Festool saw guide?

[Jamie Buxton]

The paeans for Festool's guide and saw system in Charles Mckinley's thread make me wonder. I use the shop-built guide and saw system pictured below. The guide is two pieces of plywood glued together. The right side of the guide is exactly where the saw blade is going to cut. The saw rides on top of the right side of the guide, with the left edge of the saw's foot guided by the edge in the middle of the guide. Simple spring clamps hold the guide to the sheet goods.

So, Festool fans, can you give me good reason to abandon this system in favor of a Festool guide and saw?

[Jim Becker]

1) The Festool guide works without being clamped
2) The Festool guide has a renewable "zero" clearance edge that insures the good side of the cut has no tearout
3) The Festool plunge saw is engineered to work with very close tolerances with the guide system
4) The Festool plunge saw leaves a cut that rivals most table saws and when used with the vac, almost no dust...which means you can use it inside someone's home without trashing it completely!
5) The same guide system will work with the Festool jigsaw and router, should you take the pill and submit to assimilation
6) Bob Marino is a really nice fellow to do business with...

[JayStPeter]

I think Jim mentioned it all. Your setup looks real similar to my old one. The Festool makes the cleanest cuts in plywood that I've seen. It also makes them nearly dust free (even MDF). The only time I've seen dust coming off the saw is when shaving an edge (where the blade wasn't buried in the cut).

Jay

[Todd Burch]

Jamie, I've used your system for several years, and still do. It's a quick setup. I'll echo Herr Becker's comments, and add to them:

7) Festool's setup does not allow you to veer off like your (my other) system will - it's riding in a track and does not require lateral pressure on the operator's part to keep it in line.
8) If you do want to clamp the Festool rail, and I always do, the clamps don't get in your way like the spring clamps do (or like a c-clamp will). I find myself having to negotiate the proper blade depth to a) get through my material, b) not get into my work surface and c) still have the motor housing clear the clamp. (Tip: On my zero-board that I use, I spray-adhesive'd some sandpaper to the back of it so that I could avoid clamps on "easy" cuts.)

Todd

[Christian Aufreiter]

I think Jim and Todd explained the advantages of the Festool system very well.
I'd like to add that the Festool saw (which is an integral part of the Festool system) is another important argument for using the Festool rails:
- excellent dust collection with every cut.
- adjustable speed for cutting plastics, aluminum, etc.
- plunge cuts
- electronic speed control to maintain speed.
- riving knife.
....

Festool doesn't only offer guide rails for a circular saw, they offer an incorporated system consisting of jigs saws, plunge saws, routers, rails and accessories.

Todd Burch wrote:
7) Festool's setup does not allow you to veer off like your (my other) system will - it's riding in a track and does not require lateral pressure on the operator's part to keep it in line.

It's really important to notice the difference between a shopmade rail (which certainly works ok) and the guidance of the Festool rails.

Regards,

Christian

[Tyler Howell]

Stop, Stop, I'm sold already, Bob take My money! New pool and boat this year. Another Great debate. Why didn't I know about this place when I was rich Oh yah I've never been rich.

Thanks Great Info.

[Dan Mages]

Stop, Stop, I'm sold already, Bob take My money! New pool and boat this year. Another Great debate. Why didn't I know about this place when I was rich Oh yah I've never been rich.

Thanks Great Info.

Tyler, that is known as the Great Festool Arm Twisting Dance!! You better give in now, or they will put you in a full body cast!!

Dan

[Tyler Howell]

Thanks Dan,

Putting together the wish list now. Also checking the mattress and under couch cushions for extra cash.
I've always been sold, it's been a matter of getting my priorities straight.

[Mark Singer]

I have the Festool Saw and rail system and have used other circular saws for years with Tru Grip and other straight edges. The biggest difference is the final cut...the staight line and clean surface allows for edge banding or trimming directly without other operations...on plannig or jointing and the plywood veneer is perfect. Thanks Bob Marino!

[Chris Padilla]

Let's not forget Sir Dino's competitive EZ guide system!! I have it but it is still in its box since I have, uh, other things going on in my garage right now. I picked mine up in one of the auctions he ran a few weeks back so I got a killer deal on it but we all know Festool makes some dynamite, albeit expensive, equipment!

BTW, one of the labels on my systainer for the 150/5 ROS came off!!!! What's up wid dat???

[russ bransford]

Jamie, keep the saw you have in the picture and put it with a Eurekazone Smart Guide System and you'll have a better cut for less money. You'll have the zero clearance edge, the track to guide the saw, no tearout even on the drop-off piece(except with the smart guide there is no bad edge to drop off, both sides of the cut are good pieces, you haven't messed up part of your panel), and 50" sections that connect to go 100-150-200 whatever.

[Charles McKinley]

Hi Jamie,

The next guide like yours I make I will leave more material on the edge away from the blade so the clamp doesn't interfere with the saw. This system works ok I'm just looking for a little more accuracy and the dust collection on the festool is a big plus in my mind. The sliding table would give me repeatability.

[russ bransford]

Chris, take it out of the box. You have no idea of what all you can do with what you now have.

Russ

[Chris Padilla]

Jamie,

I was thinking...if you want to make a trip to San Jose, you are more than welcome to borrow my Eurekazone Guide System and I even have a Zero-Clearance SmartGuide that you can have for free!

You have my email...lemme know....

----->Chris

[Jamie Buxton]

Thank you all for your advice. I'm not sure the advantages add up to $600 yet for me, but I am a pinch-penny.

As I think this through, let me "think out loud" by listing the arguments for the Festool and adding the counterarguments for the low-bucks solution...

1) The Festool guide works without being clamped
Advantage to Festool. I use clamps on the low-bucks solution all the time. (But I wonder how Festool does that?)
2) The Festool guide has a renewable "zero" clearance edge that insures the good side of the cut has no tearout
So does the low-bucks solution: make a new guide. It takes perhaps 20 minutes.
3) The Festool plunge saw is engineered to work with very close tolerances with the guide system
I don't know what the tolerances of the low-bucks approach are. I've never noticed a problem big enough that I've paid any attention.
4) The Festool plunge saw leaves a cut that rivals most table saws and when used with the vac, almost no dust...which means you can use it inside someone's home without trashing it completely!
My current generation of guide+saw leaves a cut which is indistinguishable from my Unisaw. My previous generation wasn't as good. The circular saw in that one had end-play on the blade. The saw eventually got stolen, and in shopping for its replacement I looked for a saw without end-play. I also was prepared to tune the saw shoe so that the left edge is parallel to the blade, but was pleasantly surprised to find that this PC was good right out of the box.
The dust collection on the Porter-Cable works pretty well, but I don't use it much. I've never needed to cut plywood panels in somebody's home -- it's shop work for me.
5) The same guide system will work with the Festool jigsaw and router, should you take the pill and submit to assimilation
Aieee, my Scottish genes are wincing already!
6) Bob Marino is a really nice fellow to do business with...
Good suppliers are to be treasured.
7) Festool's setup does not allow you to veer off like your (my other) system will - it's riding in a track and does not require lateral pressure on the operator's part to keep it in line.
Advantage Festool. Back when I was learning to use the low-bucks version, I'd occasionally make that mistake. I've learned, and don't do that now. It helps to use a sharp blade.
8) If you do want to clamp the Festool rail, and I always do,
hmm, conflicting user experience between Jim and Todd?
the clamps don't get in your way like the spring clamps do (or like a c-clamp will).
My guide is wide enough that the spring clamps can get completely clear of the motor. I use spring clamps because they are fast, and because they are low profile. Low profile does help when I'm cutting near the edge of the plywood sheet and I need to pull the clamps in closer.
I find myself having to negotiate the proper blade depth to a) get through my material, b) not get into my work surface and c) still have the motor housing clear the clamp.
My low-bucks guide uses 1/8 ply for the bottom sheet. That helps the negotiation a little. I can keep the saw body high to clear the clamp while still having enough depth to cut through the plywood.
Let's not forget Sir Dino's competitive EZ guide system!!
Oh boy, another variable to consider!