Is all M2 steel created equal?

[Joel Sauder]

I am looking to get my hands on some M2 steel to make some homemade scrapers but I know nothing about steel. I hear all this talk about "good English steel" but is there really there really that much difference between makers of M2 steels? If I buy something listed as M2 High Speed Tool Steel and I going to have to do any annealing or tempering (which I know nothing about) to get it to hold and edge? I am looking at some tool steel offered by the Griggs Steel Company

Any pointers Creekers have would be greatly appriciated

Joel

[Jerry Casler]

Hi Joel check this out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAR1FHg0NoE

[Jerry Casler]

here is another link
http://www.buffaloprecision.com/data.../DSM2HSbpp.pdf

and a link to the aaw forum

http://www.aawforum.org/vbforum/showthread.php?t=1083

hope this helps

Jerry

[EDDIE GLAZE]

look up tool steels on the internet

[Ben Gastfriend]

If you grind this steel, make sure you don't overheat it. As long as it does not lose it's temper (shown by changing color) you will not have to re-temper/anneal it. Good luck.

[David Wilhelm]

joel do you have the tools to do your heating ? I make my tools out of good high carbon steel I've never messed with M2 other than with the tools i own. It's fun to make your own tools and i've made several with carbon I watch for color change I don't bake them. You can however bake your tools for your temper. if you need some help feel free to email me and try to give you some pointers. keep the creek flowing!!

[Ben Gastfriend]

Look what I found. This article is very informative.

http://www.bigtreetools.com/articles/siegel%2018-4.pdf

Good luck.

[Chris Fierro]

Color change on M2 / HSS isn't the same deal as it is on carbon steel. You have to get HSS very hot before it will lost its temper. Pretty improbably that you'd get there on a grinder.

[Bill Bolen]

Yep, what Chris said! Tuning an edge blue on HSS makes no difference at all...Bill...

[robert hainstock]

We call it HSS., the brits call Shefield, the Germans call it Soligen.It is all pretty much the same. You can tell by the grinder sparking the general hardness, the harder the steel, the whiter the spark. carbon steel is more yellow. This is the country way to gage it.
Bob

[Kevin McPeek]

I don't think I'd call it all the same stuff. I know that my HF tools that claim to be HSS are not anywhere near the quality of many of the other brands of tools that are HSS.
If they don't state how the steel is sold maybe you could call them and ask if it is annealed or what temper it is.

[Dean Thomas]

Two quick points, neither of which I can scholastically back up, but both of which were told me by guys who make their living selling and milling this quality of steel.

Yes, there is a range that is M2. If you want something verifiable, grind a HF Chinese M2 gouge and grind a Sheffield steel M2 gouge. The edge on the Sheffield holds markedly longer and you can grind a lot more steel away in less time on the Chinese steel.

Second (again, reporting what was told me, not declaring it to be gospel, okay??), it's true that a little color change in the blue range will not be the end of your HSS tool as it is with your high carbon tools, HOWEVER do not quench a piping hot HSS tool in water. That will do nasty things to the steel. It's okay to cool a tool that can be touched without burning your hand, and that's a good thing to do, but if you can't touch it without pain, don't quench it. Let it AIR cool until you can. Then cool it and be less aggressive about the grind.

Hope it helps.

[Joe Chritz]

There are a lot of different tool steels available. Some are oil hardening, such os 01. Some air hardening like A2 and some have very sophisticated hardening schedules.

Once upon a time I use to grind knives (now I just but the blades) from 01 or 440C stainless. It was $20 to have a couple pounds professionally hardened and tempered to your choice of hardness.

There are different grades of steel called the same thing but if it is truly M2 then it has certain properties. M2 is good steel but nowhere near the top in quality for cutting tools.

Joe

[EDDIE GLAZE]

Joel, Not All Tool Steel`s Are The Same...take A Look At Griggs Steel Co. Charts. The Hardness, Wear Resistance, Tuffnes Of The Steel`s Are All Different. M2 Max Hardeness,64 Rc. Others Up To 68 Rc. Pm M4, 64 Rc The Wear & Tufnes Are Better Than M2. Thompson Tools Are 60-62 Rc. Just A Suggestion, Tell Griggs Steel Co. What You Want The Tool Steel For,maby They Can Suggest What Type Would Be Best.

[Jim Underwood]

Interesting question.

If you had asked are all High Speed Steels the same, I'd have said no in an instant. There are several different grades of HSS, as noted by all the different designations.

It seems to me that M2 is but one grade of HSS, but there really shouldn't be much variation if M2 is a standard, should it?

That being said, I have a set of those HF HSS tools, and a set of Pinnacle tools. I took some of my Pinnacle tools to the woodworking show yesterday, and the president of one of the vendors sharpened my bowl gouge for me and showed me how they ground them for their classes. One of the comments he made about the tool was that it was noticeably softer than some of the top of the line HSS tools.

Eventually I'll be replacing my beginner sets with some more expensive tools.