How do you build the underside of your uppers? and other stuff

[Brad Ridgway]

I am planning my kitchen out... I have some basic questions after getting some (the plywood ladder frame, etc) answered in other posts. btw - some of the postings in here are just beautiful... I would just love to see more detail on this if i could

1) The current cheap particle board stuff i have had an inch recess underneath would could be used for lights... I think i likely what under lighting going forward, but I am not sure about the best way to go. If i buy some nice maple plywood for the carcasses, would you do dadoes for the bottom shelf and then edge band the bottom edge you'd see on the two sides and the back? Or would you rabbit the bottom shelf inand just build a more simple rabbit on the bottom? or something else...

2) for oversized uppers i will likely build 13-14" deep and higher. I have 9' ceilings and the mrs has been asking for something pretty much what frank did in the following post with the small glass doors up high. Did you build the upper as one unit with the upper shelf dadoed and a single face frame?

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?p=422015

2B) I want as few sections as little as possible upon install. Even if they're heavy. I can get help and i've got bottle jacks if needed... My longest span would be 72". Is that doable with the the help? I hate the way i see the joint on the prebuilt stuff you see from the store...

3) Also I found a few posts on installing the accuride (>) slides which is what i want. How do you plan your inside face frame overlaps for these? Do i keep it at a minimum to get the clearance between the drawer/frame or should i just make the proportions good on the frame and shim the slide with ply when mounting if it's a big overlap (this is what the cabniet maker my inlaws used did). I'm assuming there will be some give in case the inner width between the sides fluctuates slightly (make that i hope!)


thx in advance
-brad

[Peter Stahl]

Most uppers are done with the bottom shelf dadoed for strength mostly and to have a place for lighting. As for the 72" long cabinet, if you put a cleat on the wall it should be pretty easy to hang with a several people.

[Jim Becker]

A 72" upper shouldn't be too difficult to hang with help as long as you're using French cleats. Do consider doing the sides in 1/2" material to keep the weight down.

I just hung a 63" wide upper cabinet today for the wet bar in our addition. However, I did build three carcasses, hung them separately on a cleat and then applied the face frame in one piece using glue and pins. (A few biscuits along the top to help with alignment) These were the first uppers that I've built using 1/2" veneer core plywood and they were so much lighter to work with. I plan on doing this again for those in my new office in the addition.

[Joe Chritz]

72" is fine.

I do uppers as such...

Bottom is butt jointed and screwed from the sides with zip's (assembly screws). It is 1/4" from the bottom to the bottom of the side. I apply a face frame with 1/16th or less lip which leaves a decent open area underneath for lights, etc.

Joe

[Brad Ridgway]

Thanks everyone... apologies if this is obvious, but screwing into the studs and floor joists above vs the cleats... What maks the cleats stronger? just spreading the weight evenly?

Also, if i keep 16" spacing between the uppers and the counter top... I have ~58" of cabinet to the ceiling.. So each box would be about 36W x 58H * 13-15D (my wife doesn't want 12" as she had some large plates and chargers she wants to put in there)...

Like Frank i would split the 58" between a square glass door on the top ... So i'd have some crown moulding, about 16x16 doors for the small lighted area and 16x36" doors for the main sections... (hoping that 36" door height wouldn't look odd with the 16 x 24 doors + 16 x 5 or 6 drawers on the bottom)

I guess i need to decide whether i go the cleat route or direct mount or maybe building a ladder framing screwed/bolted into the floor joists to help spread the weight across... should i take the boxes the full height or not (i.e. open above the crown). Thinking i might want room/access to the lighting (and wiring for them)?

thx again
-brad

[Jay Brewer]

Thanks everyone... apologies if this is obvious, but screwing into the studs and floor joists above vs the cleats... What maks the cleats stronger? just spreading the weight evenly?

Also, if i keep 16" spacing between the uppers and the counter top... I have ~58" of cabinet to the ceiling.. So each box would be about 36W x 58H * 13-15D (my wife doesn't want 12" as she had some large plates and chargers she wants to put in there)...

Like Frank i would split the 58" between a square glass door on the top ... So i'd have some crown moulding, about 16x16 doors for the small lighted area and 16x36" doors for the main sections... (hoping that 36" door height wouldn't look odd with the 16 x 24 doors + 16 x 5 or 6 drawers on the bottom)

I guess i need to decide whether i go the cleat route or direct mount or maybe building a ladder framing screwed/bolted into the floor joists to help spread the weight across... should i take the boxes the full height or not (i.e. open above the crown). Thinking i might want room/access to the lighting (and wiring for them)?

thx again
-brad

Hi Brad, I only have a few things to add to the good info you've gotten so far. The "cleat" is just a temporary support( 2"x4") screwed to the wall to support the cab level while you screw it to the wall, alot easier than trying to hold it on a pencil line.

The way I handle light rails:

I build all my uppers without a raised bottom, no dados, simply screwed together. Easier to build and looks better from underneath. The face frame is what makes the light rail. I make the bottom rail of the FF 2 1/4" wide, flush with the inside of the bottom shelf, with 3/4" stock will give you a 1 1/2" "rail" to hide the lighting. If end of the run does not bump into a wall, I install a finished end panel that comes down the same as the FF to complete the boxed in effect.

One last note. The standard height between the base and the uppers is 18". If your building deeper than normal uppers, the 16" you spoke of will seem to close to the counter. Just something to think about.