[OP]
Member
In particular, would you consider MDF acceptable for painted cabinet faces/drawer fronts? I have a friend who has a rather high end (or at least expensive) home. All the trim, molding, etc. is painted MDF. I've always considered MDF to be an inferior material, though it does have some advantages such as stability and flatness. Is this just prejudice/snobishness on my part?
Member
I've used MDF in most of my projects so far.
It looks like the cabinets are frame and panel and the caucuses are plywood. So just the panels are MDF?
If that's the case, then I think MDF is a great choice. Flat, cheap, and takes paint well. If it's used anyplace where its edge is exposed, then I don't think much of it. It's too easy to dent (plus a pain to get sealed before painting).
Member
I liked his logic: flat and dimensionally stable.
So far, I've liked his results, too.
I went with decent ply for the faces on my kitchen cabinets, but ... in hindsight ... would likely have been okay, either way.
Contributor
In the way he's using it I don't mind it. I'm using this series for ideas for my future kitchen refacing and although I had the same initial reaction when I heard MDF I've warmed to the concept. Although I probably won't use MDF on mine as current plan is all flat face fronts, but we'll see when that project gets closer.
Contributor
MDF has earned it's place. Norm has chosen a material which can readily be had from Borgs everywhere, for a project which can be undertaken by a great amount of folks who do not own a jointer and planer. And painted cabinets are trendy at the moment.
MDF is cheap, consistent, and machinable with @home tools. Negatives are that MDF is heavy and dislikes moisture. Personally, I hate to see any decent hardwood covered with paint! But, humble MDF can be coated with the opaque finish of choice as an actual improvement.
MDF lends itself to cookie-cutter manufactured cabinets. High end kitchens employ MDF because the public permits it. There is huge profit from an attractive MDF kitchen. Even these do not come cheap! And, the price point of solid cherry cabinetry is totally out of reach for many! The idea of *kitchen as show piece* is relatively new. Stately old mansions had a very perfunctory kitchen area, visited only by servants/staff. The dining room was the show piece!
Many prospective homeowners have no clue about what constitutes quality cabinets. If *she* likes the kitchen color/layout, then *he* is happy too! The popularity of painted kitchens comes and goes. Light/dark comes and goes. But IMO solid natural wood is always IN! I will limit my use of MDF to shop cabinets or jigs and fixtures.
Last edited by Chip Lindley; 01-25-2010 at 3:30 PM.
[/SIGPIC]Necessisity is the Mother of Invention, But If it Ain't Broke don't Fix It !!
Contributor
Are you referring to the kitchen Norm builds on the $100 dollar DVD set? I was abouy to lay out money for the set as a resource for my first kitchen cabinet job, but I plan to use plywood boxes and real wood face frames and doors. Is the joinery going to different using MDF vs wood face frames and doors? If so, I'll save the hundred bucks forego the DVD set.
Scott Vroom
I started with absolutely nothing. Now, thanks to years of hard work, careful planning, and perseverance, I find I still have most of it left.
Member
Scott, the series is a great resource. IIRC, he only uses MDF for fields of doors. The face frames and door frames are wood. For boxes he used prefinished maple ply.
Contributor
Hi Matt, thanks. I'm going to go ahead and get Norm's DVD set...I need all the help I can get!! I followed your cabinet project with great interest...I hope mine turns out as well....you did a great job!
Scott
Scott Vroom
I started with absolutely nothing. Now, thanks to years of hard work, careful planning, and perseverance, I find I still have most of it left.
Member
The reason IKEA is so popular. Their cabinets are nothing more than the knock down furniture you see at Wal-Mart.Originally Posted by Chip Lindley
Ever watch the house hunter shows on TV. The buyers never ask, Are the walls framed with 2x4 or 2x6? or are the cabinets solid wood/ It's all about what the paint color is or the lighting.
"Remember back in the day, when things were made by hand, and people took pride in their work?"
- Rick Dale
Member
MDF is flat, dimensionally stable AND paint goes down beautifully on it. If I wanted painted cabinets MDF for fields and dawer fronts would not bother me. Kitchen cabinets just don't get left in homes long enough to be remotely considered heirloom. If they get repurposed due to sizing issues they usually end up in garages et al. There is just no point in covering nice hardwood in paint especially when it will not look any better when the job is finished, well except for snob appeal.
Member
Thanks. Stay tuned for the sequel coming later this year.
And by the way, all the door panels in that project are cherry veneer MDF "plywood" which was way nicer than any 1/4" veneer core ply I've ever used.
Member
I watched this series with great interest being the kitchen is one of the things on my ever growing list. The MDF as panels does not pose a problem to me for painted doors (as others have said, including Norm, it is stable and takes paint well). I did learn something right off the bat with the boxes where he cut the groove for biscuits, I will certainly use that method rather than trying to line them up. Not the first, or last thing Norm has taught me as a new woodworker.
Member
IMHO most folks care only that the kitchen cabinets look nice, are durable, and that they have smooth function. The hardware (soft-closes, full extensions, etc.) is far more important than the material. It's only us wood snobs who care.
This is why Ikea kitchens are so popular among designers and contractors for high-end kitchens. High-end urban condos and lofts almost exclusively use Ikea or similar cabinets, not necessarily straight out of the box but with appropriate aesthetic hacks. Candice Olson (Divine Design, HGTV) uses Ikea carcasses with custom wood fronts in her kitchen makeovers. The material of the carcasses is most normal folks' last concern, and rightfully so IMHO. It has almost nothing to do with how that kitchen is going to function over time.
Member
Can I chime in. In some situations MDF is a better choice like many engineered products. Seems to me about the same argument for 8" oak subflooring in older homes. It is a finer product, but lets face it, does it offer any advantage over modern Adventec flooring? NO. In fact the stability and water resistance make it better. In this case I think the dimensionaly stable part makes it a better product for this regardless of cost.
Member
MDF and other engineered wood products are an efficient use of limited resources. It's wasteful to use hardwood on a cabinet that's going to be painted (and whose useful life is likely only decades long, if that).
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