Electrical wiring question - Two duplex receptacles

[Greg Funk]

I want to insert two duplex receptacles in line with an existing string of 120V outlets. I have sufficient capacity on the circuit but I couldn't find if there were any particular requirements for wiring two receptacles. Normally, the incoming hot and neutral are connected to the respective hot and neutal of the outgoing line with pigtails running to the receptacle. In my case I have 2 duplex receptacles, so should I have two pigtails or run a pigtail to one of the receptacles and then connect the two receptacles together or does it even matter?

Any advice is much appreciated.

thanks,

Greg

[Vernon Taylor]

Greg, I am no expert but recently wired my wife's shop where I used double gand boxes, the folks at the electrical supply house indicated that I could either
wire outlet to outlet by usingshort lengths of wire or I could bond the wires and use jumpers to feed the outlet and and continue to the next outlet. I chose to wire the first outlet from the feed line,use a jumper to the adjacent outlet and feed that to the next box. I felt this looked better and eliminated use of wire nuts.

[George Loyd]

Greg,
Assuming the two are going into one 4 gang box, I would suggest a pigtail to feed the one duplex recep and jumper from it to feed the other. If you feed directly (without a pigtail) in and then out of a device such as a receptacle and ever have a bad or loose connection, you will lose power to every receptacle beyond that point.

Regards,
SgtMaj

[Vernon Taylor]

My thinking on this was that if there ever was a problom it would be easier to isolate by tracing from the end of the run to find the offending outlet. I prefer to avoid using wire nuts wherever possible as I have had more probloms over the years with those connections,I feel that a single wire held by a screw is preferable. I did bond the bare wire ground wires and used pigtails to ensure a continuos ground. As I understand it either way is acceptable and my comments were based on personal preference.
Respectfully
Vern

[Greg Funk]

Thanks guys. I think I'll use the pigtail and jumper method as all the other outlets use a pigtail.

Greg

[nick brigg]

kinda going off topic here...but im in the process of wiring up my garage to transform it into a shop. he told me i have 40 amps available, anymore and i would have to upgrade the whole panel. me, knowing next to nothing about electricity, is 40 amps enough for a small one man shop?

[Charlie Plesums]

40 amps at 120 volts can do a lot of woodworking, but if you are putting in new service, I would go for a lot more.

I have a small dust collector that draws 11 amps (minimum of 15 amp circuit) at 220 volts.

My combination machine draws 22 amps idling (30 amp circuit) at 220 volts, and a lot more when it is working

My big bandsaw is on a 30 amp 220 volt circuit, but pegs the ammeter for a long time during startup, and many have said it needs a 40 amp 240 volt circuit because of the starting current.

Then I have a number of machines that are designed for home use... they run ok on a 20 amp 120 volt circuit, nominally drawing under 15 amps ... Some would say each should have their own circuit. Forget that!

Small (14") bandsaw
Drum Sander
Air compressor
Turbine sprayer
Lathe

And a lot of other tools that draw under 10 amps.

[nick brigg]

well i've got a big band saw, table saw, 5hp cyclone and planning on a jointer/planer combo, those are all 220, but only 2 running at any given time, like the dust collector and whatever else. its just that 40 amps doesnt SOUND like a lot of juice!

40 amps at 120 volts can do a lot of woodworking, but if you are putting in new service, I would go for a lot more.

I have a small dust collector that draws 11 amps (minimum of 15 amp circuit) at 220 volts.

My combination machine draws 22 amps idling (30 amp circuit) at 220 volts, and a lot more when it is working

My big bandsaw is on a 30 amp 220 volt circuit, but pegs the ammeter for a long time during startup, and many have said it needs a 40 amp 240 volt circuit because of the starting current.

Then I have a number of machines that are designed for home use... they run ok on a 20 amp 120 volt circuit, nominally drawing under 15 amps ... Some would say each should have their own circuit. Forget that!

Small (14") bandsaw
Drum Sander
Air compressor
Turbine sprayer
Lathe

And a lot of other tools that draw under 10 amps.

[Chris Friesen]

is 40 amps enough for a small one man shop?

Unless you get into really big tools, yes. 40A is enough for about 8HP worth of motors running simultaneously.

[Greg Funk]

well i've got a big band saw, table saw, 5hp cyclone and planning on a jointer/planer combo, those are all 220, but only 2 running at any given time, like the dust collector and whatever else. its just that 40 amps doesnt SOUND like a lot of juice!

40A sounds too low to me. You'll need a 30A breaker just for the cyclone and you might want to have more than one machine running at one time. I often go back and forth between the bandsaw and jointer and just leave them both running. I suspect the more important question will be how many circuit breakers you have available as you generally like to have a separate circuit for each machine and 220V circuits take two slots each. My shop has a 100A subpanel with 32 slots and they are all used.

Greg

[Mike Henderson]

I put in a sub box to serve my shop and used a 50 amp breaker in my main box to supply the sub box. Since I work alone, I almost never have two tools running at the same time so 50 amp has served me well.

Even if I left one machine running while using another one, that machine would not draw much current because it's just idling - no load. Tools only draw their rated current when they're working at capacity.

Mike

[Greg Funk]

Just for fun I measured the following idle currents:
3HP Tablesaw - 4.3A
1 1/2HP Jointer - 4.6A
16" Bandsaw (1" blade) - 11.6A

So I suppose it would be OK if you had only 40A.

Greg

[nick brigg]

well now im considering upgrading the box to a 200 amp service. what would be a good number of amps to have for a shop anyways?

[Vernon Taylor]

Nick
I would check with your local utility to explore possible configurations I have had two houses with 400 amp service serviced by different utility companies,one ran 6 wires to the meter base which had six connection points and the other ran 3 and the service was split at that point to feed two 200 amp boxes. I am thinking from your post that your current service to the main panel is less than 200 amp. This would seem to be inadequate to feed both the residence and a fully equipped shop assuming thatat some point the house utilize a lot of the available power. I'm thinking that maybe an answer might be to leave the current service panel intact and have the utility run in a higher amp service and utilize a new service panel to feed the shop. Depends of course on the logistics of current service entrance in relation to the shop.
My current situation is somewhat different in that my shop is in a seperate building and I have a seperate service independent of the house. I used a 200amp panel simply because the cost of the panel was not signicantly different than a smaller 100 amp panel. I wired the building myself which is permitted in our area so I saved a substantial amount on cost.
Vern

[nick brigg]

yes, our current service is at 100 amps, the electrician that was over suggested that we upgraded to 200 amps, which is exactly what we're doing. With that said, i'd send a 60 amp line to the shop, i think that sounds about right.

I am thinking from your post that your current service to the main panel is less than 200 amp. This would seem to be inadequate to feed both the residence and a fully equipped shop assuming thatat some point the house utilize a lot of the available power.