$3 rest for 1" post

[Jerry Allen]

Just for the heck of it I picked up some one inch black pipe nipples at HD yesterday to see if I could make a cheap multi-length rest for my Jet 1236. The diameter of the pipe is about 1.035" OD and needs to be about .99" to 1.00 to fit the banjo. I used my grinder and 1" belt sander to get the post there. I also flattened the upper flange of the elbow on both sides.
I had intended to pin or weld the post to the elbow but have not as yet since I have had no problems with it loosening, but I may still do that just to be safe. The rest itself is not likely to loosen and can be replaced with various lengths. I have only tried a 5" (made from a 6" nipple) so far. I was going to epoxy a 5/8" rod or larger rod into the id of the post and rest, but I have used it a couple of times now and it seems plenty rigid. I will definitely add an insert into the post and any longer rests. I have 4", 9" and 12" nipples yet to be tried. I may drill a tranvers hole for removing the rest with a tommy bar.

The picture shows the post at 3 3/8". That should fit a Jet 1236, Delta and HF. Others with 1" posts may require different lengths. Screw everything together first and mark the post for cutting with an angle grinder and cutoff blade by matching the length from the top of your existing rest to the bottom of the post.

I was going to try using some 1" bolts and nuts I have, but the 1" bolts were only .945" diameter.

[Ron McKinley]

Great idea Jerry. Think I'll try one for my Jet mini. Thanks......Ron

[Jerry Allen]

Thanks Ron.
I made a couple for my Jet mini out of solid 5/8" rod. Ground a saddle in the post and welded. At first I silver soldered but it didn't hold. I think 1/2" black pipe might be a little too large an outside diameter and therefore the walls might get too thin on the post unless it's filled with epoxy and a metal rod.
Might be a lot more grinding too. I'll measure one next time I'm in the shop.

[Richard Madison]

Way to go Jerry! Made any of your own turning tools yet? If not, consider the use of tool bits for metal turning lathes at about $3 a piece. Glad for the folks who can buy the best on the market, and also happy for the folks who can build their own.

[Alex Elias]

That is one creative mind. Congrats on the savings. Now go buy a tool with the money you did not spend on the tool rest
Alex

[Paul Engle]

Jerry, neat idea , I have a muffler shop close by wonder if I can get them to bend one for bowl work. Let us know how the longest one works , I have some table legs to do and the longer the better.

[Jerry Allen]

Paul,
I'm not sure what would happen to black pipe if it's bent. Might get weak. I think I'd go for solid material on that. You might not mean 90 deg. which might be okay. I think If I were to try it, I'd just chuck a piece in the vise, heat it, bend and see what happens. I did bend some solid 5/8" rod for my mini that way a full 90 and it's okay. Don't think I could pull off solid 1". Maybe some flat 1" by 3/8" bar, but that would not work with this pipe fitting setup. I think I'd definitely try a conventional center post and solid material for something real long, or something with two posts. An L shaped piece of hardwood bolted to the ways (maybe with a metal top cap) that could slide in and out might be an easy and useful design for long stuff.

Right on Alex. I'm sure that will happen. I don't need much excuse to buy new tools.

Richard,
Yes, made quite a few tools, some using metal turning tools. My favorites are using 1/4" square bar which are inserted into 5/8" solid rod with two set screws. I also made one with square bar at a 45 deg angle like the Sorby. They all work very well. Two other methods I use are to buy Sorby hollowing ends and make my own handles, and taking relatively cheap HF (HSS only) chisels and modifying them. I have some beading tools and scrapers that I made this way.

[Wayne Bitting]

Nicely done Jerry! You just added another jig to my list once the workshop is finished. Great idea!

[Jerry Allen]

Yesterday I made some longer rests which come out to 7 3/4" and 10 3/4" from 9" and 12" black pipe nipples. I was surprised that they were still quite stable and appartently don't need filling. Nevertheless, I think this method has some disadvantages in some cases depending on the diameter and length of the object being turned. I think for a real small diameter with a long length a wooden L shaped rest would be more useful.
Also, Paul, I think if you bend the pipe, you would need to have a pin or something to index the pipe so the curve center line ends up parallel to the ways. If it's straight, you don't need to think about it.

[Bill Stevener]

Hear is my input on the "pipe" tool rest. Not to be a thorn in any ones side.
Pipe is designed to have pressure exerted from the inside and is known to be a very week substitute for anything else "on it's own."
Where the pipe is threaded, the wall thickness has been reduced considerably. The threads create stress risers which are not designed for lateral thrusts and or stresses, which will create fatigue and failure at that point.
An "unintentional catch" may result in a failed tool rest which can be a substantial cause of a serious injury.
I would think, that's why round tool rests are maid from solid round stock.
Just some room for thought.

[Jerry Allen]

Bill,
I appreciate your comments and agree that solid bar would be stonger black pipe.
However, just like a Roman arch, the pipe should be stronger under compression than expansion. The threads do weaken the tube, but the fitting suports that area effect adding support and acting as a double of sorts.
Since the post is fairly short, the bend moment is not very high, although it does increase as the length of the rest segment lengthens. Therefore, a real long system should be filled with steel and epoxy and the joints could also be welded. Of course if you have to weld, you might as well use solid bar in my opinion.
I have used the 5" and 8" rests a few times in the past few days and have found them to be very stable. I have not had any seriouc catches or worked on anything great that 5" in diameter. I don't know if I would trust it for extremely large stuff.
I know of one other turner who has used pipe, although the joints were all welded. Del Stubbs, who does videos on turning bowls, uses common pipe sliced and sharpened into gouges which are far weaker than a full section of pipe and take a tremendous amount of stress at the rest. I doubt if he is the only one.
It's kind of like scrapers being made from files. Some folks are dead against it. Some swear by it. Filling with steel and epoxy or welding would strengthen the system. If anyone has any doubts then they shouldn't try it. There are plenty of things that can go wrong even using a stock commercial roughing gouge. When you consider the stress that the tang takes, one might shy away from ever using one.
Guess it's up to the user making the decision on whether it's safe or not. For very low $ one can test and decide.
This is not my favorite rest. It works feels smooth in use, is easy to fix clean and modify. For me it's just an alternative for some jobs.
If I ever end up with a pipe between the eyes or shrapnel (a good reason not to use galvanized pipe), I'll report back immediately.

[Mike Golka]

I would be much more concerned about the maluable elbow you are using than the pipe itself. The elbow is the weakest link in this chain.

[Bill Stevener]

Jerry,
Just a review of your thoughts.

"The threads do weaken the tube, but the fitting suports that area effect adding support and acting as a double of sorts."

This is not so in the example you have supplied. Note points "A", in the example below. The exposed threads are not in the fitting and are most likely to fail at the points noted.

The intended design of the fitting is violated as the wall thickness has been reduced substantially with the aid of grinding. Another likely failure point, as noted in "B".

"However, just like a Roman arch, the pipe should be stronger under compression than expansion."

As you have noted, should be stronger. Not the case again, as you have reduced the wall thickness of the riser to accommodate the banjo - slide. "C" points out a very high stress point and another area of failure.

"For very low $ one can test and decide. If I ever end up with a pipe between the eyes or shrapnel (a good reason not to use galvanized pipe), I'll report back immediately."

No one can tell a person what to do in there shop, they own it. However, I have always felt that it's safer not to be penny wise and pound foolish.

Just the way I see it.

[Jerry Allen]

I don't know Mike, seems like the elbow is pretty tough to me and I'd have to agree with Bill that the weakest point is the threads just adjacent to the elbow at A.

That being said, and taking note of Bill's comments, I guess you would have to try it before making a judgement. I have. If I was really worried about it I would fill the post, elbow and rest solid with 5/8" steel rod and epoxy or weld it. I've beaten on it to try to induce a crack or vibration. Nothing severe, but at least as forceful as a catch.

Points B and C did not have a lot of material removed.the thickness at B is still .12" and still continuous. C had about .03 removed across the diameter and is still .86 thick. The pipe wall is about .113 thick.

I have seen 3/4" galvanized pipe break at the threads when using an 18" pipe as a cheater bar with poor support. The pipe was not new, and was being beaten with a 5 pound sledge for awhile. Not the same conditions here.

I appreciate the input and will keep alert as to any potential problem.