My Shop

[Ron Hedrick]

When I was a child my dad made me an airplane from wood. About the only thing that made this resemble a plane was that it had a fuselage, wings, rudder, propeller and tail section. Probably at this time if I still had that plane and took it on Antiques Road Show, they would classify it as American Folk Art and it would be worth a lot monetarily. As I grew older I came to the realization that this object was not a very good depiction of an airplane, in fact it was downright rudimentary. Somewhere along the line it was thrown away. I would give the Antiques Road Show price to have that airplane back. My dad made this airplane with the most rudimentary of tools. We were poor and my dad could never afford the better tools. This brings me to my point.

A week or so ago there was a post on this website that stated either buy the best, (never stated buy the best that you could afford), buy the best or don't buy anything. I took exception with that statement. I was chastised by one of the moderators concerning my response. I backed off. For some reason that post really bothered me. I cannot afford the best, I can afford moderate to good tools and equipment. Since that post I have not even felt like going into the shop. I'm hoping that this post is cathartic for me, which is why I am posting this. That reason and no other.

If the moderators want to ban me from this site, fine, do so. But, I am going to get this off of my chest. If the moderators want to pull this post that is fine also. I am going back into my shop with my less than the best and once again turn out what I hope would have made my dad proud. So let the chips fall where they may (wood chips that is).

Thank you all for your insights and help.

[Scott Rader]

everyone is different...not everyone can afford the most expensive equipment.

[Eric DeSilva]

I missed the prior post, but the statement that you should buy the best or not buy at all is patently absurd. To play off your analogy, its the pilot, not the plane. I've seen beautiful things come from simple tools and met people that--even with the best of tools--couldn't produce anything I'd ever want. Besides, the best is subjective anyway.

I smile when I see posts about concerns regarding runouts of a gazillionth of an inch. Getting the most out of your tools I understand. But, when I start worrying about that, you might as well take my shop away. I'd say buy the best you can afford--there is a false economy in cheap tools if you outgrow them and replace them. Tools, in my book, are for life. But, even if you can't afford a Felder or whatever, for many of us woodworking is about a process and doing something with your hands. You don't need to spend the national debt to find it rewarding.

Now, go back into your shop and make something.

[Rod Sheridan]

Ron, the advice in the above posts is excellent.

My father-in-law is a retired cabinet maker, served his apprenticeship in a shop that was several hundred years old at the time.

He can make a Chippendale chair out of an old milk crate, using a wooden spoon and a finger nail file.

I can't make a Chippendale chair using the snazziest, most expensive machinery known to mankind.

Over the last 30 odd years of woodworking, I've found that purchasing high quality tools and machinery saves money in the long run.

I think we all come to that conclusion eventually, however that doesn't mean you need an Altendorf to build your first bird feeder.

It is false economy to purchase inferior objects that require replacement, however it's worse to let people discourage you from woodworking with their elitist comments.

Go out to the shop, build something, develop your skills and machinery collection over the years as interest and finances permit.

Most importantly, enjoy the hobby, and in time become a mentor for someone else, that's what the more senior woodworkers should be doing, not discouraging interested particpants.

Regards, Rod.

[Matthew Voss]

I would hope you do not to let anyone participating in this forum discourage you, including moderators. Perhaps the moderator's tone was misinterpreted.

It is the swordsman friend, not the sword. I wouldn't take it personally.

[Bob DeWolfe]

A friend uses tools that have been cast offs, (from the dump or on there way there), not one new tool. The shop was built with recycled materials. It is a delight to see him work and the pieces he puts out. Most could be sold for a lot of money but he does this for family and friends giving away everything and not making a dime. The materials he uses are all recycled and has not paid anything for them. He makes do with what he has. He is respected for his knowledge and people are always seeking his guidance which he gives willingly. His enjoyment comes from making good pieces and overcomming the short falls in his equipment. I am proud to call him a friend, a mentor, and teacher and hope that one day my work can be a great as his.

Use what you have and keep making chips.

[Dave Anderson NH]

Hi Ron,

As a moderator, I'd like to note that we do not censor posts or threads for content except when they are on prohibited topics like sex, religion, or politics, etc. What we do chide folks for is posts which make personal attacks, use rude and condescending language, denigrate products without data to back up a viewpoint, or otheerwise "flame". I did not read the other thread, so I can't comment on why oyu were chided, but we try very hard not to be arbitrary. Unfortunately, this is sometimes a judgement call and we aren't always perfect.

Now on to your topic....

It is often forgotten that some of the finest crafted and designed furniture was made before the era of power tools. Likewise, woodworkers in many third world countries produce beautiful pieces with minimal tools, many of which are of a quality that almost all of us at any income level in the developed world would consider trash and throw in the rubbish. The bottom line is that woodworking at a high level is about craftsmanship, not tools. Top level craftsmanship does not come easily or quickly. It must be earned over time and it often requires sacrifices of lumber to the god of mistakes.

My personal take is that you buy the best you can afford and if something is just barely out of reach financially you wait to buy and find a way to work around the problem. The most important tool we own is between our ears and most of us take the easy way out and buy another tool rather than exercise our brain power. When I was younger and funds were limited by a lower income and the raising of children, I still found a way to get things done. If I really needed something I asked family to either give me money or got the family to pool resources to get me a present.

Summary: Care and craftmanship trumps money and fancy equipment every time.

[Joe Vee]

Ron,

Based on these posts, I would say the majority of us are on budgets. The most expensive tool I own is my Woodmaster 712, and I only bought it because for the money it does the job of 4 tools. All my other tools are lower end, and I make some decent wood projects. To me it's relaxing to take raw wood and use my "cheap" machines' and make stuff. Good luck

Joe

[Jim Becker]

What Dave said. And I remind folks that public discussion of moderation is not allowed at SMC.

Jim
SMC Moderator
---------------

And IMHO, it should always be "buy the best (for you) that you can afford". But my corollary/addition to that is "even if you have have to wait an extra month or three to aquire the means to do so." As consumers, we have an obligation to ourselves to maximize the value for anything we decide to purchase including our tools. I wasted a lot of money early in my woodworking endeavors becasue I bought things that were guaranteed to cost me more money in the long run because they would not last or would not really work well for the jobs at hand. If I don't express concern on this, than as a community member, I feel I've failed the community.

[Steven DeMars]

I am what most people call a realist. You have to realize that most people on this site are woodworkers due to their choice as a hobby to relax. They come from all walks of life. A lot of these guys are retired from life long professions. They have $$$$$ to spend. . .When you figure you have only X amount of time left, you tend to not waste it . . . You buy the best if you can, makes the hobby go smoother.

When someone suggest "buy the best or nothing", usually that someone has already bought something less and has had to deal with the disappointment it caused. I would far rather have a shop full of bench top Delta equipment than only a MINMAX 30" band saw.

Another thing you have to consider, are your skills at this point developed enough to really utilize let's say a $8,500.00 ONEWAY lathe or a Felder Slider.

I have a nice Delta Contractor's Saw. Trust me, beyond dust collection it can do anything I am capable of doing, "at this point" . . as my skills improve, I'll buy better.

On a whole, I have never seen anyone say anything but positive on this site. That reminds me, need to go to PayPal and make my 2008 donation.

[Lee Koepke]

and dont forget, the plane your dad built ... he did it for himself and you. The woodworking you do, and what you do it with is for the same people!

I am not discouraged by the comments here, and I use them all in my evaluation process. Personally, I just bought a set of Groz handplanes, immediately after reading 10 posts saying dont do it !!! I am stubborn that way ..

Keep up the good attitudes !!!

[Sean Troy]

When I was a child my dad made me an airplane from wood. About the only thing that made this resemble a plane was that it had a fuselage, wings, rudder, propeller and tail section. Probably at this time if I still had that plane and took it on Antiques Road Show, they would classify it as American Folk Art and it would be worth a lot monetarily. As I grew older I came to the realization that this object was not a very good depiction of an airplane, in fact it was downright rudimentary. Somewhere along the line it was thrown away. I would give the Antiques Road Show price to have that airplane back. My dad made this airplane with the most rudimentary of tools. We were poor and my dad could never afford the better tools. This brings me to my point.

A week or so ago there was a post on this website that stated either buy the best, (never stated buy the best that you could afford), buy the best or don't buy anything. I took exception with that statement. I was chastised by one of the moderators concerning my response. I backed off. For some reason that post really bothered me. I cannot afford the best, I can afford moderate to good tools and equipment. Since that post I have not even felt like going into the shop. I'm hoping that this post is cathartic for me, which is why I am posting this. That reason and no other.

If the moderators want to ban me from this site, fine, do so. But, I am going to get this off of my chest. If the moderators want to pull this post that is fine also. I am going back into my shop with my less than the best and once again turn out what I hope would have made my dad proud. So let the chips fall where they may (wood chips that is).

Thank you all for your insights and help.

The important thing is get back in the shop and do what you do best and have fun doing it. some of the best info on the web can be found here as well as opinions. Take it with a grain of salt . Be safe

[Thomas Knighton]

Just my opinion, but don't let it get under your skin to much. Quality tools are a great thing to have, but nothing says you have to spend a fortune on anything despite what some people may say. So long as the tool does what you need it to do, nothing else matters.

People who make comments like "buy the best or don't buy anything" are actually well-meaning folks. They're trying to save someone from aggrevation and heartache. Unfortunately, they're really discouraging a lot of folks from ever putting steel to wood. Waiting for a used cabinet saw, or having to wait to buy a saw until I had an extra $1K laying around would have kept me from ever building anything. Circumstances changed and I found myself leaning toward hand tools instead, but that's irrelevant. What is imporant is these folks mean well, but don't realize the negative side of their comments.

Don't sweat the small stuff...none of us are getting out of life alive

Tom

[Gary Breckenridge]

Schlubs like me have to make do with mass market tools from Delta, Stanley, Porter Cable and Skil. While I realize this is a notch above Borg specials they are two notches above Harbor Freight products. That said there is a level above mass marketers that I don't look at seriously. And there is even another level of super precision tools for the super rich. Table saws can run from $250 to over $8000 and they all will cut a 2 x 4. Quailty used tools and family heirlooms are another story.

[Warren Clemans]

I used to do a lot of rock and ice climbing back when I was younger and invincible. I enjoyed hanging around climbing shops talking gear with the sales guys and other customers. I remember one old timer who finally had enough. His opinion was that if there's something you can't climb, chances are the problem is you, not your gear. Obviously the best gear will help at the margins, but as many others have said in previous posts, it's the craftsman, not the tools, that matters. My daughter has a doll crib that my grandfather made for my mom out of a packing crate using only his pocketknife (or so the story goes). Just go to work and ignore the festoolers! (Nothing against them, of course...)