Air Compressor Quandry

[Greg Johnson]

I am going through the agonizing process of evaluating the need to upgrade my compressor. I currently have a PC pancake compressor that has served me well. I plan to continue to use it, but would like to be able to do a bit more with air. Primarily I would like to be able to get into some HVLP spraying and use some of my tools as they were intended. Cost/Benefit analysis is causing sleepless nights....

So, I am currently looking at the IR SS3L3 which is 60 gallon stationary compressor. It seems to be the greatest value (quality, features and price) I can find. My question is how people have plumbed stationary units like this. Northern Tool has a Filter/Regulator/Lubricator for $170 which seems very expensive to me. Grizzly has a similar unit for $45. I was thinking of plumbing to a T-block with a Filter/Regulator/Lubricator on one side which would be used for tools. The other side would be a filter and regulator which would be for spraying and blowing. Am I on the right track here, or can these Filter/Regulator/Lubricators be used safely when spraying by just shutting off the lube? Do you keep seperate hoses for tools and sprayers?

Also, I was wondering about noise. My understanding is that these units are fairly quiet. I could install it in a building adjacent to my shop, but it would entail a lot more plumbing.

One more question....(for now).... my shop is unheated and in the Pacific NorthWet... Do I need to take any special precautions with regard to moisture?

OK.... One last question....I currently have the following tools:
16 gauge PC finish nailer
15 gauge Hitachi finish nailer
PC Framing Nailer
1/2 impact wrench
HVLP Husky spray gun
3/8 Husky ratchet

With the addition of this new compressor, what would be the next tool you would add? In other words.... Help me out on this Cost/Benefit process ..... I want to sleep well after I finalize this transaction with Northern Tool....

Thank you for any feedback,
Greg

[tod evans]

greg, i`ll address the spraying question; do not use the lines your oil mist travels through to spray finishes. the oil will cause you problems...02 tod

[Steve Stube]

I would agree with Tod and go one step further and not contaminate any hose with oil drip from a lubricator. I put a couple of drops of oil in the tool inlet before use, connect the hose quick disconnect at that point and go to work. I have a few lubricators that take up space in a drawer after seeing a slug of oil run from one of the hoses used with it - maybe 40 years ago.

Using compressed air for driving tools is expensive but it does have some advantage in a few ww applications, spraying finishes, nailers/staplers. In the later case setting the pressure allows you to seat the fastener the way you like. I have more metal fab tools that I use air for and especially like drilling sheetmetal using an air drill over the other options.

[Jim Becker]

I have that compressor...it's a peach. Nice value and good machine. I almost bought from Northern Tool, but at that moment, Tractor Supply had a nice sale on it that even with tax was a few dollars less than NT and I could pick it up.

I'll pile on relative to the lubrication. No way, not in a woodshop...and even if you do a separate run for such things...to the garage, for example...oil does have a tendancy to, umm...wander.

One thing I did do with my piping system (copper) was to put a special drop for spraying that includes both additional moisture control and a separate regulator. It was a convenient way to make spray setup easy, even with the bit of extra cost for the filter and regulator.

I also recommend an auto-drain...mine is an IR that I got off "that auction site" for about $70. (I think it was a previous model or something)

[Jerry White]

Jim, I will take a liberty and pile on Greg's question here. I am also looking at this compressor and I have not been able to find spec's on the noise that this machine generates. I'd be surprised if your ears are calibrated in decibels, but how would you subjectively rate this thing on noise, as opposed to an oilless 20 gallon unit (which is NOISY).

Thanks for your input. Its a big help. And Greg, thanks for a timely question.

Jerry

[Greg Johnson]

Thank you for the replies regarding the lubricator. I'm glad I asked.... I would have just bought it because it was there . That makes the plumbing a lot simpler for me.... A simple regulator and filter cuts down on the expense... a bit.

So I am still working on the cost/benefit analysis. I have done several very nice wood projects in the past and then botched them up with a poor finish. I am looking forward to learning how to use a sprayer and improve my finishing skills. This is only for personal use. I built my own home about 25 years ago and am now starting at one end and working my way to the other, room by room. I have gotten a taste for air tools and I don't know how I built this home without air nailers. Ohhhh.... that would have made things easier. Kitchen cabinets will probably be a year from now. Any testimonials that you can share about how a good compressor made a huge difference in your life, will help me with my anguish over this decision.... I know that my 1/2" impact wrench and 3/8 ratchet will actually work with a larger compressor, but are there some other tools I should be considering. Are air sanders any better? I now use a cheap Ryobi 5" random orbit sander that works ok... but the motor is starting to sound a little weak.

Thanks for your responses,
Greg

[Jim Becker]

Jim, I will take a liberty and pile on Greg's question here. I am also looking at this compressor and I have not been able to find spec's on the noise that this machine generates. I'd be surprised if your ears are calibrated in decibels, but how would you subjectively rate this thing on noise, as opposed to an oilless 20 gallon unit (which is NOISY).

Well...it's certainly a different sound from the oilless that I used to own (and sold to another SMC member for "a good price")...the sound is deeper and not as intense. But honestly, I don't really hear it much 'cause it's in my DC closet which is sound insulated and baffle-vented. I will not say it's quiet, but it's acceptable, especially considering it doesn't run all that often, even when I'm spraying finish. That's one of the real benefits of the larger tank...you have a lot more air to work with at pressure before the thing kicks in!
-----

Greg, air sanders can be nice in some respects, but many of them require more air (SCFM) than this unit can supply. And many of them don't have provisions for dust collection. I may consider a small angle sander (Grex) for use at the lathe where I collect via a hood when sanding, but not for my flat work. There, the Festool sanders get the nod for so many reasons.

[Mike Deschler]

Gregg:

I am in the process of setting up my IR 60 gal compressor and am waiting for a auto moisture valve which I just ordered. I feel that this is perhaps the most important item to add as my compressor will experience wide temperature swings. It turns out that they generate a lot of moisture especially if the compressed air is very warm and the tank is cold. IR says 32 degrees min for operation. Forget the oilers inline, that is a bad move and do as others have said and that is to oil individual tools as needed. I picked up a neat filter/regulator at HF today. Go to http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...temnumber=1118
Copy this ad and take it to your local store and have them price match. I also had a 20% coupon so I got 2 for approx $16ea.

As far as noise goes, yes they are noisy and I am working on some ideas as to how to minimize it under my conditions.

Keep us posted as to how you are doing.

[Rob Will]

Greg,
I agree with all the other posts about not using a lubricator. Put two drops of oil in the tool's air fitting.

As far as hooking up the compressor I would not attach anything directly to the compressor except a 1" shut off valve. From that point put a JIC fitting in the valve and run a peice of hydraulic hose over to a steel pipe fastened to the wall. (This really does not have to be that heavy)(the JIC swivel ends are nice if you can get them with lighter hose). Personally, I like to keep this main feed hose fairly large along with the pipe going up the wall. I think this helps condensation drain back to the tank. My shop is 1" pipe and I did a friend's shop with 3/4" pipe.

Anyway.....I would continue up the wall all the way to the ceiling.
At the ceiling I would put a 90 or a tee.

From this point you can use plastic pipe especially formulated for air service. In our shops we run the main line along the outside wall at the ceiling and put in a tee whereever we want an air drop.

Attaching drops.......weld a peice of flat metal to a 4' iron pipe. the flat metal is wide enough to hit 2 wall studs (etc) with lag bolts. On the bottom of the pipe use a 45 degree elbow. Put your female quick couplers there. Mount the whole thing at a convienent height.

Do not buy air fittings at places like Harbor Freight....they are junk.
If possible put an air drop adjacent to your outside door.
An air hose reel is nice close to the door.

Saftey note: Technically, PVC pipe is dangerous for air service. The special air pipe is formulated not to shatter. Having said that, if the pipe is up out of the way.......there are a lot of SCH 80 PVC air systems that work just fine...... But I'm not naming any names.

The only place we use plastic is along the cieling to feed the drops.

Water drain. YES! I would add a short pipe to the tank drain to make it easier to get at. Those little radiator drain style valves are often a problem.

Rob

[Rob Will]

Greg,

For the air nailers, I sometimes use a small regulator that has a male coupler on one side and a female on the other. That way you can plug it in wherever you want....even on the end of a hose.

Another method is to mount the filter / reg on a board. This can be screwed to the wall next to a drop and plugged in with a short hose - whenever you want regulated air. This also would allow the regulator to be disconnected for service etc.

I have painted many cars with a small regulator mounted right on the paint gun (made for that purpose). For finishing, I think it responds better than a regulator mouted on the wall or at the compressor.

I think you will get less water in the system if you don't come directly off the compressor. A few pieces of pipe can really save you a lot of steps, look nice, and improve safety.

.02 Rob

[Barry O'Mahony]

The book "Setting up Shop" has a good chapter on running compressed air lines in a woodshop and discusses the importance of metal piping that condenses out the moisture. This diagram is also good at showing how to run drops and where to put drains: http://www.tptools.com/statictext/ai...ng-diagram.pdf

[Rob Will]

A picture is worth a thousand words huh?
I would suggest that Greg look closely at the beginning and end of the air system shown (in the diagram that Barry sent). Personally, I don't think Greg will have all the complexity of the system shown.....but any rigid piping is better than a hose plugged into the compressor. I agree with the concept of this diagram 100%.

Good luck,
Rob

[Paul Campolieta]

As you plumb in the compressor just add a water seperator at regular intervals you don't need a seperate oiler for your system. I have heard of other guys puting their compressors in a unheated room and they work fine What I do is drain my air lines every 2 or 3 days or if I know I won't be using it for a while I drain everything including the compressor. I drain the compressor at least once a week. I always add a drop of oil into the tool make sure you get air tool oil do not use motor oil or transmission fluid. I used to won an automotive repair shop and we used airtools for everything in 20 years of business I have owned 2 compressors this is a good track record for something used daily (btw the first compressor was from the dinasour time) Also make sure you have shut off valves in certain locations so you can shut off sections of the air if you have to. When I shut the shop down I sold the compressor to a fellow in the autorepair business and it's still working daily (4 years ago)

[tod evans]

greg, the issue of air sanders that you raised......i wouldn`t give up my air random orbit for 10 high-end electric! it is far more ergonomic,much faster and way less tiring to use, just ask any auto-body shop, they use theirs 8hrs per day. as for sprayguns get the best you can afford you`ll be glad in the long run. just your kitchen job will justify both the r/o and a good gun.
spend a few minuits reading this thread it should prove enlightening;
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=27462
tod

just checked out the link barry provided. this is the correct way to install airlines,please read the second page...tod

[Chris Damato]

Hi,

I thought I read somewhere that if you plan on spraying finishes with your compressor, it was better to have an oiless model. Is that true? i would love to get rid of my oiless model for one that is a bit quieter.

Thanks,

Chris