Table Saw Question

[john whittaker]

On the verge of ordering a cabinet saw. My first table saw of any kind. (If you followed a previous thread...I had a nasty and hopefully my last accident with the RAS)

I've picked the Griz 1023SL. My question is...On the saws I've looked at, the fence rides on the front rail and overhangs the back rail. Seems to me that a fence riding of both front and back rails would be smoother. (and shorter) I'm a hobbyist and want this to be my last saw. Since I'm used to ripping on an RAS I sure ANY table saw would be a big step up for me...but the fence overhanging the back rail seems a bit odd.

SO my question is....On the lower end cab saws I'm looking at (and can afford) is a fence riding on only the front rail standard? Is it a problem?

Thanks for help.
John Whittaker

[Bob Nazro]

John,
I have the 1023SL and it's a great saw. The fence rides on a rail in the front and in the back. The fence locks only to the front rail. Most of the saws out there use this type of fence control. Grizzly offers a second type of fence that clamps in the front and the back. I had this on my Grizzly contractors saw. It worked well, but there are advantages to the Shopfox "Bessy" clone that I like. I’ve made several jigs for cutting that slide on the fence and I’ve mounted a tract for a set of board buddies and this works well for me. It also seems a lot easier to keep the Bessy clone parallel, fewer adjustments than the other fence that clamped on the front and back.
Good luck with your saw.

[Mike Hollingsworth]

The biesemeyer type fences mount only at the rear. I guess it's beefy enough not to need a front connection. It certainly makes it easier to move.

[Jim DeLaney]

The Biesemeyer fence, and its many clones - such as the "Shop Fox Classic" fence - ride on, and are secured to, the front rail only.

They don't actually touch the rear bar at all. There's a small 'foot' on the bottom of the fence itself that rests/rides on the table surface. Rhe rear bar is really only needed to support an auxiliary table. If you don't have the aux table, the fence will then ride on the bar, but it's not really intended to.

The Biesemeyer fence (and clones) is just about the best fence design out there. It's rock solid, and virtually never needs realignment beyond its initial set up.

The 1023 is a great saw. It's solid, reliable, and reasonably priced. Hardy a better deal out there. My personal preference is for the "SL" left-tilt model, but either one should serve you well.

[Don Frambach]

I just got my "last saw" with a Biesemeyer clone fence. I am delighted to report that it works real well. Another advantage of this fence is that it is easy to mount an outfeed table because you don't have to have clearance for a clamping mechanism on the back rail.

Go for it!

Don

[Norman Hitt]

John, I agree with Jim. I have a Biesemeyer Commercial, (it's just longer than the others) on my PM 66, and wouldn't even consider another type of fence. It's rock solid, and about the easiest to make numerous jigs for of any of the fences, and the fence you mentioned on the Griz 1023SL is a clone of the fence I have, and I'm sure you will be more than satisfied with the saw and the fence.

[john whittaker]

Thanks for the advice. Sounds like a fence connected to front rail only is normal. Decision is made. Hope to be posting the gloat around Christmas Day.

[Dev Emch]

No. In fence designs such as the beismeyer, the fence is designed to function like a drafting T square on a table edge. When a front riding fence is loose, it racks back and forth and should it utilize an aft mounted way, it would bind up instantly. Most low end saws are made by companies that are usually fairly sloopy in holding tolerances so its unreasonable to request a fence that rides fore and aft ways. But its also not really a good idea. The best fence system in terms of accuracy is a center rail T fence such as the old patternmaker's fence found on olivers and tannys, etc. as well as the Incra version of this fence made from extrusions. It may be lightweight; however, it does work. These fences utilize differential error negation. That is, given a beismeyer out of wack, the angle of error at the other end of the saw will be theta, for example. On a T fence, this same error will be postive theta/2 at the front of the saw and minus theta/2 at the back end of the saw. As a result, the error tends to cancel. That is why most fences found on older heavy iron were of the T or patternmaker variety. See oliver, northfield, tannewitz, whitney, etc. My martin has a very accurate front riding fence but the fence rides a precise machined front way located in the main table casting. In fact, the last 8 inches of the extension table is hinged. I can slide the fence over to this last section and then flip it down out of the way for use when cutting large items that do not require a rip fence. When done, flip up, lock the pin, slide the fence back onto the main extension table and main table and your back in the ripping business.

[Michael Adelong]

<SNIP>That is, given a beismeyer out of wack, the angle of error at the other end of the saw will be theta, for example. On a T fence, this same error will be postive theta/2 at the front of the saw and minus theta/2 at the back end of the saw. As a result, the error tends to cancel. <SNIP>

Did anyone else think of Gary Coleman saying "What you talkin' about, Willis?" when they read this?

Michael

[Dev Emch]

Michael...

That is why Oliver is Oliver...... nuff said!

[Tim Morton]

Did anyone else think of Gary Coleman saying "What you talkin' about, Willis?" when they read this?

Michael

I thought that same thing when Mike said Beis fences mounted only in the rear

[lou sansone]

Hi john
getting back to your original question about lower end saws only having their fence attached at one end ( called the front for most of us ). I think you will find that just about all modern saws use this type of arrangement. Lower end and high end. Take a look at the Felder and mini max saws ( sliders but still have rip fences ) and they have fences only held at one end as well. As Dev has said many of the older iron saws had center mounted fences for a variety of reasons that we don't need to go into here. But you will find the beismeyer fence very accurate for what you are doing .

lou

[Michael Gabbay]

I see Dev has his slide rule out again!

[john whittaker]

Thanks again for the help...Dev, your input and your explanation was actually concise, comprehensive & appreciated. And Lou summed it up nicely. Thanks all for your help. It cleared up the final issue before making the choice.

I encountered some problems while shopping for a saw...doing "hands-on" comparisons. I will post my thoughts later in hopes it might help someone else.

[tod evans]

john, lou got it right. good design and functional. tod