...for Scarey Sharpeners... MKII Power..

[David Rose]

You rat! You beat me. Maybe one of the moderators saw it first and gave you "auto demerits". Well, we can *hope*!

David

Question mark?? What question mark?? hehehe...you can't copy the Title of a thread over....

[Scott Quesnelle]

As much as I would love to support a fine canadian company like Veritas. I just can't.

Luckily, the local library had a book which contained plans for a sharpener which is a dead ringer for the MK II. Its a pretty old book, so it predates the MKII.

I will try to take some pics tonight and post them.

All the version I have is a 1/3 hp motor with a 2" pulley on it. This drives a belt connected to a 6" pulley. So you get a 1:3 speed reduction. brings it from 1750 to 583.

The pulley is connected to a shaft. The shaft has an 8" aluminum plate on the other end. The plate was bought from busy bee tools, its a replacement for a belt/disc sander.

Sitting on this with pegs are mdf discs that have the sandpaper mounted on them.

The entire thing is mounted inside a plywood box and I use a sharpening box as a means of holding my jig. This same sharpening box is used on my scary sharp paper.

Its really handy for getting the lower grits done and getting an initial bevel formed.

Scott

[David Rose]

Scott, what is the reason for you only using it on the lower grits? I don't clean up many old planes and have only once dropped a blade that left enough damage to really need a rework. If your sharpener or the MkII are primarily suitable to only coarse work, I may be spinning my wheels on this tool. Or maybe I should ask what you consider lower grits in this case.

David

As much as I would love to support a fine canadian company like Veritas. I just can't.

Luckily, the local library had a book which contained plans for a sharpener which is a dead ringer for the MK II. Its a pretty old book, so it predates the MKII.

I will try to take some pics tonight and post them.

All the version I have is a 1/3 hp motor with a 2" pulley on it. This drives a belt connected to a 6" pulley. So you get a 1:3 speed reduction. brings it from 1750 to 583.

The pulley is connected to a shaft. The shaft has an 8" aluminum plate on the other end. The plate was bought from busy bee tools, its a replacement for a belt/disc sander.

Sitting on this with pegs are mdf discs that have the sandpaper mounted on them.

The entire thing is mounted inside a plywood box and I use a sharpening box as a means of holding my jig. This same sharpening box is used on my scary sharp paper.

Its really handy for getting the lower grits done and getting an initial bevel formed.

Scott

[Tom LaRussa]

If your sharpener or the MkII are primarily suitable to only coarse work, I may be spinning my wheels on this tool.

Speaking of spinning wheels, does anybody have an old record player? I've been thinking ... cut out an MDF "record," glue some sandpaper onto it, and away you go.

[David Rose]

Tom, what is a record player? Seriously, I don't think they had enough power to resist the friction. Tiny motors and I think the belts were designed to slip. I can't really remember, but this is what is "in memory" somewhere...

David

Speaking of spinning wheels, does anybody have an old record player? I've been thinking ... cut out an MDF "record," glue some sandpaper onto it, and away you go.

[Tom LaRussa]

Luckily, the local library had a book which contained plans for a sharpener which is a dead ringer for the MK II. Its a pretty old book, so it predates the MKII.

I have no doubt that it predates the MKII.

IMHO, all of these rotary sharpeners are just dumbed down copies of gemstone faceting machines that have been around for decades. Here are a few examples of what I'm referring to:

A cheap one, the Graves, goes for nearly $1300. http://www.facetingmachines.com/graves.shtml

A mid-level single-user, the Facetron, retails for about $2K. http://www.facetingmachines.com/facetron.shtml

A really nice unit, the Ultra Tec, goes for nearly $3K. http://www.facetingmachines.com/ultratecmachine.shtml (I used to have one of these.)

In gem cutting the laps, (cutting discs), must be optically flat, the machine must hold the stone at precisely a given angle, (within a few ten-thousandths of a degree), and polishing to 100K grit is pretty much the minimum for the harder and/or more expensive stones.

Compared to one of those puppies the MKII is a toy.

[David Rose]

And at the prices of the "real things", I would not likely get to experience one. I am grateful for the dumbed down one.

David

I have no doubt that it predates the MKII.

IMHO, all of these rotary sharpeners are just dumbed down copies of gemstone faceting machines that have been around for decades. Here are a few examples of what I'm referring to:

A cheap one, the Graves, goes for nearly $1300. http://www.facetingmachines.com/graves.shtml

A mid-level single-user, the Facetron, retails for about $2K. http://www.facetingmachines.com/facetron.shtml

A really nice unit, the Ultra Tec, goes for nearly $3K. http://www.facetingmachines.com/ultratecmachine.shtml (I used to have one of these.)

In gem cutting the laps, (cutting discs), must be optically flat, the machine must hold the stone at precisely a given angle, (within a few ten-thousandths of a degree), and polishing to 100K grit is pretty much the minimum for the harder and/or more expensive stones.

Compared to one of those puppies the MKII is a toy.

[Scott Quesnelle]

Scott, what is the reason for you only using it on the lower grits? I don't clean up many old planes and have only once dropped a blade that left enough damage to really need a rework. If your sharpener or the MkII are primarily suitable to only coarse work, I may be spinning my wheels on this tool. Or maybe I should ask what you consider lower grits in this case.

I use it mainly on the lower grits <400. I find that this is where I spend the most of my time. Once I have removed the previous wear bevel and have a good clean edge, then it only takes 10 seconds per grit or so to climb up to 2000. (I should probably get some 5, and .5 micron paper from LV next time I am there).

Since I am only spending 10 seconds per grit it is much faster for me to just use non powered methods for the higher grits. It takes me probably 10 seconds just to change a platter. Stop the machine, lift the old one off, put the new one on, start it up. and sharpen.

If I was doing alot of gang sharpening, like lets say... 120 marking knives, then it would be worth it to change grits, sharpen all the blades at that grit then move up. Usually though I am only doing 1 or 2 blades at a time.

I think you can use the MKII for doing the higher grits, and lots of people do, its just for me the higher grits are the least amount of work so I don't find it necessary.

For my neander shop it also does double duty as a disc sander for the odd thing that I need one of those for.

Scott

[David Rose]

I understand. Thank you.

It is often difficult to determine how *I* will use a tool based on other's experiences. But that is still better than making a "cold turkey" purchase with only manufacturer's claims to support it.

Do you just freehand through the finer grits? It takes me more than 10 seconds to mount the jig.

David

I use it mainly on the lower grits <400. I find that this is where I spend the most of my time. Once I have removed the previous wear bevel and have a good clean edge, then it only takes 10 seconds per grit or so to climb up to 2000. (I should probably get some 5, and .5 micron paper from LV next time I am there).

Since I am only spending 10 seconds per grit it is much faster for me to just use non powered methods for the higher grits. It takes me probably 10 seconds just to change a platter. Stop the machine, lift the old one off, put the new one on, start it up. and sharpen.

If I was doing alot of gang sharpening, like lets say... 120 marking knives, then it would be worth it to change grits, sharpen all the blades at that grit then move up. Usually though I am only doing 1 or 2 blades at a time.

I think you can use the MKII for doing the higher grits, and lots of people do, its just for me the higher grits are the least amount of work so I don't find it necessary.

For my neander shop it also does double duty as a disc sander for the odd thing that I need one of those for.

Scott

[Scott Quesnelle]

David,

Take a look at the sharpening box shown on this site. I have something very similar mounted on both the MKII clone, and for my scary sharp sheets. The distance from the top of the abrasive to the sidewalls is the same on both of them. Because of that I don't have to adjust the jig at all. I actually have considered getting thin pieces of brass shim to mount on the sidewalls. This would allow me to do a micro bevel.


This isn't my site, but shows the tool quite nicely.
http://www.jhml.org/tools/

Take a look at the old tools archive at www.oldtools.org, do an advanced search with sharpening box in as the subject title.

I only have the one dowel/jig but it is easy to make more.

The other bonus of doing the higher grits unpowered is that its already setup to remove the burr at the end.

Scott

[David Rose]

Thanks Scott! So simple yet so efficient! I plan to use the idea one way or another.

David

David,

Take a look at the sharpening box shown on this site. I have something very similar mounted on both the MKII clone, and for my scary sharp sheets. The distance from the top of the abrasive to the sidewalls is the same on both of them. Because of that I don't have to adjust the jig at all. I actually have considered getting thin pieces of brass shim to mount on the sidewalls. This would allow me to do a micro bevel.


This isn't my site, but shows the tool quite nicely.
http://www.jhml.org/tools/

Take a look at the old tools archive at www.oldtools.org, do an advanced search with sharpening box in as the subject title.

I only have the one dowel/jig but it is easy to make more.

The other bonus of doing the higher grits unpowered is that its already setup to remove the burr at the end.

Scott

[Wendell Wilkerson]

Scott,

Do you ever have trouble keeping the blade square with the sharpening box? It is looks like it would be easy to skew the dowel while sharpening if you are not careful that's why I ask the question. I bought a big dowel in order to build one, but it hasn't quite made it to the top of my project list. I was thinking of rabbeting the top of the sharpening box (when I build it) to capture the dowel so you cannot skew it easily. I can see where skewing wouldn't be an issue with plane blades. I am really more concerned with narrow chisels (1/2" or less). I can't seem to sharpen them straight. The eclipse stye jig I have rocks too much with narrow chisels.

Wendell

[David Rose]

Wendell, would it matter if you skewed the dowel? As long as both ends stayed on the box, I don't think it would change anything. Keeping a narrow chisel consistently flat in the dowel sounds like more of a problem to me. Maybe inletting a coin in the bottom half and filing it flat would give more "uncompressable" support?

David

Scott,

Do you ever have trouble keeping the blade square with the sharpening box? It is looks like it would be easy to skew the dowel while sharpening if you are not careful that's why I ask the question. I bought a big dowel in order to build one, but it hasn't quite made it to the top of my project list. I was thinking of rabbeting the top of the sharpening box (when I build it) to capture the dowel so you cannot skew it easily. I can see where skewing wouldn't be an issue with plane blades. I am really more concerned with narrow chisels (1/2" or less). I can't seem to sharpen them straight. The eclipse stye jig I have rocks too much with narrow chisels.

Wendell

[Scott Quesnelle]

Wendell,

Skewing is not that big of a problem. The dowel doesn't stick much past the edges of the box so if I skew it too much then it will fall off.

The length of the dowel helps you keep it from skewing as well. Much easier to see that it is skewed than a little 1" jig.

Saying that skewing is usually not the reason you get an out of square edge. Pressure is. Especially on narrow stuff you can only get a few fingers on it. If this is your right hand for example, you are putting more force on one side rather than the other.

My suggestion to you is let up on the force you apply. The amount of force varies with the width of the blade. So 4x as much force for a 2" plane blade than a 1/2" chisel. I found that I was way to heavy handed when I was starting. Better to let the abrasive do the work than to try and ram it through the abrasive.

Will try and get some pics posted in the next day or so. Also if people want I can see if I have the name of the book around still.

[Adrian Wood]

Richard Kell also makes a jig for sharpening skewed blades, but I've only been able to find it at Dieter Schmid's Fine Tools and I don't want to pay the shipping costs from Germany.

Wendell

Wendell,
You can get the Richard Kell skew guide from www.europeanhandtools.com in Canada. I have dealt with them twice now, and found them quick to respond.

Adrian