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Thread: Widebelt sanders, dust collectors and filters

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Widebelt sanders, dust collectors and filters

    I have a 36 x 60 Dynabrade widebelt sander and a 3 HP PSI Tempest cyclone, with a two-cartridge filter stack on the output side. The rest of the shop is connected to the cyclone, too- 18" planer, 12" jointer, RAS, 2 table saws, etc. When the filters are clean everything works fine, but after an extended sanding session, the filters get plugged up with wood flour that gets past the cyclone, and I have to spend 15 or 20 minutes blowing the filters off from the outside with an air gun, and vacuuming the debris out the bottom. After that the D/C usually sucks pretty well again. I just finished a run of 18 alder 3/0 doors, and it got to the point where i had to blow the filters off after every door for the system to work well.

    Yesterday I was planing down about 250 L/F of poplar down from 1" to 1/2", prepping it for a run of base molding. I was emptying the chip barrel about every 15 minutes, and during one run I tried to run "just a few more boards", and plugged up the cyclone and the filters. It was a huge mess. After getting the filters down we rolled them out into the driveway and blew them out with a leaf blower and then blew them from the outside inward with the air gun. I got another 2 or 3 gallons of alder wood flour out of the pleats. We put everything back together, finished the planing run, ran the back-out cuts on the stock with the molder and called it an afternoon (my neighbor was helping, having come over at just the right time...). I just finished sweeping the shop out.

    I was at the AWFS woodworking show last summer and talked to the American Fabric Filter guy for a while. He said that widebelt sanders and cartridge filters were a bad combination, and a fabric baghouse would be a lot better, easier to clean, and so on.

    So, if you're still reading along, my question is do any of you run a fabric filter baghouse with your widebelt/drum sander? Did you convert from a cartridge setup? Can you provide pictures and details?

    thanks
    Dave

  2. #2
    I find that the Tempest collectors let to much flour past the collection bucket. I know it's hard to swallow, but a different collector would solve the problem. Going with something like an Oneida would be an upgrade, even a Grizzly. I have a friend that has a 5HP Grizzly collector and he runs his 36" widebelt off of it and doesn't have those problems. Of course he still has to clean the filters, but nothing what you've described.

    I know a turner that has a Tempest collector and I wasn't very impressed with the suction it provided. Might have been clogged filter, might not have been.

    The least expensive way out would be the cloth bag, but the same amount of flour dust is going to get by and it'll still clog the bag.

    Dust getting by the collector bin is also a sign of a vacuum leak in the bin. That's where I would start first.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Bloomington, IL
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    No wbs YET but i have plans too and my big Giz is my plan. It has cart filters and an internal rope brush system on them. They are about 72" tall as well and a pita to remove. Hoping they work for sure.

    What main line duct size to the wbs do you have?
    Glad its my shop I am responsible for - I only have to make me happy.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Wake Forest, NC
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    493
    I have a 37 inch speed sander and a 5 hp Oneida and have no issues with my cartridge filter stopping up. I just recently did a large run of cherry through the wide belt and still have good suction.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Heidrick View Post
    No wbs YET but i have plans too and my big Giz is my plan. It has cart filters and an internal rope brush system on them. They are about 72" tall as well and a pita to remove. Hoping they work for sure.

    What main line duct size to the wbs do you have?
    A 6 inch, and it's right next to the D/C.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Western PA
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    I have a grizzly cyclone, and experience a lesser extent of your problem with my drum sander. When the filters are thoroughly cleaned, the performance is superb to all my machines. However, a few decent sessions of drum sanding end grain surfaces and table tops leads to a noticeable degradation in performance. The system still "works", but i notice a bit of blow back from my slider blade etc. Stuff that the overblade guard would pick up with clean filters. Im sure there are better designed cyclones out there, but Im very interested in a split exhaust cyclone. Route all the sander exhaust outside, and everything else through the filter stack. No matter how effecient your cyclone design is--I think my grizzly is like 98% separation effeciency?-- the flour will get through and any appreciable amount of sanding is going to load your filters. I dont want to exhaust outside 100% of the time, but it would be an easy way to protect your filters for very prolonged periods in between cleaning. I pull my filter and take it outside for 30 minutes with th eleaf blower 2-3 times a year. Id prefer to do that once every other year.

  7. #7
    I changed my cyclone over to venting outside years ago and haven't looked back. Always has full suction, no filter to clean ever, and the noise level is so much less.

    It does suck out heat and cold though. But my shop has 33,000 cu ft of space inside (25x55x24), so there is a bit of reserve in there.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Birmingham, MI
    Posts
    148
    Dave,

    I am not sure how old or version your Tempest is but I have heard great things from and reviews about that machine. With ANY cyclone a tiny leak anywhere from the cone to the collection can seal will cause separation degradation. A simple, cheap test is to tape around all the joints (hose joints, the can seal, etc..) to see if that helps. If so you have a small leak that needs to be addressed. That said the fine dust is the hardest to separate. Also try keeping the collection bin to 50-75% or less and see if that helps. Sometimes the swirling air stirs up the collection debris and can make it harder drop out of the cone (it shouldn't but sometimes it will) thus allowing to get into the filters.
    Hope this helps. Let Us know what you do.

    Carl

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Kane View Post
    Im very interested in a split exhaust cyclone. Route all the sander exhaust outside, and everything else through the filter stack.
    I was thinking of something like that; it shouldn't be too difficult to set up with two blast gates and a Y connector.

    Thanks everyone for all the suggestions; I'm otherwise pretty happy with the Tempest, which I got used for a great price. I'll go out and tape up my connections a little more later today.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    black river falls wisconsin
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    931
    I have shop foxx 3 hp 2 stage and had same problem as you when running 36" widebelt sander. Changed to venting outside. Headache gone.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by eugene thomas View Post
    I have shop foxx 3 hp 2 stage and had same problem as you when running 36" widebelt sander. Changed to venting outside. Headache gone.
    Yeah, that looks like the direction I'll be heading in, probably this spring. Some of you guys who vent outside live in places colder than where I am so I guess I can make it work. I'll probably look into putting in a diverter so I can go either way.

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