I opened a can of worms - Help needed with these walls

[Dan Mages]

First off, whoever the masochist was that decided that a 1" thick mud job was necessary for a tile wall in a half bath has a few words comin from me... and they aint gonna be said here per TOS!

I have spent several days with a 5lbs sledge hammer pulling this stuff out. I have probably 1500 lbs of tile and concrete sitting in my garage from this mess!! And on top of that, I had the metal lathe to deal with.

Now that I have that portion of the job done, I noticed that I stirred up one big can of worms... termites in fact. The sill in this corner is rather punky from old termite damage. We have had termite inspections and no active problems were found. This brings up issue #1. Should I let this be, or get it fixed. I know for a fact that I do not have the money to hire someone to do this and it is probably beyond my skills.



Now comes issue #2. All of the walls are made of 1" thick and contain 1/2" of wall board topped with a 1/2" of plaster. What is the best way to make the wall match... two layers of drywall, add 1/2" of lathe then a layer of drywall, or use 1" drywall? Which would you use? Before you answer that, also notice that the right side of the wall has a concrete block wall that is 1/2" from the edge of the wall. And to make matters even worse, the tile and mudjob along the base of the wall does not want to come off the concrete apron along the base. I might have to rent a demolition hammer to remove that part. Its not too important that the wall is 100% smooth at the transition as the bottom portion will be covered by beadboard.

Any thoughts on how to handle the sill issues and hand the wallboard in this nonsense would be appreciated.

I need a beer just thinking about it.

Dan

[James Jaragosky]

This brings up issue #1. Should I let this be, or get it fixed. I know for a fact that I do not have the money to hire someone to do this and it is probably beyond my skills.
You seem to have answered this question for us.

On question 2 I would just put up two layers of 1/2 inch material Dura rock or green board. If the tile along the base will not affect the re-installation of the tub, just leave it.Make real sure you do not have a current termite problem. You will regret ignoring it if you do.

[Bob Lloyd]

#1 If you have termite damage; why go through all the work you have done and will do and not fix the damage? Replacing a sill is not that hard to do; as James said you would probably regret not doing it. If you do not want to rip it out and replace it, you could always try an epoxy repair.

#2 I would add furring strips of the right thickness to the edge of the studs to bring them out to where you want them to be.

[Dan Mages]

Originally Posted by James Jaragosky

This brings up issue #1. Should I let this be, or get it fixed. I know for a fact that I do not have the money to hire someone to do this and it is probably beyond my skills.
You seem to have answered this question for us.

On question 2 I would just put up two layers of 1/2 inch material Dura rock or green board. If the tile along the base will not affect the re-installation of the tub, just leave it.Make real sure you do not have a current termite problem. You will regret ignoring it if you do.

One small correction... this is a half bath... no tub. I am worried about the tile and the concrete being in the way of the drywall and bead board that will eventually go up.

Originally Posted by Bob Lloyd

#1 If you have termite damage; why go through all the work you have done and will do and not fix the damage? Replacing a sill is not that hard to do; as James said you would probably regret not doing it. If you do not want to rip it out and replace it, you could always try an epoxy repair.

#2 I would add furring strips of the right thickness to the edge of the studs to bring them out to where you want them to be.

I have never replaced a sill. How do I do it safely without having the house come down on top of me?

Dan

[Michael Schwartz]

Originally Posted by Dan Mages

I have never replaced a sill. How do I do it safely without having the house come down on top of me?

Dan

first things first figure out if its a load bearing wall. If it its exterior it probably is. You would need to support the load above it either with a temporary wall, or jacks, and cut the sill out and replace it. If you don't know what your doing here already your best bet would be to hire somebody who does.

[Greg Cuetara]

Dan,
In regards to item #1. You have the wall open and accessible so now is the time to fix it. I had a similar problem this spring when I opened up a wall. Lots of rot and water damage so I had to replace the sill and some framing, exterior sheathing and siding. Never done it before but I shored up a beam framing into the wall and then tore everything out and replaced it.

Figure out which way the framing goes and put in a cripple wall then tear out the framing in question. Replace it and move on. You do NOT want to close up the wall with punky wood or rotted wood in the wall. If the wood is punky it is not providing any structural strength so if you are really worried about things falling down then I would be more worried if you don't do anything. If you have everything cleared out and ready to go it might not be a big job to hire someone to come in for a half day to take care of it. As a side note wood structures are fairly amazing when it comes to redistribution of load when something goes wrong.

Greg

[dan grant]

if you were using a 5 lb sledge on the walls i would check the opposite side of that wall to see if there is any damage, all those hits will loosen up screws etc. i would also fir the wall out to miss all the obstacles, renos are fun hey

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I did that in my Daughter and SIL's first home.

It was an inch or two of mortar. We pulled it out replaced with plywood and Pressed fiber underlay board and tiled it.

There was a time when that thick mortar was state of the art.

Just strip it all and lay ply, and underlay and tile it.

[Bob Lloyd]

Dan

What length of sill is effected and what are the dimensions of the rotten sill? Typically, I would replace sills in short sections ( about 3' or so). At that length, I have found that not much temporary support is needed but each situation is different. I have a number of friends who are not contractors who have done this.

Bob

[sean m. titmas]

Originally Posted by Dan Mages

Now that I have that portion of the job done, I noticed that I stirred up one big can of worms... termites in fact. The sill in this corner is rather punky from old termite damage. We have had termite inspections and no active problems were found. This brings up issue #1. Should I let this be, or get it fixed. I know for a fact that I do not have the money to hire someone to do this and it is probably beyond my skills.


If there are no active termites in the wall and the damage is limited you can just leave it and close up the wall. However, it may cause you problems later on with settling of the wall and cracking of the new tile job or what ever you put on the wall. now that the wall is open it would be a good time to replace the sill. i would assume that the section of plate is fairly short (3'-4')? if so than you can just cut it out with a recip saw and let the exterior sheathing hold the wall from sagging during the process. i've done this plenty of times and never had troubles with the wall sagging. if your worried about it sagging than you can angle in a few 2x4 from the bottom of the top plate down to the ground about 12" away from the bottom plate. shoot a block to the floor to hold it in place. replace the rotten plate with treated lumber.
Now comes issue #2. All of the walls are made of 1" thick and contain 1/2" of wall board topped with a 1/2" of plaster. What is the best way to make the wall match... two layers of drywall, add 1/2" of lathe then a layer of drywall, or use 1" drywall?

1" drywall is only used for shaft walls and is very hard to work with and a double layer of 1/2" is wasteful and unnecessary. instead attach 2" rips of 1/2" plywood on the face of the studs to make the backer board flush out with the surrounding wall board. use a straight edge to check the wall and use tapered shims to flatten out the finish surface. if you are installing tile and want to use sheetrock than you will want to use a moisture barrier from Nobel or Schulder to provide a suitable base to set your tile. even though it is not a continuous wet area you can still use the material to give the tile a stronger bond to the wall.

I prefer using Hardie Boards tile backer board. its a concrete based board that cuts cleanly with a 4" diamond wheel and provides a strong base to set your tiles.
attach the plywood rips with framing nails or 2" construction screws. to attach the backer board use some construction adhesive like PL 400 or Liquid Nails and some backer board screws to securely attach it to the wall.

do your best to remove all the tile all the way down to the floor to prevent any problems with attaching the beadboard.

[Phil Thien]

What is the damaged wood sitting on, and how deep does the damage go?

In cases like this I have a union carpenter I call for help. He charges me about $300 a day, for something like that I'd expect him to work about a half day and ask for $200, which I'd kindly hand-over (along w/ two cases of beer). I'd supply all materials.

He has done work for me that nobody else wanted to touch. And he works fast and always knows exactly what to do. Kinda like my own Tom Silva or Norm Abrams.

You can find union carpenters by calling your local hall (check www.carpenters.org).

[Marty Barron]

While you have half the wall off I would take the other half of the wall off. I would fix the sill plate as others have mentioned. I would take out the old insulation and put in new insulation and now cover it over with a 6 mil heavy duty poly vapour barrier for the exterior walls. Now you can cover with mildew resistant drywall, cement board, etc.

Marty

[sean m. titmas]

Originally Posted by Marty Barron

While you have half the wall off I would take the other half of the wall off. I would fix the sill plate as others have mentioned. I would take out the old insulation and put in new insulation and now cover it over with a 6 mil heavy duty poly vapour barrier for the exterior walls. Now you can cover with mildew resistant drywall, cement board, etc.

Marty

using poly sheeting over kraft faced insulation will cause moisture to get trapped between the two vapor barriers and condensate, causing a mold problem. whenever a wall is constructed (especially in cold climates) its important to have only one moisture barrier. kraft facing on the insulation performs better than poly because it will not trap moisture which will encourage mold growth.

[Don Jarvie]

Instead of trying to build out the wall to match the sheetrock above it may be easier to rip out all of the sheetrock and start new.

Everything will be flat and level and there won't be as much aggravation trying to match. You can save that aggravation for the sill.

[David G Baker]

I agree with ripping out the old Sheetrock and starting with new Sheetrock. Termites and termite damage is critical, fix all the damage and make sure that there is no way for them to get back in to the area. If you have a pro do the termite work they may have to register the damage with the State to insure that any future buyer is aware of the termites.