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Thread: a question for Harry Strassil

  1. #1

    a question for Harry Strassil

    Jnr,
    I think this question is right up your alley.... I believe that you use a few woodie/transitional planes??

    Are you able to tell me the weight difference between your transitional or woodie jointers and a comparable (no 7 or 8) CI plane?
    A no 7 CI plane is just over 8 lbs - any idea on what the others weigh?

    My toolbox is getting dangerously heavy for lifting, and I'm thinking of changing over to woodie's or transitional for the heavier planes. Not sure if it is worth it?

    I see a few transitional bodies and blades for sale and figure it could be an idea.

    Also, is it a good idea to remove the transitional 'body' from the wood body, or does this lead to a lot of wear and a 'loose fit' of the metal parts to the body?
    The reason I ask is that I'm also thinking of breaking the planes down for better space utilisation in the toolbox.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Hubbards, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts
    147
    Hi

    I'm not Harry, but I can tell you that transitional planes are not made for repeated disassembly/re-assembly. The screws that hold the mechanism to the wooden stock are regular wood screws and will easily strip out.

    One of the reasons some people hate transitionals is that the screws loosen up over time under normal use and changes in humidity. Re-habbing transitionals often includes plugging or shimming (with matchsticks or similar) the screwholes to tighten them up.

    Hope Jr agrees with me !

    Cheers

    Ian
    I'm guided by the beauty of our weapons -- Leonard Cohen

  3. #3
    Thanks for the input Ian, greatly appreciated.
    If you have a transitional, can you tell me the diameter of the holes for the screws? Would they be around 1/8" diameter, or larger?

    A thought that has sprung to mind is setting nuts, or drilled and threaded rod, into the plane body to take a bolt. I.e. to replace the screws with bolts, and to fit something to the plane body for a bolt to engage.

    Either that or to use the holes for the screws to attach a metal plate that is then fixed to the wooden body? There has to be a way around the issue.

    An space efficient solution would be to get several bodies of the right size to pack 'side by side' and 'end across' into the bottom of a toolbox, with the handles, CI castings/blades and totes disassembled and packed seperately. Its only realy worth it if the weight saving justifies the mucking around though.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Kyogle N.S.W Australia
    Posts
    245
    maybe those threaded insert thingos would work.

    I've got two transitional union smoothers. I've yet to have that problem, but then I haven't had much experience with them.

    There definetly lighter planes. But sometimes thats a negitive. Maybe its time to get a second toolbox ??

  5. My 22" C&W woodie weighs 5 lbs 13 oz.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    extreme southeast Nebraska
    Posts
    3,113
    I have no accurate means of weighing them Clinton, so I will have to defer to someone else on this one.
    Jr.
    Hand tools are very modern- they are all cordless
    NORMAL is just a setting on the washing machine.
    Be who you are and say what you feel... because those that matter... don't mind...and those that mind...don't matter!
    By Hammer and Hand All Arts Do Stand

  7. #7
    From "Blood & Gore":

    Iron Planes
    #7 - 22", 8-1/8 lbs.
    #8 - 24" 9-3/4 lbs.

    Transitionals
    #30 - 22", 6-1/4 lbs.
    #31 - 24", 6-1/2 lbs.
    #32 - 26", 7-5/8 lbs.
    #33 - 28", 8-3/8 lbs.
    #34 - 30", 8-1/2 lbs.

    Weights of other Stanley iron planes and transitionals are on Patrick's site as well.

  8. #8
    Thanks Robert.... I don't know why I didn't go to B&G straight up.... my brain must need a service!

    Harry and Roger, thanks.

    Jake,
    I have noticed a few cheap transitional bodies about... the collectors must turn their noses up at the ones 'in parts'. I'm yet to play with one though.
    My toolbox is a locker that my work lets me cart about at their expense... basically I'm limited to a pre-determined size, plastic, trunk. Anything else and I have to pay for it...I'm too tight for that. My last move had my locker at 70kg+... so I don't want to get another toolbox, and moving the one I have is a bit impractical. Two boxes is the commonsense solution though.
    Did you get our book in the mail?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Kyogle N.S.W Australia
    Posts
    245
    I did get the book. Thankyou kindly. Sorry, I should have written to say as much.

    Those transitionals don't seem that popular alright.

    Honestly I quite like them. Mostly because I think they look more interesting,,,,, and wood has a friendly feel. Maybe because their not as bulky as a true woodie at the same time. ??...with the little handless smoothers you put your hand right in behind the blade, which in my opinion is the best place to push a plane from. Wish the blade was a bit thicker though.

    I've only trued one of them up for use. Pretty straight forward. Wooden sole easy to flattern uno. But the mouth opens the more you flattern though. I should really put an insert in there one day.

    I'd better shut up Clinton, I'm starting to rave. Have you hit Melbourne yet ?

  10. #10
    yep, been down for a few weeks.

    I also found out that there was a pretty thriving tool 'copying' industry in Melbourne up to about the early 80's. Seems the apprentices used to give their tradies (master's) tools to mates that worked in small foundries in order to get copies made. Very common practice in the Vic Railways workshops and around Niddire (near Essendon) where there were a lot of small foundries surrounding a pig market. The tool shop I went to has a lot of copies... some good and some not so good. All are old, however it was difficult to pick the difference between the original and a lot of the 'copy' castings. Interesting stuff of a by-gone time.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Kyogle N.S.W Australia
    Posts
    245
    Interesting stuff alright ...how'd you find out ? .... maybe you'll come accross the odd rare design.

  12. #12
    there's a second hand tool shop in Niddrie, my neighbour and I go tool hunting there sometimes.... he looks for mechanic and machinist tools (he's building up his tools to start his own business), and I look for wood tools.
    The shop is www.thetoolexchange.com.au (not to be confused with Stuart Minchin's shop).
    I think the owner bought the shop as a going concern, and knows a lot of the history of the Melbourne trade scene.

    His prices are the same as you'll get on net auction sites, but sometimes there is a bargain. A lot of his stock you just can't find elsewhere, and a lot of its is ex-school and TAFE tools.

    Apparently you can tell the copies from the rough or thick edges of the castings - the tools weren't left in the mould long enough for the sand to set and the moulds usually suffered some damage when the tool was removed. The apprentice had to get the tools back before his 'master' found out, and the apprentice making the casting had to do it on the sly or else his boss would give him a boot for wasting the shops time and $.
    He's got a "Norris infill" thats had its body cast in bronze, and a few copied block plane bodies... the block planes are pretty good though, and might be Falcon-Pope or Stanely factory stock from when they closed down the factories?? The "Norris" was never 'cleaned' after it came out of the mould.... it could look pretty decent if the sides were lapped.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Kyogle N.S.W Australia
    Posts
    245
    Quote Originally Posted by Clinton Findlay
    . The apprentice had to get the tools back before his 'master' found out, and the apprentice making the casting had to do it on the sly or else his boss would give him a boot for wasting the shops time and $.
    .
    apprentices after my own heart.

    Sounds like I should move to Melbourne too. Seems a lot more interesting than this little town.

    My brother in law has spent his life scrounging Melbourne for antiques. One of those cluey fellas who seems to know the dirt on everything. Very street wise.

    Interesting guy, but would never trust him. (hard not to watch his hands when he visits with his girl). He would tell stories of the pickings of Melbourne...... basically uno, get old things free or for next to nothing, and sell on ebay or at the markets for a packet. So good at it, he managed to make a living out of it. ....old tools, furniture.....

    anyway.....

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