How to choose between a #4 and #4 1/2 ?

[Richard Niemiec]

My best advice is to get yourself a fettled vintage Stanley #4, much less of an investment while you use and get used to using it (maybe add a Hock iron, or then again, not), then consider the upgrade to a #4 1/2, as there's nothing you can do with a #4 1/2 that you can't do with a #4, and an old Stanley in good shape will run rings around an Anant, and in my experience be 95% of a LN or LV (not that I am dissing either, I own several LN and LV planes, but not a #4, or a #3 for that matter, from these fine companies). Bevel up smoothers that are vintage are very pricey due to collectors so I consider LN and LV the only reasonable source for these. I can only imagine what you've been going through with the Anant. Oh, and learn how to sharpen irons, well.

[Richard Niemiec]

I There is no used market to speak of where I live so that is not much of an option and after my experience rebuilding the Anant I'm ready to buy a handplane that is ready to use.

Oh, forgot to add you should watch the classifieds below, and the swap and sell over on WoodNet; plenty of planes for sale by reputable folk who have given the tools a once-over in both from time to time; its slow now likely due to the holidays.

[Tom Jones III]

One of the best parts of my experience with the Anant is that it forced me to learn more about how the hand plane works so that I could beat it into submission. It also forced me to become good at sharpening! I'm very happy I started with that b/c it really forced me to learn.

[Brian Kent]

Last year I asked people what is the "The Best Smooth Plane You Have Ever Used"?
http://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=85673

You should probably buy one of each of the planes listed and then make your choice.

Here is a compilation of responses:

We now have a list of 41 "Best Smooth Planes You Have Ever Used" with about 36 planes or variations of planes included!

Bridge City CT-12
Coffin
Coffin
Clark and Williams York Pitch
ECE 711
ECE Primus
HNT Gordon
HNT Gordon - T1 HSS blade
Japanese Plane
Japanese Plane
Japanese Plane - Shop=made with help of Inomoto-san
Japanese Plane - Yamamoto 120mm
Krenov
Krenov-made smoother
Lee Valley Bevel Up Smoother
Lee Valley Bevel Up Smoother
Lee Valley Bevel Up Smoother
Lee Valley Veritas Low Angle Smoother
Lie-Nielsen #4
Lie-Nielsen 4-1/2
Lie-Nielsen 64 Low Angle Jack - 36° iron
Light Woodie
Marcou Infill
Marcou S15
Mathieson Infill
Millers Falls #14
Mujingfang
Norris A5 Infill
Norris A5 style Infill - Shop-made
Norris Infill
Ron Brese
Ron Brese Kit
Sauer and Steiner Infill
Shepherd Infill kit - Shop-made
St James Bay Infill Kit
Stanley Bedrock 603 - refinished
Stanley #4 type 7 with Lie-Nielsen .125 blade
Stanley with Hock Blade
Stanley#3 Infill Smoother
Steve Knight Padouk Coffin
Wards Master #4

"The best plane is one you have learned and tuned to it's max."
Steve Knight

[Tony Zaffuto]

Lots of sound advice already, but I'll put in my two cents anyways!

I have a lot of smoothers (planes in general), and the order of choice (for smoothers) is my Clifton #3 , then my LN #4 with a high angle frog OR my LV BUS (for which I have a regular and high angle blade, plus a toothed blade, which is used far more than I ever thought).

Why the #3 first? Don't really know, except maybe it fits my hand better?

[Hank Knight]

Tom,

As others have said, I think the answer to your question is strictly a matter of personal perference. I'll give you my experience for what it's worth.

I didn't own a 4 1/2 until about a year ago. My favorite smoother was a 604 bedrock that I had tuned and upgraded the blade and chipbreaker. It's a wonderful plane and it was my favorite smoother. Then I got involved in a project that required smoothing some large surfaces of very curly cherry. Never one to miss a chance to buy a new tool, I siezed the opportunity and ordered a LN 4 1/2 with a York pitch (50 degree) frog. I was, and continue to be, very impressed with the plane, and it is now my dedicated smoother of choice.

I still use my 604 a lot. It is a very versitile tool. I use it for small smoothing tasks and for all those many, many occasions where just one or two swipes with a sharp plane are all that needed to put things right. I don't pull out my 4 1/2 unless the job calls for serious smoothing of large surfaces. That's where the 4 1/2 shines.

Since you don't already own a high quality #4, I think Richard's advice above is excellent: Start with a good #4 and, when you're ready, add a 4 1/2 later. The #4 will do everything a 4 1/2 will do and you'll use it a lot where you wouldn't ordinarily pull out the great big 4 1/2. The #4 is a very versitle plane - that's why there are so many of them in the wild. When you get around to adding the 4 1/2, you will enjoy the larger plane, and I don't think you'll find that it is superfluous or that it duplicates the #4.

I don't agree with the idea that hand size should dictate your choice. My hands are small and I don't find any particular advantage or disadvantage in using either plane because of my small hands. As for bevel-up vs. bevel-down, I think that's a matter pf personal preference also. I own a LN bevel up smoother. I seldom use it - not because it's a bad plane, it's not -but because I just prefer the traditional bevel down smoothers. I have nothing against bevel up planes. In fact my bevel up jack has become my favorite plane of all, and I have no doubt that those who prefer bevel up smoothers get excellent performance from them. Again, its a personal preference thing.

It's your choice. Go with your gut. You'll be happy with with your choice, whatever it is.

My $.02

Hank

[jerry nazard]

Tom,

This blog from Chris Schwarz just showed up in my mailbox. Check it out:
http://blog.woodworking-magazine.com...+Than+New.aspx

-Jerry

[Larry Marshall]

Seems to me that you need to answer the "what will I use it for" question and analyze it carefully. You said you were looking for a smoother. Will that be its only function? Lots of people like 4 1/2s and more weight because they use these planes for things besides smoothing and use sandpaper for what some call smoothing with a plane. If it's true smoothing that you're after, I'm on the side of those who believe that smaller/lighter are very beneficial. I use a #3 myself for this purpose. By contrast, if you expect to face boards with the plane, the 4 1/2, or maybe even a 5 1/2 might be more appropriate.

Cheers --- Larry

[Jim R Edwards]

I say get both!

[Zach England]

here are a Stanley 4 and LN 4 1/2 side-by-side for comparison. The LN has a higher angle frog, which gives a bit more room between the tote and top of the blade.