid-February. Not sure on the cost, but I've heard around $120 now (shipped). Being on a tight budget, I went with the HF @ $149, since there is so much "positive" feedback on them once they are modded. I also picked up the new 4" Dust deputy with the fiber drum, and got it all assembled into a nice frame and vented it outside my shop.


    I was also thinking about moving it up to the loft to make more room, but not sure if it could handle the added vertical lift. But...


    Now that I've been researching all of this after-the-fact, I'm a bit bummed out to find out that 4" systems in general aren't even adequate enough to make the charts on most of the websites I've studied. So now I can't decide if I should go ahead and upgrade what I have to the Rikon impeller and run what I brung, or just return/sell it and stick to a damn shop vac in my hobby shop.

  13. #13
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    Craig,
    if I were in your shoes I would see if Oneida would exchange your 4 inch for the Supper Dust Deputy or take it back as Wood craft has the SDD on sale for $149.00, the 5 inch ducting will serve you much better even with a stock fan.
    if you have room to stack the blower on to of the Supper Dust Deputy that will give you even more airflow if you use a six inch HVAC duct as I did.
    The HVAC duct you see is called a flanged take off 6 inch and fits perfectly into the SDD.$6.00 Lowes.
    Ducting your exhaust outside will be a plus as well.

    my Rikon Fan arrived today! $108.00 shipped. But I did order it last OCT.
    i will take measurements of current draw and how many inches of Water to compare to the new fan?
    and post that info.

    if you need any more info feel free to PM me and we can exchange phone numbers.

    Lane

    IMG_0208.jpgIMG_0206.jpg

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Lane Hardy View Post
    Craig, if I were in your shoes I would see if Oneida would exchange your 4 inch for the Supper Dust Deputy or take it back as Wood craft has the SDD on sale for $149.00, the 5 inch ducting will serve you much better even with a stock fan. if you have room to stack the blower on to of the Supper Dust Deputy that will give you even more airflow if you use a six inch HVAC duct as I did. The HVAC duct you see is called a flanged take off 6 inch and fits perfectly into the SDD.$6.00 Lowes. Ducting your exhaust outside will be a plus as well. my Rikon Fan arrived today! $108.00 shipped. But I did order it last OCT. i will take measurements of current draw and how many inches of Water to compare to the new fan? and post that info. if you need any more info feel free to PM me and we can exchange phone numbers. Lane IMG_0208.jpgIMG_0206.jpg
    Unfortunately, I'm probably stuck with the 4" setup for a while. If the Rikon impeller shows substantial gains for you, I may upgrade mine and run with it for a while. Anxious to hear your results and any additional info on it that you can provide.

    Thanks again!

  15. #15
    I can't figure out how to get a picture to post properly for some reason, but here is a link to what I have right now. http://www.jcsautomation.com/temp/dc.jpg

    I actually have fairly decent flow (suction?) as it is. It seems that the 4" dust deputy and venting outside is a pretty good match when mated directly to the inlet via 5" hose. The cone itself actually has a 5" inlet opening, so I cut off the 4" part of the "inlet" that they provide, flipped it upside down, and cemented it into the opening. (It's actually just a 4" to 5" reducer like this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1 ) The dust bin sits on a hinged platform with latches in the front, and is super easy to remove and empty. It seals against some weatherstripping at the top with light pressure from the latches.

    I still might move it to the loft above to gain some floor space. Just not sure if it has enough oomph to lift anything 8 feet...although fighting gravity probably isn't much different than frictional losses from pulling it along a pipe or hose. Regardless of where it ends up, the ducting will be mostly rigid SDR-35 PVC with gradual curves, etc.

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