What grind to use?

[Eric Hartunian]

Hi guys, what kind of grind should I put on my 1/2" bowl gouge? It is a P&N, and came with a very blunt shaped grind. I made my first bowl, and it came out ok, but I had trouble towards the bottom on the inside trying to get a clean cut.
So is there a universal grind, like the Elsworth shape, that works for everything, or are there some rules of thumb for using different shaped tools for different conditions?

Thanks, and I'll post that bowl pic as soon as I can find my camera!

Happy holidays,
Eric

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Eric,

Hopefully someone with more experience than I will chime in. I use an ellsworth/Irish grind on my bowl gouge. Where I find that grind best is for shear cutting/scraping the sides, inside and outside, of bowls. What I use for the bottoms is the normal bevel of the bowl gouge....or a very heavy scraper....I have a Sorby extra heavy duty bowl scraper and a regular flat scraper. Depending on the wood, the grain etc. I use a combination of all of them.


But the main thing regardless of what you use is sharp...sharp...sharp....I will often stop and resharpen whatever I'm using for that last "whisper" thin finishing cut.

Good luck!

[Mike Vickery]

I have several bowl gouges with different grinds on them. The finger nail grind at about a 60 degree angle makes a very good all around tool but some specialty grinds can excell at certain tasks.
If you have only one gouge I say go with a figernail grind somewhere between 55 and 65 degrees.

As a note my 1/2 in ch P&N has a very low angle ( maybe 70 degrees) straight grind on it for doing the transition and bottom of some bowls.

The higher the angle ( for example 40 degrees) the longer the bevel will be and the harder it will be to ride the bevel on the inside of the bowl. It will cut better but will also need to be sharpened more frequently. People can get around the longer bevel by grinding away the bottom area of the bevel, often called a double bevel or micro bevel.

Editied in - One more thought to me certain flute shapes take different grinds better then others. I have never done a finger nail grind on my 1/2 P&N but on my 3/8ths P&N it has a very deep V shaped flute that seems to work better as a straight or side grind as apposed to a finger nail grind

[Jim Becker]

I use Ellsworth gouges for 95% of my turning. Once you learn to use a side-grind to all its advantages, there is little reason to go back to the old, traditional blunt bowl grind except for some specialized uses.

[Dean Thomas]

I'd start with at least a swept back fingernail grind and then as you get to know it, you can sweep it back further and further until you achieve irish grind. I'd agree with the somewhere around 60º bevel from an 8" wheel. I've seen and used irish grinds on both V and U-shapes. Both work just fine. Another man's opinion.

[Gordon Seto]

I believe there is no magic grind. How and what angle you present the gouge to wood depends on your grind. They all have pros and cons. Its always a lose some and gain some battle.

The steeper 40º angle would give you the less resistance in push cut. But on the interior of bowl, it would lose bevel contact (control) on deeper bowls.
The hollow grind also leaves concentric marks at the heel of the tool. That can be fixed with rounding the heel off. Some turners can grind a micro bevel at blunter angle to accomplish deep bowl, but the short bevel makes the gouge more difficult to control.

A 60~65º nose angle would allow us to ride the bevel on the inside of most bowls. So if only have one bowl gouge, that is what you want.

An almost vertical traditional grind would give a clean cut on the bottom of the bowl (transition from side grain to end grain).

Some people would use a scraper for that. Depending on the wood, they all have different results. 80 grit gouge is also a cutting tool.

Most tools (with one or two exceptions) sold are not sharpened for use out of the package. The purpose of the factory grind is only make them look good to sell tools.

Find a local AAW chapter, a grind with instruction on how to use would make the learning easier.
AAW Local Chapter Listing - The American Association of Woodturners

Gordon

[Bill Noce]

Take a look at Doug Thompson's web site check on sharpening he has a very good article on sharpening gouges with the Wolverine jig. I have a few of his gouges(6) and I like the grind that he has on them. The bowl gouge grind is close to the Ellsworth Grind that I use. www.thompsonlathetools.com Bill.....

[Bernie Weishapl]

I have a 3/8" and 1/2" P & N gouges. I left them that way because I use them for my final light cuts on bowls. Really takes care of a lot of the tear out. I learned this from Mike Mahoney.

[Eric Hartunian]

Thanks a lot for all this info. I intend to get an Elsworth tool and give it a try, and for now, leave my P&N as is until I get the feel for what I like/need.

Take care,
Eric