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Thread: New Toy!

  1. #16
    Yes Brian, you can, it just take forever, so you need a clean, flat, non-dusty location for them to dry.

    Rob, the heads also need to be replaced from time to time, and not sure about the model Rodney has, but the people I know with HP's have to spend about $1,200 per head and it has a number of heads. Also, some of them have more than 8 colors, and each batch of color is about $400. Imagine having to spend $3,200 in ink to fill it up!

    We looked at one about a year ago, it was small, 24", but it would do all we needed. The printer itself was about $3,500, and then to fill it with ink, in all the colors, it was over $2,000. The $3,500 printer ended up being about $7,000 to get it and actually have material and ink. You needed a $1,000 RIP program to drive the color as well.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Cape Town, South Africa
    Posts
    3,922
    Rob first : In the "old days of yore" in terms of digital printing , the inks were heavily solvent based to print on the less han optimal substrates , what with light solvent inks and really good media clogging is no longer an issue ..in fact the rolands even when switched off , but plugged in go thru a sort of print head cleaning every so often , this ensures even less problems. They use quality heads ..Epsons. These days only long term maintenance is is what you need (like a laser).
    short term , the only thing you have to do is empty a drain bottle and wipe the head surrounds if ink builds up - print speeds are good ..tho at 1440 x 1440 you can do about 4-6 m2 an hr..but even for real fine detial work , 720 x 720 is more than sufficient.
    A lot of other problems have been ironed out , like banding etc.
    These are extremely versatile machines , we have printed on various papers , all manner of vinyl not just white , material , canvas , one way window film , mesh , flag material, stiff carboard (you can get up to 1mm thick into the machine) rowmark lights , flexibrass , banner , 1mm styrene , polycarb, iron on garmet stuff, holographic foils , reflective and glow in the dark stuff and so on.
    I think your decision not to get into it was wise..

    As to doming , I have a semi industrial line , we dome in a dehumidified room and use a 2 part urethane which cures to various degrees of flexibility (we have various shore hardnesses) to handleble state in 30 mins sans UV and packable states in 3-6 hrs - we have banks of shelves with lights to gently provide a heated environment and use builders plastic as dust curtains.
    I use 2 automated dispensers - google cammda for systems from simple to complex.
    I dont like uv systems cos you cant build high domes and its expensive and oddly enough , most arent uv resistant and yellow.
    At any rate I have a few dispensers , they work off shop air and are somewhat programmeable as to shot size and with 3 of my ladies doming , we can do 10 000 items a day.
    The 2 part urethanes are about $17 per litre and one cc covers a sq inch , so it covers 1000 sq inches , cost about 2c per sq inch vs up to 20x more for other systems.
    The enemy of just about any doming system apart from SOME uvs is water - bone dry environment guarantees success.
    You can now add glitters , pearls and other tints to domes for some subtle to glitzy effects and you can dome heat transfer garmet stuff you can print and cut on the Roland and heat press em to the garment after.
    Occasionally when we want rock hard domes we use 2 part epoxys , but rock hard domes have issues of their own , like going milky , shattering , scratching , delaminating off the substrate , so domes with a bit of give are generally best.
    Rodney Gold, Toker Bros trophies, Cape Town , South Africa :
    Roland 2300 rotary . 3 x ISEL's ..1m x 500mm CnC .
    Tekcel 1200x2400 router , 900 x 600 60w Shenui laser , 1200 x 800 80w Reci tube Shenhui Laser
    6 x longtai lasers 400x600 60w , 1 x longtai 20w fiber
    2x Gravo manual engravers , Roland 540 large format printer/cutter. CLTT setup
    1600mm hot and cold laminator , 3x Dopag resin dispensers , sandblasting setup, acid etcher

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Cape Town, South Africa
    Posts
    3,922
    Scott ,
    Heads failing are rare , we havent replaced many and to ouir surprise our agent took a reading and said that the head hadnt fired a billion dots and had in fact failed at 700 million so he paid in the 30% we had left..they arent cheap , but nowhere near a laser source.
    I think it costs more then $7k for a decent machine , the nice entry level roland sp 300i is about $12k ...comes with a rip tho and ink prices arent too bad either - printable media is cheap these days what with mainland china pumping it out by the containerload..
    Rodney Gold, Toker Bros trophies, Cape Town , South Africa :
    Roland 2300 rotary . 3 x ISEL's ..1m x 500mm CnC .
    Tekcel 1200x2400 router , 900 x 600 60w Shenui laser , 1200 x 800 80w Reci tube Shenhui Laser
    6 x longtai lasers 400x600 60w , 1 x longtai 20w fiber
    2x Gravo manual engravers , Roland 540 large format printer/cutter. CLTT setup
    1600mm hot and cold laminator , 3x Dopag resin dispensers , sandblasting setup, acid etcher

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodne Gold View Post
    I think it costs more then $7k for a decent machine , the nice entry level roland sp 300i is about $12k ...comes with a rip tho and ink prices arent too bad either - printable media is cheap these days what with mainland china pumping it out by the containerload..
    It was a small machine we looked at. 24", and it was an Epson, which was getting good reviews at the time we looked at it.

    If I had to do it now, it wouldn't be less than 54", but I hope to stay away from the ink side as long as I possibly can.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  5. #20

    Doming process

    very simple process, best is to search on youtube, several videos on process. Very cool look

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sacramento, Ca
    Posts
    251
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodne Gold View Post
    Well let me tell you how it involves lasers.
    Prior to use getting a print and cut machine , we did a lot of basic work using the laser to manufacture die cut self adhesive decals and domed decals.
    Heres how it worked , we designed the sticker and the die line (cut line) in corel and stepped and repeated em , we put the cut line on a separate layer and used polyester self adhesive inkjet vinyl in a desktop inkjet printer - media you can get from www.papilio.com
    We then made a jig for the sheet (we always centred the print on the page) and loaded the printed page in the laser and sent just the cut layer to it. We ended up with sheets of extremely intricate shaped decals (the media is laser friendly) which we then applied to items like brass nametags and then domed. Heres some pics of results.
    It was a VERY cheap way to have a print and cut machine , of course the roland is in another class!!
    Our lasers have fine software tuning in either the X and y axes so any mismath tween printer and laser output is easily corrected. At any rate we used to get registration with the printed image of better than .1mm.
    In the first pic the 3m , world of granite primi and motostars thingys were done that way , in the 2nd pic the flag and phadima and the flower and in the 3rd pic the motostars and africa were all done that way
    Hi Rodne

    Do those items you show have clear doming, what product do you use for that and is it.
    Mike

    Helix 75W runnin at 89W, Corel X3, Epilog Summit 25W (alive and kickin), CNC mills, lathes, vinyl cutter, Microflame Generator (flame polisher), and all kind of other stuff to keep things interesting

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sacramento, Ca
    Posts
    251
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Christen View Post
    Hi Rodne

    Do those items you show have clear doming, what product do you use for that and is it.
    Sorry Rodne, i must learn to read all posts and all words I think im losing it
    Last edited by Mike Christen; 10-07-2009 at 10:53 PM.
    Mike

    Helix 75W runnin at 89W, Corel X3, Epilog Summit 25W (alive and kickin), CNC mills, lathes, vinyl cutter, Microflame Generator (flame polisher), and all kind of other stuff to keep things interesting

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