Help Date Bailey 5 1/4

[James White]

I purchased a 5 1/4 from a neighbor today and am having trouble dating it. There is no date stamped anywhere. The Bailey name is in front of the knob. The Made in USA is behind the knob. The plane # is behind the tote. It has the raised ring for the knob. There are no other markings on the bed casting. The frog receiver has an I shape and has a rib down the center to the mouth. The frog has a 3 and U stamped into it. The adjustment lever says Stanley and two piece. The adjustment knob has parallel knurls. Black japanning and clear or stain finish on the tote and knob.

I was using this site http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/sta..._plane/dating/ to try and date it but it just does not seem to fit the flow chart. Are there other sites to help date the planes?

James

[Dave Matson]

http://home.comcast.net/~rexmill/pla...ing/typing.htm

complete with puurty pictures

[Jim Koepke]

James,

We have just recently started a new thread, Neanderthal Wisdom, near the top of the list in Neanderthal haven.

Here is the link to the thread:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=103805

Scrolling down a bit you will find - 5. Tool Talk which has a link to - Everything Hand Planes.

There are links there that will help.

The 5-1/4 did not come into official production until the 1920s. Finding one in good shape can be a challenge since they were mostly used in high school shop classes. Most examples look like the kids were using them for hammers or wheel chocks on their hot rods.

Your plane is likely a type 15, 1931-1932 or later. There are a few more pieces of information needed. The 1930s is when the ring was cast in to the base around the front knob. It is also when "Made in U.S.A." was cast into the body.

The shape of the cutout in the lever cap (key hole or kidney?), raised part of casting at the toe and heel of body if the frog has straight or ogee shaped sides at the top.

The link(s) in the thread linked to above will help you determine what you have.

I also added a type study chart that is helpful at the end of the thread.

If you can post pictures when you make the determination, post them here. It seems all of us Creekers love to look at pictures.

I know that is why I still read the comics.

jim

[Mike Cutler]

If you can post pictures when you make the determination, post them here. It seems all of us Creekers love to look at pictures.

I know that is why I still read the comics.

jim

,,,,,

Thank you Jim. That made my morning

[James White]

Photo as requested. Looks like it is a hybrid between an 15 and 16. Newer style frog and lever cap. But has the older bed with made in the USA behind the knob and no raised ribs and the heal and toe.

The chip breaker and thumb screw are missing. Were would be a good place to get these parts? Is this considered to be a good jack plane? Would I be better off with a regular #5. I would actually prefer a #4 smother or a #7 as I am mostly a corded tool user.

James

[Justin Green]

I dunno about planes, but I suspect it's similar to dating guitars and amplifiers. A manufacturer sets up to make a product using certain parts and produces hundreds or thousands of the parts for assembly. Then a design change comes along but the company doesn't simply throw away the leftover parts from the previous model. They may continue to use them until they're gone, resulting in a product that has features of multiple years' models. Could be the case here.

Another cause for mixed parts would be post-sale, where something breaks or is lost and the user replaces the broken or lost parts with compatible parts from a different model.

Makes dating difficult, but generally you can narrow it down to within a couple of production runs, at least with guitars & amps.

[Jim Koepke]

Photo as requested. Looks like it is a hybrid between an 15 and 16. Newer style frog and lever cap. But has the older bed with made in the USA behind the knob and no raised ribs and the heal and toe.

The chip breaker and thumb screw are missing. Were would be a good place to get these parts? Is this considered to be a good jack plane? Would I be better off with a regular #5. I would actually prefer a #4 smother or a #7 as I am mostly a corded tool user.

James

Stanley did not know there were going to be type studies. Like Justin said, the parts could have been old stock in production or mixed after market.

The parts you are looking for are the same as used on a #3 plane. They are often for sale on eBay. There is a link to Brass City Records in one of the posts I linked to earlier. I have never done business with them, except maybe once buying an old vinyl recording years ago, but others speak of them highly. He may have the parts you need.

The 5-1/4 is often considered a junior jack because of its smaller size. If there are no cracks at the corner of the mouth and it is comfortable to use, it is a fine plane. Since you have power tools, you likely don't need to convert it to a scrub plane. It would be good for edge joining. If you like the reduced size, for a smoother, you might consider a #3. Comparing the size of a #3 to a #4 is like the comparison of size between a #5-1/4 to a #5.

My preference lately has been to a bigger plane. The 5-1/2 has a bigger handle and more room for my fat hands. Same with the 4-1/2. Also for me, the older planes seem a bit better made. From about 1910-1930 they seemed to have the technique of making planes down solid and had not yet started on the march to cut costs. Just my opinion.

jim