Help me fight my mother-in-law's HOA...

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Don't know anything about HOA's never had to deal with them, seems if local zoning is ok with the Chickens local HOA can't really do a lot about them.

What I find strange is the ad at the botom of the page on how to build a chicken coup for $98

Actually HOA can have a great control over what you can and can't do on "your" property.

When you buy a home in an area controlled by a HOA you sign a contract or an agreement to abide by the rules governing the HOA. Locally a HOA prevented a local home owner from painting the front door on their house a certain color because the other home owners found it offensive.

What is the problem? Don't buy a house in an area governed by a HOA or move out. It's not like you weren't aware of potential problems when you signed the agreement. Some folks seem to want the benefits of a HOA without the responsibilities that come with it.

When people fight this type of stuff, the lawyers are the only people who come out ahead.

[Carlos Alden]

I could not live with a HOA governing things like this. Things might get a little funky, but I don't mind a purple house with yellow trim.

I agree with the suggestions made that you want to lobby to amend the rules. I think you might have to limit the number of birds to 4, though, which is what our city ordinance is. Chickens do make noise and they can smell, and it offends some people. Not saying they're in the right, just saying.

I like your nuclear option. I think it's important to bring up the reasons why the ban is in place - obviously the noise and the smell - and then talk about the dogs as comparison. You may well be able to effect a change this way, through common sense.

Depending on your statesman skills you might want to contact the holdout complainer beforehand and see what their issue is specifically. You might have a chance to defuse their defiance this way, like by offering to cut down the number of birds you mil has.

Then after the meeting have a big fried chicken potluck!

Carlos

[Mark Patoka]

Sounds like your best bet is to try to change or amend the HOA rules, assuming that the county ordinances are OK. HOA rules are there for a reason and everyone signed on to them but there should be a procedure to change them and it sounds like you already have a majority vote in your favor.

Just remember that any change you make opens the door for others to now follow along so be careful how it's written and think about putting specific limits in as Carlos suggests.

[Heather Thompson]

Eric,

My husband and I live in a townhome and have a dreaded HOA, I have had a vegetable garden for five years, last spring they told me I had to pull my garden and plant grass. They also stated that grills were not allowed due to local fire ordinances and needed to be disposed of, quick call to city hall and the county and there are no such ordinances. There was the mandatory HOA meeting and I presented the info from city hall and county, grills stay. Then comes the vegetable garden issue, my neighbors were very vocal in support of my garden, when the harvest is good all benefit.
Another tactic you may consider is that your MIL is doing her part to fight industrial farming which has devistating affects on the envioronment, economy, consumers and other countries. Get a copy of the movie Food Inc and watch it, you will have a lot of ammunition to support that perspective. I have watched you discuss other sensitive points in other threads and I think that you will do well as her Perry Mason, please let us know the outcome.

Heather

[Belinda Barfield]

Eric,

I am surprised that the city allows chickens. One thing to consider, your mother-in-law could be looking at a lawsuit down the road. If one of her neighbors contracts histoplasmosis (no matter whether from her chickens, other birds, or bats) it could be hard to prove her chickens didn't cause the infection. I know that may sound extreme, but you never know.

[Jim Rimmer]

I mean this in good spirits and wish you well in whatever path you take...but the HOA rules that your MIL signed when she bought the property say no chickens. So, no chickens. Most HOAs are not open to rules modifications as it leads down the slippery slope; who wants to change what next.

Again, I don't mean this in a negative sense (and I dislike HOAs myself) but she knew the rules when she moved in.

Good luck to you in your case.

[Roger Jensen]

I agree (and I also don't mean this negatively). You can't pick and choose what rules you want to follow, and of course ignorance of one of the rules is not an excuse.

On a bleaker note, humane societies across america are being overwhelmed with chickens. Folks are deciding they don't like to raise them; plus chickens lay eggs for about two or three years but live over four years. In the old days the chicken would be butchered and eaten, but now they get dumped off at the humane society. I suspect more towns will be banning chickens...

Good luck - not sure how you can win this one.

Roger

[JohnMichael Schlim]

the CR&R's probably don't allow any pet that disturbs other unit owners. So that argument wont get very far. HOA's are bound by state laws. Google Nevada HOA Law and you will find some assistance. For example in Nevada a majority (at least 3) of the seats of the board must be unit owners. If you have 29 of 30 on your side then the majority of the board is already on your side and so at the meeting have an amendment made to the by laws. However A HOA is a legal entity that can fine, and even foreclose on your home. If your gonna fight then you should hire an attorney to represent you. HOA's do not play around they take their limited responsibility and authority VERY serious. Good luck!

[Horton Brasses]

We own a condo with a real PITA association and board. One person can make everything a living h***. At least in our case.

Generally there are a whole host of bylaws relating to changing the rules. In our association a certain number of people are required to support a motion to vote on a change in the bylaws. You need to read the rules, but you should be able to make a motion to change the bylaws and then hold a vote (two votes for this process). This is probably better than going nuclear which is not likely to make it any easier for your MIL and seems likely turn people against her. You may discover that all of those 29 people who are OK with the chickens don't really want them and just put up with it, particularly if they were put on the spot and didn't want to offend your MIL. When it comes down to actually changing the rules they may feel quite differently-or not in which case your job will be easy. She did move in willingly so it seems like changing the rules might be better than disobeying them or going nuclear.

We live in a newer development with a fairly loose covenant. Because we were the first house we never signed the covenant we are technically not bound. One of the rules is no chickens. Not that I want them.

Fresh eggs are almost a completely different food than the corn fed antibiotic pumped ones we buy in the store. They yolks are a different color and texture. The flavor is amazing and they are better for you to boot.

[Scott Loven]

"PS -- Personally, I think it's ridiculous to keep chickens when eggs are a buck a dozen. But it makes her happy, and I've got to come up with a strategy. "

Ya, its like those people who spend thousands of dollars on tools, shops and wood, not to mention all the time, to make furniture when they could just buy it at Walmart and be done with it.
There is a big movement in the US to bring chicken raising back to urban life.
http://urbanchickens.org/
http://www.urbanchickens.net/
http://urbanchickenunderground.blogspot.com/

[Jim O'Dell]

Hey Eric...try your best. If you don't win, you can always have your Mom bring the chickens over to your house and she could come over every morning and take care of them. Jim.

[Bill Arnold]

We've lived in HOA and Non-HOA areas. HOAs serve a purpose and, if you don't like the rules, then move somewhere else.

[Jerome Hanby]

I don't doubt a word you say, but that this is a problem shows how silly people are. Where do people think chicken comes from? If you have a problem eating your own chickens, you may need your head examined. I recall my Grandmother wringing one's neck, chopping off the head, then letting it run around until it dropped (much like politicians, chickens don't really use their heads for much). As I recall, it was pretty tasty. I wouldn't want to butcher my own poultry, much like I don't want to dig my own ditches, it's too much like work, but meat is meat. And those "home grown" chickens probably had a much better (and longer) life than any that ended up at Tyson.

plus chickens lay eggs for about two or three years but live over four years. In the old days the chicken would be butchered and eaten, but now they get dumped off at the humane society.
Roger

[Carlos Alden]

I don't doubt a word you say, but that this is a problem shows how silly people are. Where do people think chicken comes from? If you have a problem eating your own chickens, you may need your head examined. I recall my Grandmother wringing one's neck, chopping off the head, then letting it run around until it dropped (much like politicians, chickens don't really use their heads for much).

Then there's the story of Mike the Headless Chicken, who refused to die. PURPORTEDLY true.

http://www.miketheheadlesschicken.org/index.php

Carlos

[Dave Schreib]

Work on changing the rules. Though MIL will have to be prepared for the possibility that they will allow some other critters to move in next to her, and depending what those critters are - she may not be happy. Children for example.

I think you were kidding but I think the worst thing to do would be to threaten to go nuclear. Your mother in law will go from being that "nice, but different, older woman who really loved her chickens. To "that nasty lady who threaten to make everybody miserable unless she was allowed to break the rules that everybody lived by." I dont think I she will want to spend her golden years being known as that person.

But your primary goal should always be to keep the chickens and the MIL from moving in with you! I know this from experience so do whatever you have to do.