Woodmaster W-718 Planer - should I buy?

[Steve Nouis]

I've been running a RBI 20" planer for years which is real simular to the Woodmaster. Good luck with the drum sander, you can take off close to a thousands of a inch without it burning, one little knot and the paper is shot. Far as planeing, the gang saw and the moulder they all work good. For those chatter marks
The knifes need to be even.
The down pressure on the feed rollers was not heavy enough, I put stiffer springs in which keeps the board held down good, before I did that I spent a lot of time trying to get both edges the same thickness.
If there are rollers on the table set them so they dont touch, mine came with a 1/2 sheet of plastic for the bed, the boards slide easy and there's no riding up and down over the rollers on rough sawn lumber.

[Neal Clayton]

i have a 718 as well, currently in the process of re-producing all of the 100+ year old molding in my house with it, that like so many others has been paint ruined.

as a planer, it's great, works as well as any other planer i've used, but fwiw i don't use the knives, i ordered the spiral head with mine, so that makes a difference.

i also agree that as a gang rip saw it also works great, all you need to produce molding blanks is a 16-18 foot length of angle iron, a chalk line, and a skilsaw to square one edge with, the machine does the rest for you.

i haven't used the sander head with it, can't comment on that.

i also have an issue with chatter, which i'm researching. i also stumbled across what others have done like jeremy and matt with hinging the motor and going with a linked belt. i got the power twist belt at grainger the other day, but haven't gotten around to picking up a piece of metal to mount it with yet. i suspect that alot of the chatter problem comes from...

a) the plastic bed they send you not being true flat when bolted down, and

b) the flimsy in/out tables

i got a piece of laminate countertop material the other day from the borg to try and test that with, i plan to replace the whole shebang with the bottom-framed countertop table and see if that helps.

stock from the factory, it cuts test strips of new 2x4 pine smooth as butter, it's harder stuff that seems to struggle. my molding is being made with old growth longleaf pine, which creates a bit of a catch 22. it's hard, some boards harder than red oak, so you have to slow the feed rate down, but on the other hand the high sap content makes it easy to burn, so you can't slow it too much.

if all you need it for is a planer, i'd say go for it and buy the spiral head from the factory. if you can talk him to 800 you've got a 2000 dollar spiral head planer that's as good as any other, plus the ability to put the sander and sawblades on it, which not many other planers can do. they get 1000-1200 for the spiral head for the 718, i don't remember the exact amount, but either way the spiral head they sell is as good as any other i've seen, no complaints about it.

after tinkering with it i agree with the assumption that the two belts is their means of making heads easy to change, if you notice the stock belts are AX belts (which means they are rated for a tighter grip), not A belts like the power twist ones you got, which compensate for lack of tension. you're basically exchanging a tighter grip belt for a lower grip belt and adding tension. but the idea seems sound to me, i'm going to try it as well i think. i've got the leeson 5hp 'upgrade' motor they sell on mine which has a shipping weight of 119 pounds per grainger's website, so i don't think the weight of the motor will be a problem for tension. we'll see when i get around to it.

only other complaint about the machine is the parts are pretty tightly packed, so you need a lot of dust collection oomph. i have one of the smaller oneida cyclones and it works ok, but i still don't extract 100 percent from it on wider boards.

but either way, the machine for 90% of its functionality works as advertised and i have no complaints with it. getting perfect molding from it takes some trial and error, but if you don't care about making molding it'll be fine for any other use out of the box, imo. the spiral head eliminates any chatter problems that could occur with the knives, then you only have molding chatter to deal with .

[Neal Clayton]

by the way if any of you who are using the planer knives want a new set for free (shipping i guess), they sent me some by mistake when i ordered mine (like i said i got the spiral head from them so don't use the standard head for planer knives). that coupled with the extra digital depth guage and random extra counter weights made for a nice box of spare parts that i don't need

[Faust M. Ruggiero]

Ryan,
Maybe this reply wasn't meant to be. I had it all but finished, my fat fingers hit a mystical key and 10 minutes of picking and plucking dissapeared. I'll try again.
I own a 718. I originally bought it to switch between a sander and a machine to produce custom moldings. I would never use it as my only planer simply because I need a planer too often to want to convert it back and forth. Besides I own a dedicated heavy metal planer. The 718 would probably be a good hobby planer as long as you understand the limitations of a machine with rubber infeed and outfeed rollers. I used a Belsaw planer for many years and the design was similar. It did what was expected, it made two sides parallel. Of course the planed side still required belt sanding to get rid of the planer marks but that was to be expected. The rubber feed rollers just don't feed like serrated steel rollers. You can expect a bit more snipe at the end but that is easily avoided by running a scrap follower behind the last board planed and keeping the rest dead behind each other.
As a sander I was very unhappy with the results. Dedicated sanders feed via a conveyor belt on the bottom and pressure rollers on top. The 718 feed is supplied by the rubber infeed and outfeed rollers that become less effective as they get covered by a layer of thin dust. Despite my very good dust collector, the rollers would stop feeding and I would get dips in my work. I eventually solved that problem by buying a wide belt sander. There went another hunk of retirement. I'll just work a little longer!!!
I still use my 718 but only as a molder. I buy a single blade from Woodmaster and a set of balancing weights for any custom profiles I design and the 718 makes me wonderful trim. I use it for door casings, crown moldings and even fancy stiles and rails.
Here's my advice. If you don't already own a dedicated planer, buy one. What's more, buy the absolute best performing planer you can afford. Your time in the shop should be dedicated to building projects not having to fiddle with your machines. You want to own a planer that makes a perfect mirror image of the opposing surface without snipe or excessive chatter.
Good woodworking depends on making your surfaces square and true and you don't want that to be a struggle. Don't buy a planer without buying a piece of equipment to collect the dust and chips. Sweeping takes time and dust can take your health. Later, buy a dedicated sander if you find the need.
If you need a way to produce moldings on a budget, go for the Woodmaster. You'll still need the dust collector.

[Neal Clayton]

i agree in part with faust's assertions. the rubber rollers do require cleaning, whereas steel rollers not nearly as much. i clean the rubber rollers off with turpentine here and there (once a week in light use, once every other day in heavy use, just takes holding a rag around them as they turn).

i disagree that it can't be a full time planer. i plane my molding stock down with mine, and have no complaints about it. but i think the spiral head is key to that. no straight knife planer i've used can make perfect cuts over time, it's just an inherent flaw in that design. in a machine with that much friction anything less than constant blade contact will eventually result in chatter.

a spiral head will always be better in the long haul, and the woodmaster is no different. with a spiral head it can be a full time planer if you so choose.

[Jeremy Williams]

WOW... thanks for all of the GREAT feedback. I am really new to this machine and really want to make it work for me. I am going to spend some time soon here to align the knifes better. I have to think they are out of alignment because that alignment gauge included was "just okay" in my book (would favor the upgraded dial indicator gauge -- which I will probably order)

(And check your PM regarding the knives)

[Bob Wingard]

by the way if any of you who are using the planer knives want a new set for free (shipping i guess), they sent me some by mistake when i ordered mine (like i said i got the spiral head from them so don't use the standard head for planer knives). that coupled with the extra digital depth guage and random extra counter weights made for a nice box of spare parts that i don't need

Neal .. if you don't have any takers on the set of knives, I'd love to have them .. .. how shall we proceed ??

[Jeremy Williams]

Well, I purchased the PlanerPal blade alignment jigs, took each knife back out of the Woodmaster & cleaned them, then reset everything ... AND ... same ol' crap. The finish is decent, but I can still see the cross lines. I even tried to put a slick pieces of plywood under it running the length of the bed hoping to make it smoother -- but no luck.

At this point, I don't know where else to turn. So far, I've:

• Cleaned the machine top to bottom.
• Oiled everything and greased the bearings
• Replaced the belts with a link-style belt (for less vibration)
• Hinge-mounted the motor
• Purchased & installed brand new blades, aligned with a gauge that claims to be within .002" accurate.
• Reset the pressure rollers to factory recommended settings & cleaned them.

I've emailed Woodmaster Tools and they recommended either (1) blade alignment or (2) sticking points in the bed. Personally, I don't see how it could be sticking points on the bed (the boards appears to move smoothly on the freshly cleaned & waxed bed and the marks are on every inch of the board). While I admit the blades could be out of alignment, I have done everything I can think of to avoid this (including the purchase of expensive alignment jigs) -- not sure how I could get much better!

In any case, the cut is good and will work for most stuff ... but every board will require an additional bit of sanding -- which is disappointing. I would think I could get a "ready to go" finish from this (afterall, my Dewalt 735 provided a glass-smooth finish every time and it's a lesser machine in many aspects).

One recommendation for Woodmaster .... consider indexed blades like the Dewalt 735 ... that is such a better way to do it! Perfect everytime!

I keep trying ...

[Shawn Walker]

Well at this point I don't think I'm hijacking the thread...

I was just looking into a Wood masters Drum sander.... But now I don't know now... Any Woodmaster Drumsander owners out there? What do you say ???

[Mike Keers]

Before you hijack it let me jump in! I saw this thread twice in the past several weeks and missed my chance to check in both times. I just acquired a 718 as partial payment on some commissioned furniture. I have been paying special attention to this thread since it popped up since the machine is so new to me.

Backing up, I had looked at the Woodmaster drum sanders myself about a year ago, and received their product package--videos, literature etc. I was impressed but not in a position to buy one. I put it aside, but then my little ancient Delta 12" started struggling and I was thinking a new planer would be on my short list like it or not, and this whole thing came together with the 718 so I jumped on it, with the only thought being the planer. I didn't even know it could be converted to a sander or molder, or that he had all that stuff too. I had only looked at their sanders, not the planers.

The machine I got looks very good, almost new, but Woodmaster doesn't ahve a production date. It's possibly five years old according to the PO. The guy sprung for all the bells and whistles, the 5hp dust collector, dust hood, HDPE bed board, the casters, the molding head, the sanding drum, four or five rolls of sandpaper, the dial indicator knife setting gauge (I was able to get them all within .001" of each other and over the whole length) and some other stuff he threw in like a 30' length of 6" heavy wall hose for the dust collector and some other fittings, etc. He said at the time, with delivery and extras, he paid about $3200 or $3600. We agreed on $1200 as the barter value, which seemed fair to me with all the extras. Not a bargain, but fair.

I went over the whole machine and did the set up and all. As an old millwright I appreciate the simplicity of the design--let loose in a metal shop a talented guy like me (he says modestly) could build one of these, the special castings and machining aside. It's off the shelf good old American teknolgee. Solid and simple.

Anyway, the knives are usable but badly dull. I touched them up with a hand stone, but they are so dull I'm not sure about all the ripples I'm reading about above. Jury is out. I ran a few boards thru it, and it did plane well enough, I sent thru quite few rough sawn hard old oak boards and it didn't hiccup, bad knives or not. I plan to buy a new pair and I see Woodmaster sells the knives for $55 a set. Can we hear more about their blades compared to outside sources? Cost? Quality? I've found them from about $36 to over $100. Discuss.

But man, it is a shaker. I thought it was partly the casters, and I've been thinking of removing them, but they've proved useful while I'm still working out having this new machine in the way. That's why it was so neat to see this thread, and that so many of us have the same issues (or issues I don't even know about yet?)

I installed the sanding drum a week ago and played with that a bit. I think, after only extremely limited use, it might be as mentioned above, not that great a dedicated sander. Oh, it did the trick, and it far easier and faster than hand belt sanding, but it's no Timesaver (no surprise or blame there) So far I've only run 80 grit, using it almost more as an abrasive planer at the moment to size 9x36 false drawer fronts and some disparate molding stock. No snipe with the sander, some (as expected) with the planer.

I guess overall I'm pleased so far considering what I 'paid'. I do wonder how much different the dedicated drum sander would be, probably better because of the feed belt rather than pressure rollers.

So big question now that I've told my tale, where is the stuff you guys are talking about on Woodweb or? I'm quite eager to read and learn all I can about this machine. I was disappointed with the level of vibration, but apparently it's something that's been owner addressed, and I'll have to too.

Thanx for the above pics and info on that hinged moter--as soon as I get all my ducks in a row, I plan to do what needs doing to improve the 718, I'm just looking for more info on doing that. Thx!
mike keers

[Neal Clayton]

the articles on woodweb basically mirror this thread, nothing you haven't read here already.

they also sell a 'power platform' for a couple/three hundred bucks that adds another pulley/roller to the end along with a sort of universal mounting plate, on to which you can mount a third motor for a mop sander, or a router, or other such things.

yeah it is a lot lighter than most planers, but i think that's somewhat of a necessity, since their goal is to have parts easily exchanged for others on a daily basis.

i agree with a previous post with the point that it's just a simple machine that someone with a bit of mechanical propensity can simply modify to their own taste. if that's your cup of tea you'll probably get some use out of it.

[Joe Von Kaenel]

Ryan,

I have a woodmaster 712 and am very pleased with the machine. I run the factory belts and the motor mounted just as it was from the factory. These are well made machines


JOE

[Bob Wingard]

I too have the 718, and was speaking with a factory tech. about another matter, when we got on the subject of some of the "home-brew" improvements floating around the web. He agreed that link-belts might help reduce harmonic vibrations, but they shouldn't be much of a problem, if any even without the new belt(s). We talked about the "floating" motor mount, and from my profession (Industrial Mechanic) and his experience, we agreed that there is no generally accepted basis for this modification. It may make belt-changing faster/easier, but little or nothing else. Not saying it absolutely doesn't or can't work .. just no theoretical or factual basis for it to do so.

I moved my motor mount to get proper tension on the belts, and I even sometimes remove them if not being used for extended period to keep them from taking a set. I have tried installing a single link-belt, and while it sounds a bit smoother, I see no difference in cut quality. Now, that might be due to other setup parameters, and your situation(s) might be altogether different.

[Jeremy Williams]

Great replies and discussion. I think I'm going to float an email to Woodmaster Tools again in hopes of figuring something out. I would hope I could get the 718 to provide a superior finish right off the outfeed bed similar to the Dewalt. While I wish I could spring for the spiral head ... not gonna happen (yet).

My machine is fairly stable and doesn't shake around too much. In fact, it seems about 2x quieter than the Dewalt and is definitely more poweful (with that 5HP motor, it ought to be!).

The hinge motor mount definately doesn't have consensus in the public ... but I figured, heck why not. I would have done it simply to make the belt changes easier. I'd agree that it didn't eliminate motor shake ... that's just how it goes.

As for the ripples ... I'm outta ideas. This past weekend I ran about 75bf of wood with about 6 passes. It didn't miss a beat and overall I'm happy with it. Afterall, I picked it up for $300 (718, sandpaper, house starter kit of molding knifes, molding heads, sanding head, old-style knife jig and a lot of filth) and have put another $200 into it with the link belt and fance PlanerPal knife jig and blades and cleaning solution. It'll replace my Dewalt 735 for sure ... but to what degree is yet to be determined.

[Mike Keers]

Jeremy, you mention having a starter kit of knives. I have the cutter head and the manual, but no knives. In the manual the knives look very much like, if not identical to the ones I have for my old Craftsman molding head for the TS. That takes three cutters rather than one, but they sure look the same to me--many of you know the head and bits I refer to I'm sure. I was curious if anyone knows more about possibly using the Sears knives in the cutter head, or has--I haven't tried it or even offered up a knife to the molding head, just curious now that you brought up molding. I know my knives fit other cutter heads, so perhaps there is some kind of industry standard about the locating grooves and set screw.

Has anyone here done molding with the 718? I just spent too many frustrating hours with a vertical face cutting bit and router table trying to make about 60 l/f of 2" wide custom face molding for a furniture commission. I think it might have been faster and more cost effective to have a custom knife ground and used the 718. A lot of set up for only the little bit of trim I needed, but it took me ten hours to finally get the molding out with the router, by the time I'd made fixtures and had a few rough starts and ruined some fine cherry. Even at my modest shop rate that represents a lot of wasted time, energy and money. Especially on a firmly-priced job.