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Thread: Made In USA Bar Clamp

  1. #31
    One problem is the Chinese are notorious for cutting corners. Although a company may specify a certain grade of material unless they have qualified inspectors on site that may not be what they get.

  2. #32
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    Seems to be why 99% of what comes from there is still just straight-up garbage.

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    I'm not sure I understand why it makes any difference where a product is made. It seems to me that every product stands on its own in terms of price and quality.
    I agree and this is a position I have long taken. Its not an issue that Chinese products are bad by default. But thats the way the U.S. consumer has looked at it for the last 20 years as opposed to the actual facts of the situation which is that China produces exactly what its told to produce from greedy corporations based all around the world and in the US. They, and other Asian countries, can produce whatever we are willing to pay them for, its not their fault that we capitalize on their willingness to wrap a bag of dog poop in the shape of a bar clamp and sell it to us at HF.


    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    My belief is that only a handful of dinosaurs would attribute anything to the Made in the USA differentiation when it really comes time to buy.
    US manufacturers can make equally as much junk as imports but while it may not be accurate across the board, made in the US more often than not equates to a corporate philosophy that is very much different than that of the corporation who is willing to do anything and everything possible with a focus solely on profit. Not on their employees, their community, and so on. I dont think its being a dinosaur to remember back to the days when large manufacturers were part of the community. They employed large percentages of entire towns. While profits were always, and will always be, the main motivation for any business they look at their employees and community as family as well as financial assets(or liabilities) to their business. Its not an outdated concept. Look at simple advertising like My Pillow where the guy starts a manufacturing facility in his home town and is proud to admit that he is an active part of his home town community.

    Thats I guess what many of us "dinosaurs" (heh funny Im only 50) think of when we think of domestic products. The cost is going to be more due to safe workplace, employee protection, higher overhead, somewhat environmentally regulated, and so on, but the quality is 9 times out of 10 going to smoke the import.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lloyd McKinlay View Post
    One problem is the Chinese are notorious for cutting corners. Although a company may specify a certain grade of material unless they have qualified inspectors on site that may not be what they get.
    Oh, and other countries don't do that!?!?
    The fellow responsible for the Volkswagen/Diesel fraud finally went to prison. Should have sent everyone involved to prison

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Wade Lippman View Post
    Oh, and other countries don't do that!?!?
    The fellow responsible for the Volkswagen/Diesel fraud finally went to prison. Should have sent everyone involved to prison

    Spot on. In the case of the Chinese you cant actually blame them for trying to wring every cent out of companies who are going in there and knowingly exploiting the situation while the Chinese business owners are screwing their own people into the ground to get rich. I have always found it interesting that we in the U.S. learned the pitfalls of the industrial revolution the hard way. We learned that when we shaft our workers we wind up with unions that spiral out of control and drive costs through the roof. We wind up with OSHA regulations that spiral out of control and drive costs up. We wind up with workers compensation policies that spiral out of control and drive costs up. On, and on, and on rather than just being honest and responsible businesses. And now, we are shafting another nation down the same path (and hitching our horse directly to them). Doesnt anyone think that in time China environmental regs, workplace safety regs, employee injury regs, are not going to be implemented? And then what? We look for the next cheap source for goods? There arent many more left lol.

    The one I remember the most is the Foxconn factory in China having to implement catch nets around the perimeter of their facility building IPhones for apple. The nets were called "Nets of Love". The enslaved workers, who are kept within the facility and work to have their room and board, food expenses at the cafeteria, laundry expenses, clothing, shoes, and so on, taken directly out of their pay and paid to "the company store" (remember the coal wars here in the US where the coal industry enslaved entire towns and charged them for housing and food leaving them with nothing to ever get out and find better work). The catch nets were installed around Foxconn because it was such a great place to work that workers were throwing themselves out windows, off the roof, any way they could because life in the plant building Iphones was such a rewarding career.

  6. #36
    its okay foxxconn is moving to another third world wisconsin

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Bolton View Post


    US manufacturers can make equally as much junk as imports but while it may not be accurate across the board, made in the US more often than not equates to a corporate philosophy that is very much different than that of the corporation who is willing to do anything and everything possible with a focus solely on profit. Not on their employees, their community, and so on. I dont think its being a dinosaur to remember back to the days when large manufacturers were part of the community. They employed large percentages of entire towns. While profits were always, and will always be, the main motivation for any business they look at their employees and community as family as well as financial assets(or liabilities) to their business. Its not an outdated concept. Look at simple advertising like My Pillow where the guy starts a manufacturing facility in his home town and is proud to admit that he is an active part of his home town community.
    Mark, I completely understand your point, I was just trying to say it would only be the exceptional, outlier customer that would willingly pay more because something was "Made in USA", at least in the present day. I think it might be dangerous to put out a product with the hope that being made in the USA would be a meaningful marketing advantage.

    Unfortunately, it's harder for companies to live by the social responsibility ethics you're describing if they're publicly traded or financed by private equity and venture capital groups where financial performance is the only criteria that matters. Sorry if the term dinosaur came off badly, it was my way of saying some of the old time corporate philosophies and domestic advantage seem on the way to extinction.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Bolton View Post
    Doesnt anyone think that in time China environmental regs, workplace safety regs, employee injury regs, are not going to be implemented? And then what? We look for the next cheap source for goods? There arent many more left lol.
    A lot of people, myself included, believe the next "cheap" source of labor will be a massive migration to automation, namely robotics and AI. These technologies have the potential to reduce the labor cost component of manufacturing lower than the cheapest country by a wide margin. Think about it, no medical or other benefits, no holidays, no employment regulations, no management, no errors. Productivity could be 24/7. China will be too expensive (although maybe they'll be manufacturing the robots!).

    It's mind boggling what many thriving domestic manufacturers are already doing with robotics. Just look at the YouTube videos on the Amazon fulfillment centers and the Tesla factory.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lloyd McKinlay View Post
    One problem is the Chinese are notorious for cutting corners. Although a company may specify a certain grade of material unless they have qualified inspectors on site that may not be what they get.
    So are Americans...If many can get two for the price of one USA product there you are. Sounds like a "woodworking show" doesn't it.....

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by jack duren View Post
    So are Americans...If many can get two for the price of one USA product there you are. Sounds like a "woodworking show" doesn't it.....
    One difference is that if you cheat in the US and get caught, it will probably cost you. That is, customers and consumers are likely to bring suit and the government may charge you with a crime. In China, not so much - so the risk of cheating is not as great.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  11. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    Sorry if the term dinosaur came off badly, it was my way of saying some of the old time corporate philosophies and domestic advantage seem on the way to extinction.
    Thanks Edwin. I appreciated this clarification.

    Best regards,
    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  12. #42
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    Your casual post question does not inspire the confidence that you can do what you dream. Asking what we would pay is not how it's done without seeing a product.
    Have you ever taken any product to market? Do you know how deep your pockets need to be?

    Saving us all from bad clamps because they are made in the USA is rather amusing.
    ​You can do a lot with very little! You can do a little more with a lot!

  13. #43
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    With the high demands of hand and power tools from amateur to professional, many bought the best and the cheapest during the 90's and current. Professionals were actually no better than hobby woodworker.

  14. #44
    I would agree fully with advancing technology. Seeing what google is doing with Boston Dynamics is often eerily mind blowing.

    No worries about the dinosaur.. I don't mind that title at all.

    I do think though that likely in at least my lifetime there are going to be many many products that due to scale, margin or whatever that will still be manufactured old old school so to speak.

  15. #45
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    The next time you are driving your Prius home from Harbor Freight consider this:

    http://viewzone.com/sixteenships.html

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