Sawstop Salesman Trashed Grizzly G0661 and Jet Pro Shop

[Bill Wyko]

IMHO if these issues were real, we would have had someone here bring up a post. I've always felt the best way to sell is to focus on your strengths, not someone else's weaknesses. In this case I find it hard to believe the problems even exist. The sawstop speaks for itself. Him doing that makes it a whisper.

[Barry Vabeach]

Ed, first, I met someone from Germany who was a salesman of a product, when I asked his background. he said he was an engineer. I told him that in the US, generally a salesman is a a sales person, and they usually don't have any background in how the products are designed. He said it always thought that it was odd that salesman don't have a long background in the product itself and can go from selling cars one day to selling refrigerators another day. He said that when his company first decided to sell in the US they considered the US method, but decided to make sure that they have engineers in the sales dept.
Going back to you first question, you may want to call SS because I thought I heard they were going to be releasing a hybrid soon ( though that could be many months away) To me the contrator version didn't have much bang for the buck, but the PCS version was much better in that regard. It is possible that the hybrid has a similar value. FWIW, I have a Grizzly bandsaw and it is very well made, so I don't know where that salesman was coming from but agree that I don't like it when someone trashes the competition.

[Cody Colston]

Oh wait, I get it, the car dealership he used to work at must've closed.

Yeah. They got cash for all those clunkers!

[Paul Ryan]

I am a very pleased SS owner. However over 2K for a contractor saw is too much for me. Some say that about SS cabinet saws but I felt the extra $$ over the other alternatives to be more worth it. If it makes any difference to you the arbor bearings in all of SS machines are all the same. 62MM so you get industrial saw bearings in a contractor saw. Of the 3 saws you talked about I feel the jet to be your best bank for your buck. It has been tested over and over again as a hybrid saw and has been a top choice consistantly. The dust collection on the jet will be better, the footprint smaller, and has a very good fence. The reason the dust collection will be better is becasue the cabinet for the jet even though on 4 legs it is still enclosed. The SS will basically cost double what either of the other two saws will run. But is it twice as good? Construction wise it will be better than the other 2 saws and the upgraded fence will be better as well. Then you add the blade brake technology, maybe it isn't so bad?

As everyone else has said the salesman was blowing smoke up your south end. But if you compare the tricked out SS with the cast wings, and bies fence it will run over 2k. If you don't think you will EVER buy a cabinet saw, then buy the best and safest contractor saw you can.

[Vic Damone]

The funny thing is that both the G0661 and the Sawstop are made by the same company!

You have a name and address for this fella? We would like to educate him about the birds and the bees.

Are you inferring that all or most of the the materials and components are the same and even interchangeable in both your Grizzly and the SawStop simply because there made by the same manufacturer?

As a company owner you would actually get involved with a competitive salesperson using a second hand account of a verbal he said she said?

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Are you inferring that all or most of the the materials and components are the same and even interchangeable in both your Grizzly and the SawStop simply because there made by the same manufacturer?

As a company owner you would actually get involved with a competitive salesperson using a second hand account of a verbal he said she said?

Vic,

I suspect he is arguing that the chances of there being a mechanical misalignment causing premature bearing failures as stated are less since they are both manufactured in the same plant.

[george wilson]

It is possible for machinery of differing quality to be made in the same factory,if they are made with different specifications which had to be followed. This does not infer that any parts are the same as far as I can see. I thought that the Sawstop I bought for my job was very deluxe compared to other saws I have seen.

I know some different brands of wood chisels are made in the same factory.Different models and price range cars at least used to be made in the same factory.I know Dodge and Plymouth were at one time.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

George,

The original statement said that there was unusual bearing wear due to a mechanical misalignment. The odds of that happening are less when they are both made in the same factory.

Yes, each product has to have it's own manufacturing specifications. I would bet standard manufacturing specifications would spell out the amount of mechanical misalignments that would be acceptable.

I have a problem with sales people who can't find good enough reason to sell their product on it's own merits but instead have to run down the competition. To me that tells me the sales person isn't comfortable that their product can stand on it's own merits.

[george wilson]

I agree with you on all points,Ken. I was addressing the question Vic raised about the saws possibly being made of the same parts.

[peter leyden]

This does not relate to tools at all - but definitely resonates with the issue of salesmen speaking truth or blarney. Years ago I met the then famous inventor of speaker systems and during the ensuing conversation I mentioned a problem I was having with a competitors product. Instead of taking the low road and knocking the competitors product he recommended giving customer service of his competitor a chance to solve my problem. I was impressed! The products are not the same but the integrity of the gentleman has stayed with me since that time. Examples that were just the opposite(as in the Sawstop salesman) have also lingered in my mind and just serve to point up the "class" exhibited by the inventor.

[Roger Jensen]

Before jumping on SawStop for unethical sales tactics let's review what it means to be a salesman (or salesperson) for a company these days. The OP didn't say where this happened, but the companies I have seen selling SS these days are selling many other products and don't have that much knowledge about any of them. Even if they have 2 or 3 dedicated folks that really understand SS, the OP could have encountered a part-time guy with no training or authority to say what he did.

I encounter ignorant sales people all the time, whether it is appliance salesreps that don't understand their products or tool retailers that sell far too many brands to become experts in all of them. I believe that retail stores today operates on such razor thin margins they can't invest the necessary resources to train all of their salespeople about their own products, let alone the competitor's product.

The OP may have encountered a sleazy salesman. Or, the salesperson was told this by a frustrated Grizzly customer (there is probably one out there) that he had a bad experience and passed this on to him. I doubt all Grizzly products have these problems, and I doubt all SS salesreps lie to their customers.

Roger

[Bill White]

There is also a huge misuse of the words "infer" and "imply".
Bill

[scott spencer]

A dissenting opinion of competitor's product is expected from sales people, but trashing a competitor is disappointing.

Both the Proshop and the Grizzly you mentioned are nicely evolved examples of hybrid style home duty saws. Both have very nice fences, good trunnion design, and excellent motor location. Something about people in glass houses comes to mind. While the SS may have a great safety feature and some other positives, the choice of an outboard motor location was short sighted at best, steel wings are common for $500 saws, and the entry level fence they offer is horrible.

[Ed Garrett]

Scott,

Thanks for the comment. You took the words out of my mouth.

I was a bit disappointed with the SS Contractor, not because it didn't appear well made, but because the outboard motor design seemed obsolete. I was intending to buy a lightweight Sawstop, but I was also looking for less footprint and a more enclosed cabinet. I like the safety feature and the riving knife, but the basic configuration of the saw is no better than my ancient Craftsman flexdrive which I've made some great mods to including a quick release guard and a sealed up cabinet with DC. I'm now thinking that even if SS makes a hybrid, it will be a little too heavy for my needs.

I can feel myself turning toward the Grizzly or Jet. I will be particularly interested if Grizzly closes up the cabinet a little more on the G0661 or Jet updates the Pro Shop to include a blade shroud and a quick release riving knife.

P.S. to anybody who's been following this post. I started a PM to Mr. Balolia to identify the salesman who dissed Grizzly, but I chickened out...

Sincerely,
Ed Garrett
Tallahassee

[John Coloccia]

Re: jet and griz
Don't know about the Jet, but the Griz is a nice saw. That's all there is to it

re: the saw stop
I have the contractor saw, with stainless wings and the small extension table. The thing is built like a brick, and generally "feels" more like a cabinet saw than a contractor saw. It's not a contractor saw by any means, but the fence is solid, and the whole saw is solid. Very nice feel.

re: the salesman
Really poor form. If the best you can do to sell your product is to trash other products, you're a really poor salesman. Don't let it reflect on SS as a company, though. They make a great product and provide fantastic customer service.

Like so many things these days, there's lots of choices in a price range, and generally things are pretty competitive. When you start getting into the more serious saws, I think you'd be hard pressed to find junk. It's more about finding the saw with the right features and feel that meet your specific needs more than it is buying for quality.

I'll also throw in that Grizzly's customer service is just as good as SawStop's on the couple of occasions I've had to use it.