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Thread: My walk in tool box

  1. #1

    My walk in tool box

    Hi folks, I have made a few posts now and have had some great help. Thanks. And now I would like to impose upon you all again

    I am able to build a small (did I say small...you know SMALL ) shed in our new garden. Looking through the forum and at some of the pics of people's workshops have been interesting and made me a bit reluctant to divulge the size of my new workshop. A lot of you seem to have monster shops. Some of the shops out there are the size of a small house here in Japan, if not bigger. Any as they say, it is not the size of your shop, its what you do with that counts. Or something like that.

    Oh, Did I mension that I live in Japan. I nice place to live but space is rather limited unless you live way out in the sticks, have a LOT of money or you have your own dungeon (Stu - you lucky guy )

    However I have decided to bite the bullet and ask for your valuable input... Until now I have used a little portable workbench where ever I have been able to. On the balcony, in the hall, the kitchen, or recently on the new terrace... But now that small yearning voice deep down is starting to screem louder and louder. I want to go further in my woodworking and need a good bench and place to store my extisting tools and the new tools I plan to buy. (Thanks for everyone's help there.)

    So here is a picture of my "walk in tool box"...
    Walk in Tool box Elavations and plan.jpg

    Sorry but it is all in metric if you can read it. (having trouble with the quality- had to scan a plot of my drawing and then save as JPEG)

    The toolbox / shed is roughly 9'6" long by 4' wide/deep.
    The "work area" as shown is about 82" x 42" interior space and the "garden stuff" area is about 18" x 42" interior space. This might be able to be changed a couple of inches but I am limited by the space I have. And I need swing room for the doors between the shed and a wall at the end of the terrace (infront of the shed). A site plan can be posted later if needed.

    My initail plan was to divide my shed into a my "walk-in-toolbox" for my hobby and sanity and have a small closet for storing the garden tools and stuff. This is as shown.

    But after looking through the creek here and looking into bench designs etc. I am thinking again about my layout. And now , before it is built, is the time to rethink things.

    And this is where I would like your collective wisdom...

  2. #2

    Walk in Tool Box

    Some background I suppose:-

    I want to go neandre.

    This is out of neccesity as I am sure you can all understand. Although I am thinking of getting a drill press sometime in the future for accurate holes. But this is down the line for now. I have a new Makita electron burning sliding mitre saw with laser line for the construction of the shed and of some wooden planter boxes which will be LOT of cuts. And this will be stored in the 'toolbox'.

    I will have to dimension wood by hand and will cut mortice and tennons etc. by hand so I need a sturdy bench.
    I will be working on mainly small to medium sized projects but I will make some beds for the kids in the future and some desks for the kids also. So these will be bigger pieces but I figure if I need extra space I can work outside the 'toolbox' for these and the odd larger piece.

    I am looking at chairs, end tables or hall tables etc and boxes and drawers and plant stands etc. Whatever I can...

    I was thinking of having a collapsible assembly bench if I need it. And putting it just infront of the shed when working.

    I will have to store some timber in the 'toolbox' also. I was thinking of storing rough timber vertically at the left hand end of the 'toolbox'. And where ever else I can. Needs to be thought out a bit.

    I want to put a workbench with a pretty solid top. I am thinking 3" or 4" of Ipe or Seran Ganbatu but the materials are undecided yet.

    The shed:-
    2x4 frame with ply sheet over for wind bracing. Typhoon area. And then 110mm wide T&G hardwood vertical siding over that.
    Last edited by Robert Trotter; 10-16-2006 at 3:38 AM.

  3. #3

    Walk in Tool Box

    And now some questions:-

    As I said earlier I am having a rethink about the layout. Originally I thought of the two areas with the work area ('toolbox') have a big bench area and possible standing in the doorway area when working.

    But After looking around and reading a lot about benches and looking at other peoples benches that they had posted pics of I am wondering if I should scrap the two area design and make it just one space with just the two front doors. I would have to store the garden tools at one end or around the walls. But getting access to them is the problem.

    What got me thinking about making it into a single room shed was my searches into bench designs and this got me to thinking about planing longer pieces of wood. I might need the extra length in the shed. Also what size bench should I go for and what layout?

    Question 1. - Should I keep the two compartments or change it into a single room shed?


    Benches:-

    I like the idea of a shoulder vice as it would allow me to clamp assembled draws and furniture pieces in the vice. But then I haven't used one and from looking at pictures it may be better for a walk around bench which mine won't be, unless it is very small. I also like the idea a large Veritas twin screw vice mounted to the front of the bench basically taking up nearly a third to half of the bench. This is because with my little workmate (I think you call them) I often clamped everything between the jaws and didn't use dogs because of the stabilty problem. But I am wondering if the front vice handles might get in the way while planing and dimesioning stock by hand. with my new bench I will have dogs and will use these for when dimensioning timber and general working. Which brought me to looking at the roubo style bench with basically a big clamping surface and a leg vice and a wagon vice or a Veritas twin scew vice at the end. I could use the leg vice for clamping when doing dovetails or cutting tennons. (is this right?) With the leg vice I could also put 900mm (4') sheet stock in the vice and clamp it for edge planing etc when I do some cabinetry. (This would have come in handy for the kitchen cabinets in the old place.) But I am not sure I will be doing a lot of cabinet building accept for the kids' desks)


    Question 2 - Should I have a wide bench taking up most of the width of the shed and work in the door way?
    This would mean the two room layout I suppose.

    Or should I have a narrower bench which would allow me to work inside the shed and place longer timber pieces for planing and being able to walk down along the bench while planing?
    This I suppose would mean less assembly space and bench space.


    Question 3 - What vices and layout or bench style would be suitable?
    Take into account I have used a workmate until now and don't know what is a good layout for me. So comments from people with similar tight space restrictions would be very helpful. The good the bad and the ugly.


    I think I will stop here and wait for some of your wisdom...
    Last edited by Robert Trotter; 10-16-2006 at 3:47 AM.

  4. Hi Ya Robert!

    I guess the rest of the guys are still counting ZZZZZZzzzzzzss

    Well you know what they say, more shop space is, well more shop space!
    Can't you find a spot under some stairs or somewhere else to store those garden things?

    A question or two for you.

    Is this at an apartment or a house? (or did I miss that part?)

    You know the aircon units we have over here, well the outside unit, if it is sitting on the ground, make an excellent spot to build a little compartment over them for the gardening stuff, just an idea for the gardening stuff.

    For long boards etc, you can also put a window, or hatch in one end of the the shed, and stick the board out there part way, to let you get long boards in, and to work on them (are you thinking bed rails?).

    I'm not much of a neander, and I have some shop space now, but I did a lot of woodworking here on the veranda of our old house, so I hear you about the space and the working outside thing.

    What I'd like to see is a pic or two of the intended space this shed would go, along with it's relative location to the rest of the yard etc (if this is at a house). I'm wondering if you could have a workspace between the shed and the the house, and make a temp awning style roof and walls to keep you somewhat dry, or to keep projects out of the weather while finish drys (and the stink out of the house!!) You and I both know the weather here, it can be sunny and warm, and 30 minutes later, raining like crazy, then sunshine again.

    Just some thoughts.

    I'd think that a narrower bench, that could be pulled out of the wall would be better, but I'm no Neander

    Could you also post a bigger pic of your plan, I cannot read any of the fine print.

    BTW, if you need to borrow a framing nailer and portable compressor, I have both.

    Cheers!

  5. #5

    More info

    Hi Stu,

    OK...Yes it is a house. Moved last year from an apartment.

    Here is a picture of the elevation again to see if it is any better. File sizes are a killer until I can work out all this picture stuff.

    Elev 10075.jpg

    And here is a site plan

    siteplan 10072.jpg

    The garden stuff I mean is for rakes and spades and longer things etc. And the small electric rotary mower (which is stored inside at the moment but it has to go out. getting too cluttered inside. I need a sheltered spot. I have some gardening benches/cabinets with cupborad space already outside for shorter stuff and fertilizers etc. So I suppse the rakes and stuff could be hung on the walls between the studs and the mower just put in the corner.

    For long boards etc, you can also put a window, or hatch in one end of the the shed, and stick the board out there part way, to let you get long boards in, and to work on them (are you thinking bed rails?).
    I thought of the hatch. But undecided. and wondering how it would work actually.
    And yes I was thinking of bed rails which would need to be planed so I want somthing pretty stable.

    I'm wondering if you could have a workspace between the shed and the the house, and make a temp awning style roof and walls to keep you somewhat dry, or to keep projects out of the weather while finish drys (and the stink out of the house!!)
    Yes I was thinking of opening the doors up and locking in position and then putting a cover across them and the end of the terrace for a covered area for this.

    Robert

  6. #6

    Some picture of the area

    Here are a couple of pictures of the area.
    IM000048.jpg
    This is the area. You can see that it is narrow between the fence and the wall.
    IM000047.jpg
    This looking straight on to where the shed would be. It would take up most of the area just beyond the terrace wall.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Pickering, Ontario.
    Posts
    339
    Robert, a few ideas for you to consider.
    What you are proposing looks to me like a conventional potting shed. If you need a roof and a way to suppport it, what about 1 solid bearing/supporting wall or posts and let it support the roof (like a catilever) and have the remaining 3 'walls' like curtains that can be retracted individually overhead into the roof area. Think panelled garage doors or roll-up curtains. The panels could be translucent plastic, glass, wooden slats... or whatever material is appropriate in your part of the world. For that matter, one or any of the panels could be partially retacted, with the remainder forming an 'overhang' or temporary roof. This could be temporarily enclosed with a material curtain wall ie tarp-like hung from the outer extremidies.
    To me the idea is to remove as many limitations as to size of footprint and how it can be used.
    It does present other challenges such as lack of wall space, but those are solveable ie mobile free-standing cabinets.
    My .02 yen

  8. That is a good idea Rick, the translucent panels would also give you nice natural light during the day time too!

    OK Robert, I'm first going to throw you a curve ball..........

    Attachment 48577

    Why not do your shed like this? I know it is more work, and I know it is more materials etc, but you would really be able to get a lot more into the shed.

    You would still have access to the side of the house behind the shed for getting at the AC for example but you would also just about double your space.

    If you make it on those concrete pads like they use for a sun deck, and it is not attached to anything like the house, it would be considered "Temporary" and not subject to any code, here in Japan (Well in Shinjuku, where I live). You would run an extension cord for power.

    Heck you might just want to build the whole thing on some recovered railway ties, they can be had at home-centers for landscaping, then it would REALLY be temporary

    Ok back to your design.

    By the looks of it, you already have a covered area to work on the large stuff, you stone patio (looks like an awning above it..?) for you planing of long boards, why not make a knock down planing stand? or what do they call them, a planing beam? Sloped a bit, has two legs, two trestle type of feet and a long beam between the two that acts as you bench for the wood to be worked on.......?

    Anyway........

    Back again on track (sorry, I'm a bit all over the place, I'm writing a bit, dealing with a customer, writing a bit .....etc.)

    One thing is the roof, that waffle stuff, what do they call it, corrugated roofing? you can get it in a smoked tint, with a fiberglass like weave in it, it is very tough, and will last at least 10 years (my old shed had it, and was 6 year old without any trouble at all). The natural light is nice, unless you are in direct sunlight, then it can be a bit much.

    I'd think about a window, or at least an exhaust fan, the cheap ones with the vanes at the outside which open and close when you turn it on/off are good, in the summer, this will get the hot air out in a hurry, and when you are working with finish, is will help with fresh air.

    I'd build a little tall skinny locker type of box for your rakes etc, and put it somewhere else, keep that stuff out of your workshop

    You know that you can get the siding just like they used on your house at the DIY centers, I used it on my Lesson Room Reno and it is slick, it even has some (minor) insulation on it.....




    I guess for the walls that go towards the neighbours house, you' have to put your finish on the wall then stand it up?

    I think you plan is sound, and your ideas are good, and you will get it done.

    Last thought for this post, BIGGER IS BETTER!!

    Cheers!
    Looks good and works well.
    Last edited by Stu Ablett in Tokyo Japan; 11-24-2006 at 4:24 AM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    North Hempstead, TX
    Posts
    379
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Trotter
    Here are a couple of pictures of the area.
    IM000048.jpg
    This is the area. You can see that it is narrow between the fence and the wall.
    IM000047.jpg
    This looking straight on to where the shed would be. It would take up most of the area just beyond the terrace wall.
    How about making the back of the shed wall against the terrace wall to avoid the zigzagging into the back yard with materials and such.
    You could also convert some of that garden space for the shed and move those plants and things behind the terrace wall to hide the shed from the street.
    "And remember, this fix is only temporary, unless it works." - Red Green

    THIS THREAD IS USELESS WITHOUT PICTURES


  10. #10
    Some of us are still up on the left coast, although I really should be studying the underside of my eyelids right now....

    It seems workshop space and layout is a common theme today....I just posted the layout of my 'shop and asked for help rearranging it too!

    I'll study your problem later today (and the inevitable replies) and see if I have any flashes of inspiration for you Robert.

    Later, ZZZzzzzz,
    ave F.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3,789
    First of all Robert, you shouldn't appologize for sing metric. In that regard, you are in a very strong majority. It's only most folks in the USA, many in Canada, and many in the United Kingdom who are measuring in the dark ages.

    I like both Rick's suggestion for removable walls (that was my first thought too), and Stu's for a larger shed.

    Thanks for the site diagram. You really don't have much room the work with, do you.

  12. #12
    Thanks for the replies everyone.

    Stu, bigger is better but not really possible. Usually in Japan you are allowed about 10 square meters footprint before you require a permit. However in Ahsiya where I live the limit is 5 square meters. And just to relieve the "get a permit, then" pressure...if I build at a size where I need a permit then I will have to allow for minimum distances to boundaries regulations which would basically mean I couldn't build the shed as there isn't that much space.

    I'll try to find out more about a planing beam...anyone?

    Hi, Ted...I can't change the garden as it is not long finished and it cost a LOT of money. If I told you the price you would probably have a heart attack so I will take care of your health for you and not tell you.

    I'll think about relocating next to the wall but it is probably out as the shed has to fit in with the garden architecture/design.

    I'm sure Stu could tell you how important it is here in the concrete jungles and mass of humanity, to have a little bit of heaven to relax and unwind in. And that is what we have made with our garden. Not big by most of your standards, but for Japan it is quiet nice.

    So Rick...thanks for your ideas but maintaining the garden architecture would preclude putting up screens and the like.

    Also in case it helps, I live on the coast near the sea so I want to be able to lock up and shut out the sea air as much as I can for my tools sake. I was thinking of making a tool box for my planes and chisels to take inside the house and put in my little office for those times when I will have a longish break from working wood. But for the rest of time I need to seal it up.

    I was going to use ply sheeting on the roof to help brace the shed, especially over the largish door space. But I could think a bit more about putting a window or something to allow for cross ventilation and light.

    I just thought about it... I could make the shed bit larger if I could put sliding doors or bifold doors but I can't think of a way to do it while still keeping the nice looks of the shed or how to make the bifold doors so they would hold up to the weight of the hardwood siding and keep them weather proof at the hinge joints.

    Suggestions anyone?

    So there ya go...
    Waiting for thoughts and more wisdom.
    Keep em coming as all thoughts and ideas spark others.
    Last edited by Robert Trotter; 10-16-2006 at 11:07 AM.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Geneva, Swisscheeseland
    Posts
    1,501
    My only thought is to put a crescent moon on the garden supply door and a small vent pipe coming out the top. Granted, the Japanese may not understand the joke, but isnt that half the fun?
    A flute without holes, is not a flute. A donut without a hole, is a Danish.

  14. #14

    crazy thoughts

    Robert,

    A couple thoughts come to mind (and that is scarey...;-) The basis of most of the thoughts are that you would only be working partially inside of the space and that it is primarily for tool storage (thus, primarily working either out the door or outdoors entirely.) If you look at the hand tool side, you will see Jr. Strasil's demo trailer and bench, which, if my guess is right, is about the same amount of space you will have.

    One is to work like the Japanese, with a planing beam and mortising benches etc. I often used a stump in my old shop for chopping mortises, even though I have a nice 3" thick maple benchtop. The nice part about that thought, is everything is easily moved etc. and you can even attach the planing beam to the door, so that your workspace is outside.

    The other that comes to mind is a cleat system for attaching your Western styled bench to the inside of the door of your shed, thus storing it vertically when not in use (you can decide on detachable legs if you like (I would, either do detachable or folding if a single door, or fixed base, if double doors.) This limits the length of your bench to the height of your door (shouldn't be a problem.) One variation of that theme is a Murphey Bed styled bench. Folds down when you need it and up and out of the way, when you don't. Managing around your bench when it is NOT in use, is the biggest task, in my mind. The more I work around benches the more I enjoy the Roubo styled bench with the modifications that you mentioned above (Like Chris Schwartz's bench), like the leg vise and wagon vise (an addtion to my bench soon) and make certain that you have decent holdfasts (come to think of it, maybe you could use the holdfasts to secure the bench to the door, for storage...) It may require a more expensive set of hinges (ball bearing) for the door, but a possible solution.

    I will go back to drinking coffee now...

    Robert

    P.S. Have you thought about using a thicker shed door and just having it be your bench? Pull two hinge pins and your door is now your bench. The face side of your bench would be the inside of the door....just a thought.

  15. #15
    Robert,

    Don't feel bad, I lived in a walk-in apartment not much bigger than you're planning for your tool box! I did it for 5 years! I attribute that to my youth at the time!

    Ok, it was a bit bigger, 9 tatamis, but I have an office bigger than that now (I think it's bigger).

    You might consider a workbench that folds down on the wall if you're really limited on space, so you could close/open shop when needed. That might work on an outside wall.
    --
    Life is about what your doing today, not what you did yesterday! Seize the day before it sneaks up and seizes you!

    Alan - http://www.traditionaltoolworks.com:8080/roller/aland/

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