Charging per minute

[Anthony Scira]

I know there are many diffrent ways to charge for the laser time. It sounds like 1.00 a minute is kind of the standard.

So far I have only done little one off's so the price per minute was never a factor.

But I think I may have a chance to supply a local bar with some pint glasses. The only problem is the sample I showed them is with flames around the base and their logo. Total run time was 12 minutes. Without the flames it was only 3 minutes.

But the flames do look pretty cool ! And I would have a hard time selling them at 14 or 15 bucks a copy. But I guess you never know till you try !

But for a bulk order what do you drop your prices down too ?

[Scott Shepherd]

As a general rule, I quote $2 per minute. $2 per minute sounds expensive until you break down the time it takes to do something. You can tell someone $2 a minute and they will feel ripped off, but charge them $2 to do a logo on a shotglass and they feel like it's a good, fair price.

At $1 per minute, you're giving yourself no place to discount for volume. Drop down below that much and you're not paying for your laser (in my opinion).

Bottom line, the laser costs money, the electricity to run it costs money, the future recharge of the tube costs money. I haven't seen any laser shop make a go at it for less than $1 per minute for any extended period.

As for the flames around the glass, that's a tough one. With that much detail, it might be better to buy the premade mask and sandblast them. As much as we'd all like them to be, laser's aren't always the answer to every job. Gosh knows I've tried so to make them all laser jobs so far

[Rodne Gold]

We often go way below $1 per minute , but this is for jobs where the numbers are in the 1000's and we got to be competitive. We generally price per object or marking , sometimes we win big time , like $1.50 for a job with a 12 second cycle time.

What you charge is often dependant on how much you need the work and how much other ways of marking or processing would cost.
For example doing the glasses would be much cheaper with a printing process if the qty was high.

After being in the trade for a while you get a "feel" for pricing and are generally spot on,
If we fabricate from scratch we use a simple formula , 5-6x material cost and if it looks too cheap , up it and vice versa
Ultimately , you should charge what the market can bear.

[Joe Pelonio]

I agree with Scott. I would consider the $1/minute to be a bottom discounted price for a big job with over 1,000 pieces.

[Michael Kowalczyk]

I also agree that 1.00 per minute is low but it depends on what you are doing and where you are located also. How many other laser shops are there within your working area. Is it business to business, retail, wholesale or non profit? B to B is normally 1.00 to 1.50 per minute but I use actual time not just laser time because you still have to set up and clean up. Retail is 2.00 per min and up plus set up. Wholesale is 1.00 and up and non profits are around .50 to .75 a min and I usually do it in the evenings. Now this is not the rule but a base to start with.

Like Rodne I usually price by the piece and see what is fair after I have done my time study. On big runs if you run 1 part and base your time from it, the rest will cut even faster because you are cutting them in an array. This way your over travel and acc and dec are minimized. For instance you cut one 2" key chain with a small engraving and some text. It takes 1 minutes and 17 seconds. Now if you can nest your work so you get 12 across and 6 down and multiply it by 1 minute and 17 seconds you would think it would take about 93 minutes. But in fact when you do the actual run it may take only 58 seconds each or about 71+- minutes. These numbers are just hypothetical but depending on what you are doing it almost always works out this way for us.

[Anthony Scira]

Those sound like very sound guidelines to go by. The problem doing these glasses are they use the rotary attachment and can only be done one at a time.

I think I will try setting my speed higher. Right now I am just using Epilogs reccomended glass settings. Which is 35 speed and 100 power. I will try one at 75 speed. That should cut the time in half right and make the price point closer to what I think the customer is looking for.

I am also in the boat of I am new at all this laser stuff and I may have to do some cut rate jobs just to get the word out.

[Kenneth Hertzog]

Anthony
As a possible thought you could double run it
do the flame at a higher speed and the logo where it looks good
just a thought.
ken

[Mike Null]

I think Rodne makes a very good point that not all jobs are best done on a laser.

I had a customer call last evening looking for a lower lasering price on several thousand pieces. When she told me what she was paying I replied that my price would be higher but that she should have the item die cut and pad printed. By doing that she could save over $.50 each.

[Bill Cunningham]

On most items I charge by the sq. inch, and others I charge by the job.. I have a job coming in the first week in april, and it just etching a logo into tubular plastic pieces. The pieces are injection molded in one piece, so a logo on the side is impossible to do in the mold or they wont get it out. The plastic is thick walled delrin, and under very high pressure when in use. They have had no success with hotstamping, pad printing or screen printing, because the ink won't adhere properly and either flakes or wears off from the chemicals used with the finished product.. the etched logo is the same colour as the delrin, and is not readily visible, but thats they way they want it .. I charge $2.00 per piece, and do 1000 at a time.. It's a good deal for them, because I do them 'when' they need them, they can depend on them being done in time, and they know the logo won't come off under any condx. And all that is part of pricing a job too!!

[Gary Hair]

I may have to do some cut rate jobs just to get the word out.

The only thing you will accomplish is "getting the word out" that you are cut rate. Just because you are new doesn't mean your work isn't worth full price. Do great work and charge a fair price.

For that particular job I wouldn't consider anything but sandcarving. It is much faster than lasering and you can have a company like Ikonics make the masks for you. A laser is a great tool but not the best for everything. "just because you have a hammer doesn't mean everything is a nail"

Gary

[Mike Hood]

Also consider what you're willing to work for, keep the power on, a roof over the laser's head, etc when setting a per/minute rate. I either charge $2/min or $65/hour and a lesser per minute charge. I do work for a UAV firm, and I sell them "blocks" of time up front. They pay me $2/min for 1-250 minutes... $1.50/min for any block under 500 minutes, and then $1/min for jobs above that.

I then add a $65/hr shop rate with a 1 hour minimum to set up and clean up.

Sounds harsh... but if I spend a 4 hour evening working up a kit and only charge $240... it's not worth my time.

[Anthony Scira]

You guys are great !

The sandblasting is out for now for a couple reasons. First I don't have the equipment. Second I have no idea how to use it.

But that wont stop me from buying some and learning.

But for now I got the glasses looking pretty good at 90 speed and 100 power. Takes a little under 5 minutes. So I think 10 bucks a glass for 100 glasses would not be too cut rate.

I am an official business but since this is a micro part time job. I would be happy if the machine can make the payments on itself until I find the niche market that will make it lucrative enough to devote more time too it.

But it will be quite a while before I can quit my day job !

[Barbara Buhse]

Anthony,

The advice about not pricing yourself too low is right on. I have had some customers expect a low price because we are individuals working out of our home (people who know us personally, even though we are an incorprated business) they expect us to do stuff cheap. Then when they hear that my price is competetive, and not necessarily cheaper than, say, internet prices, they complain. I will not lose money on a job, even if I think it will lead to more jobs.... because when it does, they will expect the same lowball pricing forever. These always turn out to be the biggest PITA customers too. So, if they want my reliability, my really fast (better than anyone else) turnaround time, proofreading (because they always spell something wrong, and a the local sign shop always prints it "as is"... without ever questioning a wrong spelling) and better designs and customer service, then they will pay a reasonable price. Its not worth my time otherwise.
You have skills and equipment that are unique, and if they want it, they will be willing to pay.
Why not give your pub glass customer a choice of with and without flames?

[Bob Davis]

Raising the speed can be a good idea, but what about dropping the dpi? 400 dpi is more than enough on glass, 300 dpi usually looks great, maybe 200 is enough? If you usually use 600dpi you cut the time required from 12 minutes to 4 minutes, and probably the customer can't tell or doesn't care.
But wait a minute! Your customer doesn't care how long it takes you. They're paying for a result. They can't use and don't value your time. Hourly rates are no more than a starting point in working out a price. Charge what the market will bear. If you're able to do it in one third of the time there is no point in cutting your price by two thirds! In nearly every market the actual cost of producing something is almost irrelevant to the final sale price. When I visited Las Vegas the price of a hotel room went from $40 a night when I arrived to $160 as I was leaving four days later and nobody was squealing; the market dictates the price.