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Thread: Situations where a Riving Knife would cause problems?

  1. #16
    OK - in regard to the above problems, what do you think about this splitter:

    http://www.leestyron.com/sharkgriz.php

    The maker of them provides three separate splitters of different widths...
    Last edited by Daniel Hillmer; 10-23-2008 at 1:52 PM.

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by glenn bradley View Post
    Most splitters do not raise and lower with the blade. I use an MJ Splitter with great success as they are easily removed for non-through cuts and 99* of my TS cuts are at 90*.

    There are riving knives that exceed the blade height but these are no better than many American version splitter / guard assemblies that come on American saws, at least for me. I would want my riving knife to meet these criteria for greatest usefulness to how I work, YMMV:

    - Should sit just below blade height in all blade positions.
    - Should be easily removable for convenience during dado use or blade changes.

    That's all it has to do to make me happy.
    So if I understand this correctly, all splitters can only be used during 90 degree cuts?

  3. #18
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Hillmer View Post
    If money was no object, would you buy, or avoid a table saw with a riving knife?
    Put it this way. Money is an object. A big one. But I have become so convinced of the necessity of a riving knife that I will not buy a saw unless it has one.

    (I currently have a GI Contractor-style saw with a homemade splitter, which I would like to upgrade.)


    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmie Mayfield View Post
    I agree with Rob. If the riving knife extends above the height of the blade and cannot be removed, then you can't perform non-through cuts. My Ryobi BT3100's riving knife extends well above the blade
    If it extends above the blade then it isn't a riving knife, it's a splitter. It's a subtle difference that I think confuses a lot of folks.


    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Hillmer View Post
    So if I understand this correctly, all splitters can only be used during 90 degree cuts?
    No. My splitter tilts with the blade, but it just doesn't raise or lower.
    "It's Not About You."

  4. #19
    Thanks Art OK so what's the big difference safety wise, that a splitter can not do, that a riving knife can do, in terms of accident prevention?

  5. #20
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    Most of the safety devices on cheaper saws are more nuisance than they're worth. Both my jobsite Makita and my previous BT3000 had the safety stuff tossed. If the safety devices are not well thought out and engineered than IMHO they're more a hazard than they are useful. Check out whatever saw you want very well before you spend your money.
    I have a guard on one of my Uni's and a splitter on the other which will be dedicated to ripping. Eventually I'll put a guard on the 2nd Uni as well. Though I've been using it without for so many years it's taken me awhile to get used to having one again. If money were no object i'd replace them both with Sawstops, of course if money were no object I'd buy myself a building and all the machinery I could ever want to fill it
    good luck,
    JeffD

  6. #21
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    To get a UL label, all new model saws produced after 2010 (I believe) will be required to have a riving knife. New production of old model saws will be required to have riving knives after 2013 (I believe).

    I'm not sure of the dates but riving knives will be required shortly.
    Howie.........

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Duncan View Post
    Most of the safety devices on cheaper saws are more nuisance than they're worth.
    Sometimes the safety devices can be converted to riving knives. My Bosch 4000 came with a combination splitter/guard that was too cumbersome, but because it mounted directly to the blade mechanism like a riving knife, I was able to reshape the splitter into a riving knife using a jigsaw and file. This idea wasn't mine -- somewhere out there there's a thread or website that shows the process step-by-step.

  8. #23
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    The Euro riving knife can be remover/installed and adjusted to any direction.

    The Safety regulation states that "Riving Knife and Blade Guard MUST be installed for ANY operation on the table saw (or, as the British call it - "Saw Bench").

    As the Reg's are saying; If you have to remove the Riving Knife or the Blade Guard for any operation, it means that you are "not using the correct machine for the correct job" (as you know, Dado blades are prohibited in EU).

    The riving knife has a slot so we can adjust it up/down but it's an "open slot".

    Not long ago, they made a new regulation that this slot must be closed and it's unsafe to operate a TS with an "open slot" riving knife (probably, there was a case that the retaining nut/bolt opened during operation and the riving knife together with the blade guard flown toward the operator).

    A few months ago, I welded a piece of iron to close the "open slot"...just to be on the safe side...

    The riving knife should sit 3~8mm (1/8"~5/16") behind the blade and should be around 3mm (1/8") below the blade.

    Regards
    niki
    Riving knife.jpg

  9. #24
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    First.. all newly designed saws have to have a riving knife by Jan. 1, 2009. Older designs that have been in production have a grand-father clause and do not have to be re-designed to accomodate a riving knife until Jan. 1. 2017.

    Second... you cannont say a riving knife is not a "true riving knife" if it extends beyond the height of the blade. Quite a number of riving knives do go higher than the blade as it is simply up to the manufacturer to determine. I have seen many Euro machines that the knife is taller than th blade and they did that for a reason.

    Third.. you ask about the Shark Guard from Lee Styrone. Lee does quality work building a splitter that is second class to none. He grinds his splitters thicker than factory and thicker than most manufacturers grind their riving knives as most are too thin. The Shark Guard is the most functional and well made after-market guard on the market IMO. I build my own but do get the excellently ground splitter directly from Lee as he has the equipment to do it right.

    Fourth.. I have had 2 TS's with riving knives and two with splitters that I modified to something very similar to Lee's Shark Guard. In all cases the riving knife or splitter was taller than the blade as I would not buy a saw with one shorter unless 2 were supplied with the saw. One taller and one shorter.

    I am Euro trained and I want a knive or splitter I can attach a Crown Guard to. A crown guard is mounted on top of the knife or splitter and stops a launch of any stock that can be thrown straight up in a kick-back scenario. And a riving knife or proper splitter alone will not stop all kick-back as kick-back has several causes.

    Even though the riving knife is the current rage here in the U.S., there appears to be still quite a bit of confusion about them. The first riving knives were not developed in Europe but were on an early American saw. After Uni-saw came out in 1937 all manufacturers copied it and it didn't have a riving knife as about all saws were cloned after that Uni-saw. The Europeans adapted a riving knife from the design of one that had been on that American saw well before they did it.

    Have a good day and don't attempt to over-think this issue as it it really a simple design that does what it does. Nothing more.. nothing lesss.

    Sarge..

  10. #25
    My sawstop has an awesome riving knife. It requires no tools to install, it just has a lever that you clamp down to secure it. It comes factory aligned to the blade, raises and lowers with the blade, tilts with the blade, and does not go above the blade. Its by far the best designed riving knife I've seen on the market. The blade guard from sawstop is just as easy to use as well. I previously never used a blade guard on a saw due to the fact that it required tools to install, or it wouldn't quite line up right, or it was just a pain in the butt to use. The sawstop riving knife and blade guard are so easy to install and use I've never not used them. Its so satisfying to use all the safety equipment without it interfering with my work. I know sawstop is out of your price range, but I strongly recommend them. I bought a powermatic 2 years ago because sawstop was too pricey, and I regret doing so. I should have got the sawstop from the beginning.

  11. #26
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    It is my understanding and but I could be wrong, that a half fence that does not extend to the back of the blade will overcome the chance of kickback. Even if the half fence cut down the chances, which it does sustantially, why not use one? It costs zero or just about zero to do and is readily reversible for any occasion it gets in the way. I just clamp a piece of board to my fence to get the same effect and I can quickly change the length of it if crosscutting.
    Chris

    Everything I like is either illegal, immoral or fattening

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howard Acheson View Post
    To get a UL label, all new model saws produced after 2010 (I believe) will be required to have a riving knife. New production of old model saws will be required to have riving knives after 2013 (I believe).

    I'm not sure of the dates but riving knives will be required shortly.
    New models January 2008
    All production 2014.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  13. #28
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    Danial, as an aside, I don't think you have the option of backing out of the EBAY transaction. Once you click, you're fully committed...they even flash a warning screen up about that. But you could likely resell the 1023SL for what you paid for it or more, especially if it's in good condition, if you decide to go with a saw equipped with a riving knife. Fred Voorhees recently bought the Jet and it's a very nice machine.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  14. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Art Mulder View Post
    ...
    If it extends above the blade then it isn't a riving knife...
    I beg to differ. My European saw has a steel plate almost the thickness of the blade that rises, falls, and tilts with the blade, is aligned with the blade, close to the blade, and is called a riving knife. But it normally extends an inch above the blade so a guard can attach to it (remember that non-through cuts are not allowed in Europe).

    My saw can use either 10 inch or 12 inch blades. Therefore if you are using a 12 inch blade, you can lower the knife an inch, like you were using a 10 inch blade, and it is just below the blade height. You can now cheat and make non-through cuts. With a small grinding wheel and 10 minutes with a dremel, many users of my saw have extended the mounting slot, so that the knife can be run below the level of 10 inch blades as well.

    If I ever used my dado blade (works on the North American version of my saw, but not legal in Europe) I would have to remove the riving knife. I also remove it if I have a stopped cut (very rare).

  15. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Grotenhuis View Post
    My sawstop has an awesome riving knife. It requires no tools to install, it just has a lever that you clamp down to secure it. It comes factory aligned to the blade, raises and lowers with the blade, tilts with the blade, and does not go above the blade. Its by far the best designed riving knife I've seen on the market. .

    Mark,
    The riving knife on my Powermatic 2000 does all of those things too.

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