Cant get a square cut on my TS

[Ben Rafael]

Please help me from balding. I'm pulling my hair out on this one.
My cuts are way out of square, at least a 1/16th over 6".
This is what I've done to try and figure it out:
The blade is parallel to the miter slot.
The blade is 90 to the table.
I have a miter gauge and an Incra5000 miter sled. Both fences are 90 to the blade. I cannot get a square cut with either. They both produce cuts with the same error.
I have a starett and incra square that I have used to set up the saw. They both check out at 90.
I am hoping I am missing something obvious.
Thanks for any help!

[glenn bradley]

I use this method Ben. Never fails.
http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/five_cut_method_swf.htm

[Ben Rafael]

I use that method too. It is what is showing me I have a problem.
I cant figure out where the problem is though.

[Brad Patch]

Please help me from balding. I'm pulling my hair out on this one.
My cuts are way out of square, at least a 1/16th over 6".
This is what I've done to try and figure it out:
The blade is parallel to the miter slot.
The blade is 90 to the table.
I have a miter gauge and an Incra5000 miter sled. Both fences are 90 to the blade. I cannot get a square cut with either. They both produce cuts with the same error.
I have a starett and incra square that I have used to set up the saw. They both check out at 90.
I am hoping I am missing something obvious.
Thanks for any help!

Sounds like you have the saw set up properly. Does you stock have a straight jointed edge? When did this problem develop? Try another blade.

[Chris Parks]

Please help me from balding. I'm pulling my hair out on this one.
My cuts are way out of square, at least a 1/16th over 6".
This is what I've done to try and figure it out:
The blade is parallel to the miter slot.
The blade is 90 to the table.
I have a miter gauge and an Incra5000 miter sled. Both fences are 90 to the blade. I cannot get a square cut with either. They both produce cuts with the same error.
I have a starett and incra square that I have used to set up the saw. They both check out at 90.
I am hoping I am missing something obvious.
Thanks for any help!

Sounds like the actual table is not square square to the blade. The mitre track must be parrallel otherwise the gauge that is running in it will move relative to the blade but still be square. Think about it, if the track is not parallel the distance from the blade to the gauge will vary as it is moved along the table.

[Ben Rafael]

The mitre track is parallel to the blade.
I will try another blade.

[Chip Lindley]

TS alignment is well covered here. Use the tried 'n' true methods.

Another question might be: *IS your wood creeping along the face of the miter gauge as you cut it?* The MG is slippery, and has a relatively small area to reference the stock. A miter SLED would be much better if you use your TS for very much crosscutting at any angle!

Otherwise, sandpaper backing on the miter jig face helps in holding stock securely to avoid movement. The blade does exert a push *away* from itself in the cutting action. Hold or clamp the stock securely when crosscutting.

[Joe Scharle]

Make sure the arbor collar is clean too, and re-check the 'new' blade.

[chris dub]

I thought I had the same issue until I realized my test piece wasn't really parallel. After I cut the piece I wasn't paying attention and flipped the side a couple of times. to check for square. Then I re-ripped the piece to get it dead parallel and tested it again. It was square on both sides. Not my proudest moment.

[M. A. Espinoza]

TS alignment is well covered here. Use the tried 'n' true methods.

Another question might be: *IS your wood creeping along the face of the miter gauge as you cut it?* The MG is slippery, and has a relatively small area to reference the stock. A miter SLED would be much better if you use your TS for very much crosscutting at any angle!

Otherwise, sandpaper backing on the miter jig face helps in holding stock securely to avoid movement. The blade does exert a push *away* from itself in the cutting action. Hold or clamp the stock securely when crosscutting.

+1 on the creep. Use some stickback sandpaper as advised and see what results you get.

If it still is not square check your blade for wobble and the blade washer to make sure its flat.

Might be a good idea to double check for play in your sled to miter slot.

Thats all I got, good luck.

[Ben Rafael]

I tried the sandpaper on the fence, I changed the blade, I cleaned up the arbor collar. Still the same amount of error.
My solution makes no sense:
I increased the angle between the fence and the blade by a small amount, it is now just a bit greater than 90*, but all my cuts are now square. This apparently compensates for whatever was causing the error. I dont know why it works, but it does.
Thanks for everybody's help and advice.

[Eric Gustafson]

I tried the sandpaper on the fence, I changed the blade, I cleaned up the arbor collar. Still the same amount of error.
My solution makes no sense:
I increased the angle between the fence and the blade by a small amount, it is now just a bit greater than 90*, but all my cuts are now square. This apparently compensates for whatever was causing the error. I dont know why it works, but it does.
Thanks for everybody's help and advice.

What saw are you using? Not that it should matter. Is there any play in the arbor? Can you wiggle the blade perpendicular to the miter slot?

I have the Incra 5000 and that thing is dead on. The way you calibrate it is after you cut the sled in the saw, you align the miter fence to that same cut line with your good square. Since that cut line is the same cut line you get when you cut anything, there is no way you will not cut the same unless something else is moving. Either the blade (arbor defective), the INCRA miter slot guide (should be adjusted for no slop), or the miter fence, but if you have that fence ancored with the angle stock they supply, that won't move.

[Chris Padilla]

Ben,

Not to continue beating this dead horse but you need to (or, rather, should) figure out what the real problem is coming from.

Can you tell us your methods for ensuring parallelism between your miter slot(s), blade, and fence?

[Ben Rafael]

Ben,

Not to continue beating this dead horse but you need to (or, rather, should) figure out what the real problem is coming from.

Can you tell us your methods for ensuring parallelism between your miter slot(s), blade, and fence?

I agree with you. I need to find the basic problem.
To square things up I used my starrett combo square. I thought it might have a problem, so then I use my Incra square and it indicated that my squaring with the starrett was correct.
Since the problem is consistent with either my sled or miter gauge and with 2 different blades, I am assuming(maybe incorrectly) the problem is somewhere within the arbor. I checked for runout and it is almost nil.
My only thought is that when the saw is running that a problem in the arbor is causing this, a problem that is not apparent when the saw if powered off.

[Dick Brown]

Had a saw one time that was given to me because it did about the same thing. Tipped it over so I could get a good look at things and found the plate that keeps the bearings tight in the housing was loose and let the arbor shift when under a load. Might take a look at that or if the arbor itself is working around in the bearings.
Dick