Bosch goes down the tubes

[Steve Nouis]

Just got a Bosch 4 x 24 belt sander made in China, if I want made in China tools I'll buy ones that I know are made in China. No such thing as intergerity any more. just greed. Steve

[Blake Barr]

Umm maybe the Chinese where able to satisfy Bosch's QC? They aren't all necessarily neanderthals...

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Steve,

Foreign made stuff ..yes even Chinese made stuff...can be of varying quality. It just depends on what the manufacturer is willing to pay .....

[Burt Waddell]

Just got a Bosch 4 x 24 belt sander made in China, if I want made in China tools I'll buy ones that I know are made in China. No such thing as intergerity any more. just greed. Steve

Steve,

We'll never learn to like it but you had may as well accept it.

About 3 years ago, I bought a new Makita planer and was rather angry when I discovered that it was made in China. I decided to check the Makita planer that I was replacing and see where it was made. (I run a small commerical operation and use a Makita planer about 3 years and replace it - works out to be no maintenance). When I checked the older planer, I found that it was also made in China!!

At this stage of the game, China is capable of making a very good product. It all depends on what the company ordering the product gives the people in China for quality standards.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not fond of things made in china but we need to recognize their abilities.


Burt

[Mike OMelia]

One day, Made in China will be synonomous with Made in Japan. Made in USA? What?

[Dave Garcia]

Steve,

Understand your frustration. And, as has already been said, we can either accept it or............. Am still trying to figure out what the "or" part is.

I think all of us remember when "Made in Japan" was the kiss of death with regards to tools. Now the #1 best selling car all over the world is Toyota, the once proud GM trade mark stands for Government Motors, and I'd bet my next pay check (non government stimulus one) that most of us in this forum have at least one Japanese power tool in our shop. Makita comes to mind.

The bottom line is that there are some very fine tools made all over the world. The key is to find one that fits your needs and your budget. My shop looks like an international shop when it comes to hand tools and floor mounted machines. My latest purchase is a LaserPro C180 made in Taiwan using mostly American made parts. But before purchasing this unit I did a LOT of research as to quality, replacement parts availability, safety, and service. What I found satisfied all of those requirements.

Such is the way of the "world market" these days. But, let it be said, that I buy American when I can find it. If it comes down to an "equal" choice then I'll go with the American made product every time. But, as you've painfully found out, that doesn't happen very much anymore.

It ain't our Daddies Sears and Roebuck anymore! Now there's a very profound statement if I've ever heard one! I guess we all have to look in the mirror for the reasons for that.

Dave Garcia
The Wood Block, Ltd

[Andy Bardowell]

............. No I won't say a word.

Steve don't get me started or Ken will boot me off the Creek!

[Matt Sollars]

And on the flip side of the coin....(I'm sure this won't go over well.....)

I've purchased several, very poor, ''Made in USA'' products as well.

There are companies that make great products all over the world. The reverse of such is true as well.

Matt

[Ken Fitzgerald]

............. No I won't say a word.

Steve don't get me started or Ken will boot me off the Creek!

Ken isn't racked and stacked with enough horsepower to get you booted off the Creek........

[Brian Ashton]

It should be a lively thread when some of our favorite hand tool makers start having some of their parts made in china... You can bet it's been talked about around the boardroom tables. I would say it's also a case of when it happens no if it happens.

[David Keller NC]

Well, I wouldn't blame a company for responding to "the new consumerism" which is "cheap above all else". Much of the woodworking community could have fingers pointed at them in this respect - the SMC General WW forums have a good deal of threads devoted to "what's the cheapest price I can pay for XXXX tool", and the Neander forum has a good number of posts bemoaning the "high" price that Lee Valley and Lie-Nielsen charges for their tools.

In fact, I regularly read something to the effect of "I can't afford a LV XXXX plane". No one posts their financials (and that's a good thing), but it is very highly unlikely that 99% of the posters really can't afford a LV or LN plane, they just don't want to afford one, and there's a distinction.

Were it not for this kind of pricing pressure, there would be no WoodRiver planes made in China, for example. There are some of us that will pay extra for high-quality tools, but that's an increasingly small percentage.

[Jason Beam]

If it were so important to you, wouldn't you ... i dunno ... CHECK first?

Take it back ... get your money back.

I wonder how many of the complainers actually DO take the item back and pay the extra price for their domestic items. Or ... do they just complain?

Do something about it. Don't just gripe and expect it to change. Use your wallet. If you just whine and keep the tool, you're just as bad as all the other sheep who shop on price alone.

For the record: I really don't care where it's made. If it's a quality item, I'll pay for it. Price is only a main concern if the quality of an item I'm buying isn't as big an issue. Otherwise, it's below quality, support and customer service.

[Art Bianconi]

Like it or not, the world is smaller than ever before and the isolationist - protectionism mentality will no longer work, if for no other reason than we need their oil and we need to sell our products to developing nations like China.

The trick is to not do what GM and Chrysler did: ignore obvious market trends.

The most vital of them was the persistent loss of market share to products that gave people what they wanted and were made elsewhere for less money. How can anyone expect to beat that formula with stagnant designs from the Jurassic era?! The volume of sales of off-shore made products got to the point where those foreigners built plants here and now employ hundreds of thousands of Americans!

The trick is buy on the basis of perceived quality vs cost of acquisition, regardless of where it's made. With choices made in that fashion, junk disappears for lack of interest.

One friend who is a respected name in the fashion industry said it best: "You are better off buying the least expensive item in a quality store than the most expensive item in K-Mart" (or Harbour Freight).

I agree.

I just purchased a dual miter cut-ff saw from Bosch and it's well made, I haven't a clue where it was manufactured and, frankly, I don't care.

Art

[Mike Henderson]

Well, I wouldn't blame a company for responding to "the new consumerism" which is "cheap above all else". Much of the woodworking community could have fingers pointed at them in this respect - the SMC General WW forums have a good deal of threads devoted to "what's the cheapest price I can pay for XXXX tool", and the Neander forum has a good number of posts bemoaning the "high" price that Lee Valley and Lie-Nielsen charges for their tools.

In fact, I regularly read something to the effect of "I can't afford a LV XXXX plane". No one posts their financials (and that's a good thing), but it is very highly unlikely that 99% of the posters really can't afford a LV or LN plane, they just don't want to afford one, and there's a distinction.

Were it not for this kind of pricing pressure, there would be no WoodRiver planes made in China, for example. There are some of us that will pay extra for high-quality tools, but that's an increasingly small percentage.

Our whole economic system is based on productivity - being able to make and/or sell something that meets the customer's needs at a lower price.

It doesn't make sense to pay more for something if another thing will meet your needs at a lower price. Woodworkers are rational buyers - they are no different than any other consumer.

Mike

[Frank Hagan]

Hey, if we quit buying their products, they'll quit buying our Treasuries. And then we'll all be broke because interest rates will be back up above 20%.