New small commercial shop design help sought!

[Mike Heidrick]

Not following then on the peek is there for the radiant tube to be high as possible. How will lights on the sides of shop at 14.5-15 not be below a tube in peek at 22?

[peter gagliardi]

Greg, not sure where you got 30k for in floor radiant heating? 3/4" tubing can be had for about $ 0.50 per sq ft, add 2" insulation under it, thats gonna run you about $1.00 sq ft. Boiler about $5k, add another 2k for pumps and manifolds. That might put you around $20k.
The difference between that and overhead radiant can't be too far off, by the time you buy all those units, and pipe to them with gas.

[Martin Wasner]

Mine ended up being $23k for the installed pipe and boiler. I spent a bit less than $7k on 2" foam. His building is a bit larger, but he's likely in the ballpark.

[Gregory Stahl]

The complete heating and air conditioning with 3 overhead radiant heat systems, a conventional furnace for the front, and air conditioning for the front, with all gas lines run is about $21k.

The bids I received for in-floor radiant were significantly higher.

At this point, to put in-floor radiant in, I would have to pay an engineer to design it, and then submit to state for approval. I am very satisfied with overhead radiant. It heats very fast and I can leave portions of the building cool--45-50-degrees when not using them.

I'll think about it further, but most likely am not going to change.

Can you drive a laser screed machine over the tubes and insulation? If not, this will probably add $6-$8k to the concrete work. Concrete guys are going to pour my entire shop floor in under 4-hours.

[Martin Wasner]

Yes, you can drive a laser screed over it. Or at least I have seen it done.

You could easily do zones to keep a room cooler.

Might want to bite the bullet and do the cheap part and put the pipe in the floor anyways? Just for future use?

I hate those tube heaters. I've worked in three shops that had it, not a fan.

[Mike Heidrick]

Blueridgecompany polebarn kit will get you setup with pex, manifold, ties, etc in a packahe and a layout of how to best run the loops. Just tell them the building size, where you want the manifold, and the zones. Tie the pex right to your rebar or mesh in the layout they provide. I had meshup mesh risers and my pex is in the middle of my 5" slab exactly.

[Martin Wasner]

I had meshup mesh risers and my pex is in the middle of my 5" slab exactly.

It gets stapled to the foam here. I'd be squeamish setting anchors with 2" of room.

[Gregory Stahl]

Blueridgecompany polebarn kit will get you setup with pex, manifold, ties, etc in a packahe and a layout of how to best run the loops. Just tell them the building size, where you want the manifold, and the zones. Tie the pex right to your rebar or mesh in the layout they provide. I had meshup mesh risers and my pex is in the middle of my 5" slab exactly.

I believe this is considered plumbing in Wisconsin and therefore I am not able to do any of it DIY. Commercial work was restricted for several years, and now new residential construction is restricted to being done under the guidance of a licensed master plumber.

Anyway--I did get a quote a year ago from Radiantec. They wanted about $19k for materials.

[Gregory Stahl]

I'll have to think more about.

I love my tube heaters! I use them to cure finishes faster!

Yes, you can drive a laser screed over it. Or at least I have seen it done.

You could easily do zones to keep a room cooler.

Might want to bite the bullet and do the cheap part and put the pipe in the floor anyways? Just for future use?

I hate those tube heaters. I've worked in three shops that had it, not a fan.

[peter gagliardi]

Massachusetts is pretty strict with plumbing here as well, but... when running tubing- tying it to mesh, there is technically no plumbing. You run your 300' or so loops, and leave them stubbed up in the manifold area, then when done, your plumber makes the connections- the actual "plumbing" part of the job.
I did all my own tubing. Trust me, you dont need skilled people for this. Farmtek has the tube for around $0.50 LF. Like Martin said, you can zone this. I have 4 thermostats in various areas. My wood storage is set to 52, my machining area 62, my bench and assembly area 62, and my finishing area i run at around 72-74 depending how much the exhaust fan is going to run.
I fully understand if you have already crossed that bridge in your mind.
And like Martin said, if you can tie down the piping beforehand, even if you dont use, you have the option.

[Martin Wasner]

You mentioned steel instead of shingles. Being that you're 2' OC with the trusses, I'm assuming it will be sheeted? Something to consider is that you might have to do ice and water up the entire roof if it is sheeted with steel over the top. That is the way it is done around here anyways.

I can't tell from your picture if it is partially sheeted or not. But if it just has bracing on it, you could just do purlins and screw the steel to that.

I agree with Peter that standing seam is better, but his five year estimate on the washers faulting is over zealous.

[peter gagliardi]

Martin, I only know because we built my brother's house five years ago, he used screw down roofing, and it is leaking. When I started asking around some of the roofing outfits, they all agreed trouble starts about 5 years in.

[Gregory Stahl]

You mentioned steel instead of shingles. Being that you're 2' OC with the trusses, I'm assuming it will be sheeted? Something to consider is that you might have to do ice and water up the entire roof if it is sheeted with steel over the top. That is the way it is done around here anyways.

I can't tell from your picture if it is partially sheeted or not. But if it just has bracing on it, you could just do purlins and screw the steel to that.

I agree with Peter that standing seam is better, but his five year estimate on the washers faulting is over zealous.

No sheeting on yet. Standing seam is nice, but adds cost and labor. If you screw down on the ribs, I think the water leaking potential should be significantly reduced. I think a lot of metal roofs have screws over tightened--can't resist the urge to make it tight.

Another tough decision to make in the next week! I have metal roof samples coming--but have already paid for all the shingle material, though I can get a refund and have not taken delivery. The 12" of snow falling this weekend might make the decision for me.

[Gregory Stahl]

You mentioned steel instead of shingles. Being that you're 2' OC with the trusses, I'm assuming it will be sheeted? Something to consider is that you might have to do ice and water up the entire roof if it is sheeted with steel over the top. That is the way it is done around here anyways.

I don't think I will have to--the roof pitch is 6/12. Architect and engineer did not call for anything other than 15lb felt after perimeter ice and dam material. I bought synthetic underlayment though.

[Martin Wasner]

I don't think I will have to--the roof pitch is 6/12. Architect and engineer did not call for anything other than 15lb felt after perimeter ice and dam material. I bought synthetic underlayment though.

That was for shingles though. I was helping one of my contractors frame a house with standing seam and he had to do ice and water on a 10/12 here with standing seam. I'd still ask about it. There might have been circumstances with that house that I'm unaware of too.