Buying a used laser

[Allan Wright]

I'm going to inspect a used 1994 ULS-25 Universal engraver this weekend with the intent on purchasing it if it passes muster.

The laser has supposedly been refurbished within the last 6 months with replaced bearings and a re-charged laser. I plan on bringing the materials I plan to cut and doing sample cuts on all 4 corners of the table. Besides that are there any other things that I should look for on this particular vintage of Universal laser?

This is a local sale, and the sellers seem quite on the up-and-up. I just want to make sure I cover all the bases since this is a person-to-person sale.

[Rodne Gold]

It's a 13 yr old machine , thats pretty old. What sort of pricing is involved? all that you will see by lasering all 4 corners is alignment. You need to stress test the machine , fulll power fast speed for at least an hour , same with some vector cutting.
Raser and vector grids and look at how straight the lines are , do some 1mm high text. Do a large rastered area and check for banding , time a a4 graphic at 100% speed and at 50% speed and 500 dpi , will show you some sort of timing you can expect.
Do multiple offset circles in raster and vector , look at start and end points that they coincide and there isnt a "step" or an overburnt area , look at concentricity and smoothness. Vector cut circles and see start and end points align.
Raster engrave bold text and vector engrave their outlines , see they all line up. Vector cut 3-5mm circles , see that they are circles and not ovals.
Vector Cut some 6 or 8mm clear perspex , see the sides are well polished and are not striated and see that they are perpendicular to the top surface.
Make sure the machine has drivers that can use XP or a later ver of windows. If you want to use later versions of Corel , you cant with win 98.Is there any warrantee - demand at least a written 1-3 month warrantee. Ask to see invoices for the repairs and regassed laser , who did the regassing?
Get the serial no and ask the manf when it was made and if they still support the machine.
What are you gonna use the machine for and how many hours a day ? Its unlikely a 13 yr old machine will be ok for heavy duty work and its most likely to be a very slow machine compared to todays machines.
Caveat emptor

[Mike Mackenzie]

Allen,

If you can get me the serial number of the system I can research it for you and give you any and all details of the system.

[Mike Null]

Mike:

What a great offer!

WOW!

[Allan Wright]

Model ULS-25PS
Manufactured Nov. 1994
S/N 1418

Asking price is $7,000

If it's really been refurbished and is in good working condition with a recently charged laser tube the price seems reasonable to me. My use will not be 'heavy duty' compared to most of the people here. 90% of my use will be vector cutting balsa for model airplane kits. I imagine I'll probably average 10-15 hours a week for the first few months while I get up to speed on using it and do some additional design work on new products, then I'll probably drop down to about 5 hours a week from then on. I will be sure to do some raster tests though as I'm sure I'll occasionally be making awards for flying contests, etc.

Thanks for doing the research for me! And thanks for the testing advice. I'll work up some test files to bring with me.

[James Stokes]

For a laser that old I do not think I would spend that much. Go to usedlasers.com and check out Robs lasers.

[Allan Wright]

I have checked out his lasers - good deals, but most of his entry-level lasers are in the $12k and up range. That's out of my current budget. I'm hoping by starting with a less expensive used laser I can work up to a newer model after a few years.

And of course I've listed the asking price. I haven't done any haggling yet. Where should I be aiming for a laser of this vintage?

[Mike Mackenzie]

Allen,

I checked the history of this system, Overall there has been very little problems with the system. The one very large red flag is that it is an AC synrad tube.

What this means is they won't support it any longer (Synrad). Now those tubes were very good and lasted for several years before needing to be re processed.

So this is what you are looking at 7k for a system that the laser tube will not be supported by the mfg any longer. It could last you 5 years it could last you 1 month. Either way you will end up with a paper weight once the tube needs servicing and if it can be serviced by someone it will be very expensive probably in the neighborhood of 3 - 5 thousand.

This is something that Synrad did any synrad tube that is ten years or older is not being supported any longer there are some coherent tubes that will not be supported any longer as well.

This does not matter what system this tube is on the mfg (synrad) will not repair them any longer as well as some coherent models. All system integrators used these tubes at one time (ULS, Epilog, Xenetech, New Hermes, Laser Pro, Trotec, GCC, Etc.) Synrad and Coherent used to be the only suppliers of laser tubes at that time.

Buyer beware!! Check the mfg date on the laser tube if you are thinking about a used system.

Personally I would offer 4000-5000 that way what ever time you get from the system it will be easier to pay it back.

Sorry for being the bearer of bad news.

[Allan Wright]

Thanks for the information Mike, even if it is dissapointing. Better to know than to be caught unaware when the laser dies.

I assume this means that repacing the laser with a modern one if it fails is also prohibitively expensive?

Also, the seller has told me the laser was recharged 6 months ago. From your statements this seems like it couldn't possibly have been done, at least not by Synrad. Are there other companies that might have been able to recharge this laser or have I had some smoke blown up my raincoat?

The more I learn the more I'm beginning to realize that an engraver with a 24"x12" or larger bed cannot be had for under $12,000. Unfortunately at this time that's about double my budget, leaving me in the realm of the laserless for the time being.

[Mike Mackenzie]

Allen,

Yes unfortunately there were quite a lot of changes that were made once Uls started making there own tubes. This is part of the problem it is just not smart to put serious money into that old of a system and people love those systems.

[Allan Wright]

Thanks Mike.

[Allan Wright]

After carefully considering all the advice given here I've decided to pass on this laser and wait until I can find one in my price range that is newer.

Thanks to everyone for giving me good, honest advice, and extra thanks to Mike for doing the research on that laser for me and to all who have put me onto other leads.

[Mike Mackenzie]

Allen,

One last point I did not answer for you. Synrad just in the last month or two decided that they will not support tubes over ten years old. So it is possible that he did get the tube re processed six months ago. I do have some doubts though because the AC tube technology has not been used for many years. All synrad laser tubes are now DC and they have not wanted to even look at AC tubes for some time. So you may want to remove the raincoat to air it out.

Also if you are interested we are obtaining some used M300 25 watt systems that will be available within a few months estimated selling price will be 6000-8000 depending on how much work will be needed to re furbish them.

[Allan Wright]

Thanks for both the honest answer, and the chuckle Mike!

[Dave Jones]

Just for point of reference, a ULS-25 sold on ebay a couple of months ago for $3,000. There's one on ebay Australia right now with a bid of $100 Australian.

You might want to call Access Business Solutions and see what they have available. http://www.usedlasers.com